To not want to go on holiday with friend due to her eating disorder?

[Backujij]

Or at least what I think is an eating disorder.

I go on holiday with a friend every so often, and she has asked me to join her on a city break later this month. I love her and usually enjoy her company, but her attitude to food has got to the point where I don’t want to go.

If I leave anything on my plate there is a huge fuss made about wasting food. She will have my leftover food boxed up and carry it around for the rest of the evening. Nothing wrong with that if it was substantial, but it’s even if it’s a few carrots or a couple of spoonfuls of soup, and she makes such a big thing of it, always with questions like ‘how much do you waste at home? You should keep anything you don’t finish at home and have it for your next meal until it’s gone’. On one occasion, she took back to our hotel a bit of pie I hadn’t finished, and had the filling for dinner one evening and the pastry the next, and refused to order any dinner while I ate because she’d had the leftovers.

She also decided exactly what restaurants we’re eating in before we arrive on holiday, and there is no leeway. She will quiz the waiters about the food and their suggestions for a lengthy time to find out if it’s local food etc before she orders, and it’s embarrassing. She has woken me up in the morning to show me the menu of where we’re eating that night. She makes a huge fuss of having to have exactly what she wants to eat at exactly where she wants to eat, and never ever consults me. If I offer up alternatives she’ll say (huffily) ‘well we can go there but no, I won’t be eating there. I want something healthier/more local/less expensive/not as touristy’ etc.

Sometimes she’ll come to restaurants she hasn’t chosen, refuse to eat, then ask if she can have people’s leftovers when they’ve finished.

She got so thin at one point that she was hospitalised with exhaustion and told to lay off exercise for a while. I have never asked her about whether she thinks she has an eating disorder, although she did say on our last holiday that she did get too thin at one point.

She knows she’s controlling about food and has asked if it bothers me. I have said it does, but she never changes.

I know that she’s probably ill, but WIBU to refuse to go on holiday with her any more? It’s a shame because otherwise I adore her company and have known her many years, and we live on opposite sides of the country so we really only get to see each other when we go away.

AIBU to stop holidaying with her because of this when it is likely she can’t help it? Should I go and try and be supportive?

Omg - @pussycatunpickingcrossesagain YOU are SO rude not OP’s friend

No I definitely wouldn’t be spending my hard earned money or time on a person who guilt trips people and sounds absolutely horrendous.

@KneadingKitty

Eating disorders are often linked with undiagnosed neurodiversity, which in itself leads to trauma for many. Trauma itself can also be the root.

When I first read it I thought that it maybe that she grew up in poverty and had developed a thing about food and waste. Perhaps her parents had been strict about waste because they were poor and were too headstrong with it and caused a problem for her. Obviously I don't know, just thinking out loud I guess as it's quite conflicting behaviour to be so concerned about other people's leftovers but then hardly eat and become too thin.

I understand how you’d draw that conclusion, but that’s definitely not the case here. She grew up well off, and remains well off now.

She started a diet about ten years ago, but just a fad diet and I thought nothing of it. She was a ‘normal’ weight then, about a size 12. Then she got into exercising. And then it just developed into an absolute obsession, which becomes obviously worse every time I see her.

Eating Disorders are a serious illness
They are very difficult for the sufferer to live with
And those around them
They aren’t choosing to be annoying
They are trying to cope / survive the only way they can manage
They need specialist help to overcome this very difficult disease
If any of you come across someone in real
Life with an eating disorder
PLEASE be compassionate like you would if someone had a physical disability !!!!!!

That rant not directed at OP - OP sounds like a good friend to this lady

Oh God no that sounds exhausting. Holidays are supposed to be relaxing. I wouldn't go.

I love her and usually enjoy her company, but her attitude to food has got to the point where I don’t want to go

Tell her exactly that.
And say you're not able to relax and enjoy the holiday because of everything revolving around food.

I wouldn't be going.

With her having had her first not long ago I'd be concerned she is more vulnerable than ever. Having children really exacerbated my mental illness, it made me so poorly.

Agree with others that she will need to be spoken to gently, but I don't think you have to go on holiday with her and be miserable out of any sort of pity or obligation either. You've been honest and said her behaviour bothers you in the past so she shouldn't be too surprised, but with hormones, sleep deprivation etc she might not deal with it like she might have before the baby.

I would explain kindly but firmly, why you feel unable to go on any more of these trips with her.
Obviously, you are making all the adjustments and it's spoiling your enjoyment of the time spent with her.
It appears to dominate every waking moment of her life AND yours, when you're together.
Explain that you'll support her in getting help but she must realise that she has a huge problem, you find it wearing and it completely destroys any excitement you may initially feel about meeting her.
If you don't do it and take a firm but kind stand, then you can only expect more of the same.

Calm down dear.

You're about 20 years late with this...

I have been quite ill with eating disorders in my time. While I am physically in a healthier place, I am the first to put my hand up and state that my relationship with food is very unhealthy. Eating disorders are all about control. She can control what she puts in her body, etc, but it really stresses her out when she can’t control what you do with your food, or push back when she tries to control where you’re going to eat. Being with someone in the grip of an eating disorder is as emotionally draining as going on holiday with someone who has just caught their partner cheating on them. From the time their eyes are open until they close again, almost all the dialogue will be food, themselves, food, other people eating, how they feel about other people eating, food, how it makes them feel, themselves, more food….
My advice is to be honest but kind. Let her know that you value your friendship with her, but feel that being subject to her controlling behaviour around food is embarrassing and stressful, and you think it would put too much strain on your friendship. Until she accepts that she has a problem and gets help for it, you are choosing to have separate holidays.

You shouldn't go. But don't pussy foot around the reason.

Her illness has taken over her life. Going with her would only encourage her to believe there isn't a problem.

The need for control is causing behaviour that is like addiction. The opposite of addiction is not sobriety (or a healthy relationship to food) but connection, true connection to her own body, and to the other people in her life.

She has lost that connection. She is treating you as a blank screen onto which she projects her anxieties and her need to control.

You do not have a friendship in any real sense of the word therefore. You are not a whole, real person to her. Her addiction has come between you. I infer from your posts that her H is struggling here for the same reason you are.

Tell her you sincerely hope she will be well again one day, and that you will be waiting for her with open arms when that day comes. Assure her that the people closest to her love her, but be clear to her that it is too painful for you to see her so lost and disconnected from the love you all have for her. Tell her there is help available, that your connection can be restored, and that she can take steps toward connection to herself and to others if she chooses.

You will have to accept that she may well be so invested in denial that she will choose not to.

If you ever go abroad you could try an all inclusive resort. Buffet selection - you can both get what you want - when you want.

But I would still have a degree of honesty about why you want to make this choice, tell her that you are finding it difficult and that you won't have her commenting on your food choices/amounts etc. It is off limits.

It sounds very much like it's all about controlling food in any way she can. It all sounds very exhausting.
Is she neurodiverse? I know many people with ASD can be regimented with preferences and rules

I'll never forget the time my friend supported me on our first group friends' holiday when I was suffering badly with an eating disorder.

It's important you spend time with her, but be open about the issue too , it will help you both. Don't pretend it's not happening, literally the worst thing people can do. It probably spiralled out of control because nobody has confronted her about it.

She's a human and needs help and support, especially from a friend. She isn't a menace to society. People on this thread are so vicious!!

It sounds to me like she might have something like OCD around food and if she's not in complete control over food then it causes her anxiety. I would be blunt and just ask what her deal with around food, give her your reasons for feeling this way, how it makes you feel. Hopefully she might open up to you about how she feels. Regardless of her problem though I think you both need to agree on some boundaries around food. For example you don't want to discuss or be questioned about leftovers and you don't want her to touch any of the left over food on your place. If she feels she can't do this then you might want to suggest you both eat separately and just meet up after meals

She sounds rude and controlling. Don't go.

If you want to see her and support her then I'd probably do a shorter trip e.g. 1 or 2 nights, not a full holiday.

I think if I wanted to address the holiday eating thing, I probably wouldn't try to discuss her own eating behaviours. I'd focus on how she tries to control what YOU eat and how it makes you feel, and that you need it to stop if you are going to eat out with her (which you would like to do as you otherwise really like her).

I have a friend who is also very controlling about where and what she eats - in a way she's very healthy but also borderline eating disorder I think. The difference is that she doesn't try to control what/where others eat. If I go out with her I eat what I like and she doesn't comment. That's the difference I think. It must be really hard for your friend, but being controlling towards other people isn't okay.

I think that the OP's friend might transfer her 'illness' (or whatever you want to call her problem with food) to her child and THST would not be a good idea. This needs tackling at the root cause It's bound to cause some kind of upset but that can't be helped. Until the friend realises the strain it puts on friendships and the ridiculous amounts of time spent obsessing about food, it's origins, the planning of where and when to eat specific foods, the waste, the eating of leftovers and carrying them around etc then things will never change and only SHE can do that. She needs professional help, in spades. It's a shadow over the friendship and up to the OP to make clear how much she values the friendship and how much the friend is destroying it by the constant food war. It's HER problem, not the OP's to mitigate everything SHE would like in order not to 'upset' her friend. In that respect, she's enabling the friend to carry on.

*THAT

I grew up with a parent with an ED. It has quite literally traumatised me, probably for life.

This is so hard for you and you’re being very kind and considerate posting here for advice.

The ED parent and I are now not on good terms, the control flowed over into all other areas of my life as a teenager and was absolutely unbearable.

You can have massive sympathy for the person suffering with the mental illness but also put up your own boundaries regarding how you want to be spoken to/treated/spend your time.

My advice would be to suggest maybe a weekend away instead? Probably only a few meals to deal with. You could still retain the friendship (assuming all is good in other areas and it’s the eating out that’s an issue?) and if she asks why not a longer stay explain about how the food waste thing makes you uncomfortable.

Word of warning (as you probably already know) if you are honest about your reasons for not going the friendship will probably end. Most people with ED’s pride themselves on how well they can ‘hide’ their disorder and feel absolute rage when confronted.

Just wanted to add that I’ve witnessed the obsessive saving of leftovers as part of disordered eating before. My aunt sort of justified using up leftovers to herself as less guilty calories. For example, she wouldn’t eat anything at breakfast but would save any leftover pieces of toast and eat them cold later on. She didn’t have a particular liking for cold toast, it’s just that in her mind, there was less guilt associated with eating something that was leftover, rather than taking a piece fresh for herself (or, heaven forbid, expressly making a piece of toast just for her).

@Maray1967

Just tell her that a holiday should be relaxing - something to look forward to - but that you can’t do that if she will comment on what you’re eating or be very restrictive in selecting restaurants. If you do go, set down some ground rules. None of your leftover food is to be boxed up. I would have been very insistent with the waiter that it was not to be brought back. I went out for a group meal once where the party included a man who I was told tended to be quite controlling. He announced to us all that none of us would need a dessert. I made sure that I ordered a dessert for myself and DS1. I made it clear that I would pay extra for them. Nothing he could do - I hope it emboldened others who were likely to eat regularly with him not to put up with that level of control.

Oh God I used to work with someone like that man. We used to go out for group meals every month and this woman used to have this thing where she'd say none of us were having starters because she didn't want to wait for her main and she preferred pudding instead. It used to piss me off because everyone used to pander to her. We also used to have. Thing where we'd take it in turns to be the driver so people could have a drink but this woman point blank refused to ever drive

You are perfectly reasonable to want to support her as a friend but also not to take a holiday with her. I am sure you will be gentle with her when you explain.

I once went away with a group of women for 5 days to Barcelona. I knew one of them well but not the rest (tagging along) so hadn't realised the competitive undereating dynamic of their friendship group. Nothing on the behaviour scale you've described but it was miserable enough. I empathise with you.

@Mewski
The OP isn't a counsellor or a doctor and it's not fair IMO to expect her to sympathise, listen and subjugate her own feelings. The OP has already given in numerous times to the friends' way of dealing with food issues. Holidays should be memorable but not for having to put up with being woken up in the morning with a menu of what the friend plans to eat and when and where, altering anything anyone else wants to do so as not to upset her. There are TWO people in this friendship and just ONE is dictating the whole scenario, making the other (the OP) unhappy in the process. That makes the friend to be unthinking and selfish. She needs to be made aware of how much her problem affects others and it's no laughing matter, though she may make light of it.