Holiday dilemma.

[helbel34]

I have booked a weekend on a caravan park with my DH and our 2 children. I have asked my friend and her daughter to join us. I drive she doesn't.

Park is only 1 hour drive away, since we won't fit in my car I was expecting my friend to possibly to get the train and I couldn't collect them at the station. We will be going after the kids finish school on the Friday so leaving at 3pm or so.

My friend has suggested that we could hire a 7 seater for the weekend so we could go together, I looked up the cost and it will be £300+, she suggested that the adults pay £100 each. So myself, DH and DF.

Considering it would only cost is £30 in petrol in our own car for the trip, I really don't want to pay £200 + petrol. Considering we are paying for the caravan.

After reading another thread tonight I am wondering if I'm been unreasonable.

See, I read posts like this and think why?! Why would you ask someone who didn’t drive to share a small caravan for a holiday. Maybe I’m a bitch though!

Who says it is a small caravan? Have some people never been inside a static caravan before, some are the same size as an average bungalow or flat and if it is a holiday let then it is likely to have a decent living/kitchen area as well as outdoor space.

My friend owns a 3 bed caravan on a holiday site and I'd say it is probably the same size as my 2 bed flat - the bedrooms don't have a huge amount of floor space that isn't taken up by the bed/storage but you only use them to sleep so it's not an issue.

Equally to the people wondering what they will do with regards to excursions, it's a weekend trip to a holiday park, the holiday is the excursion. I live not far from a Haven site and they have loads of stuff onsite to entertain everyone as the entire point is that you go there to have everything in one place. Even the local caravan site my friend's static is on (10 mins drive out of town) has a pool, clubhouse with activities during the week, a restaurant, and is just a short 5 minute walk to both a local nature reserve and a beach.

@Moneyhunter

I said that a taxi there and back probably won't be much more that £100 for her. If she’s prepared to pay the £100 for the hire car she can use the money for the price of the taxi surely.

That was my thinking. When she first suggested the 7 seater and I googled the cost. She wasn't keen on the taxi suggestion either. She doesn't want to travel at that time of night, its leaving at 3pm in May.

Surely she’ll be travelling at ‘that time of night’ whether she was in a car, on a train or in a taxi?!

Does she have any previous form for being a CF, @helbel34?

She doesn't want to travel at that time of night, its leaving at 3pm in May.

That sounds like the start of being a pain.

Do you think she’s hoping you’ll just suggest you take her DD (assuming there is space in your car) and give her the weekend to herself?

Yeah, this is starting to sound like a "no good deed left unpunished" kind of situation. It's really not your problem to solve.

I'd tend to say sorry it doesn't work for you, would have been fun to spend the weekend together.

@JustLyra

She doesn't want to travel at that time of night, its leaving at 3pm in May.

That sounds like the start of being a pain.

Do you think she’s hoping you’ll just suggest you take her DD (assuming there is space in your car) and give her the weekend to herself?

That's a good idea, It was more for the girls anyway.

That was my thinking. When she first suggested the 7 seater and I googled the cost. She wasn't keen on the taxi suggestion either. She doesn't want to travel at that time of night, its leaving at 3pm in May.

But she'll be travelling at that time regardless of whether it's on a train, in a taxi or in a car with you. I'd say you're not going to solve this one to her satisfaction and you're probably better to say 'ah that's a shame it won't work out as it would have been fun' and never invite her again.

She knows she cant drive and that your car would be full when she accepted.

I think that SOME non-drivers see cars as like a magic button or app that you get in and it sorts everything in 1 minute. Just because they're generally much more convenient and often quicker than public transport, that doesn't mean that they're cheap or take virtually no time at all.

These people also often see it like a small private bus, and thus figure that it 'comes with' the driver who's been arranged and paid for separately - essentially just an enabler for the transport to work for them, who would be there anyway.

It's a bit like electricians or builders who spend hours every day in (paying) customers' homes - and then they have 'friends' expecting them to 'just' rewire their house for them or 'just' build them a conservatory - all for free. They see it that you're just sharing your skill as a bit of a favour, without paying a moment's thought to the value of your own time, energies and schedules, much less the costs that will be incurred for materials and supplies that they also assume must be 'free' if you have the skill to use them.

To apend, SOME non-drivers also latch on to drivers and basically turn it into a parent/child scenario. They willingly play the part of the helpless dependant and just expect the driver to 'make it work' - as if you're infinitely more privileged and have access to a whole world of resources that they couldn't hope to have, rather than just an (expensive) car being the only difference between the two of you.

@fairylightsandwaxmelts well don't accept a kind offer if you don't want to get public transport, you sound extremely entities and think everyone should run around after you.

*entitled

[quote hellithurt]@fairylightsandwaxmelts well don't accept a kind offer if you don't want to get public transport, you sound extremely entities and think everyone should run around after you. [/quote]
Where did you get that from?

All I've said was that I would assume "Do you want to join us?" means "we'll travel together". Only on MN does that translate to "I'm entitled and expect people to run around after me"

In the real world, there's really nothing wrong with assuming you'll travel together if you're invited to go on holiday with other people.

If you're going to invite someone away with you, it's generally a good idea to plan things out before you dish out invitations. OP knows her friend doesn't drive and that there's no space in the car, so she should have said "I know you don't drive so we're happy to collect you from the station at X - unfortunately there's no room for you both in the car but we can squeeze in some of your luggage if necessary".

Most of MN seems to never communicate anything and then wonder why people misinterpret what they say, though.

A taxi, two trains (gawd) then a lift, with kiddy and luggage in tow sounds like a shitfest to me.

Re the luggage, it’s a weekend away not a polar expedition.

@fairylightsandwaxmelts but a simple thought is they've got five seats in their car. They're using four of them so I can't travel with them? It can't be difficult to under that?

But you think they should somehow accommodate you at their expense? Because you don't want to travel by train?

They've offered to collect from the station already!

The hatred for trains on this thread! I happily take 2 children on 2 trains for a day out (and 2 trains home again). We have a car but heading into London etc would use the train. This mum has 1 10yo and only needs to pack for 2 nights. A small wheely suitcase would do it. She just doesn't want to.

A taxi, two trains (gawd) then a lift, with kiddy and luggage in tow sounds like a shitfest to me.
Holiday for me, DH, 6 yo and toddler twins is bus/taxi, train which is sometimes own, sometimes two, bus with 10 days of luggage. Its fine
Its not ideal but no one is traumatised by it. No one is sobbing in a corner over how hard our lives are for getting to go on holiday.

@fairylightsandwaxmelts but a simple thought is they've got five seats in their car. They're using four of them so I can't travel with them? It can't be difficult to under that?

Maybe she just didn't think. Or maybe she thought they had two cars. I don't know the ins and outs of all my friends' cars and vehicles!

But you think they should somehow accommodate you at their expense? Because you don't want to travel by train?

But the expense doesn't change because they're driving down anyway. If they can all fit in one car, it makes sense to use one car and split the fuel bills, surely?

They've offered to collect from the station already!

I know that. I just think that if you're going to invite someone away with you on holiday, it's best to think about (and discuss) all the logistics beforehand, not wait until they've accepted the invitation and then say "well we assumed you'd do X".

Maybe she just didn't think. Or maybe she thought they had two cars. I don't know the ins and outs of all my friends' cars and vehicles!

Why would a family of 4 take two cars on a weekend away?!

[quote fairylightsandwaxmelts]**@fairylightsandwaxmelts but a simple thought is they've got five seats in their car. They're using four of them so I can't travel with them? It can't be difficult to under that?

Maybe she just didn't think. Or maybe she thought they had two cars. I don't know the ins and outs of all my friends' cars and vehicles!

But you think they should somehow accommodate you at their expense? Because you don't want to travel by train?

But the expense doesn't change because they're driving down anyway. If they can all fit in one car, it makes sense to use one car and split the fuel bills, surely?

They've offered to collect from the station already!

I know that. I just think that if you're going to invite someone away with you on holiday, it's best to think about (and discuss) all the logistics beforehand, not wait until they've accepted the invitation and then say "well we assumed you'd do X".[/quote]
What are you talking about the expense doesn't change if they travel together, they can't travel together and no I wouldn't think any one would forget that you can't fit six people in a five seater car!

I would invite someone away, but I'd grace them with enough intelligence to realise they can't travel in a car they don't fit in.

@Howshouldibehave

Maybe she just didn't think. Or maybe she thought they had two cars. I don't know the ins and outs of all my friends' cars and vehicles!

Why would a family of 4 take two cars on a weekend away?!

Exactly! Oh we will take a car just to accommodate you, because public transport is available but you don't want to get it!

@Howshouldibehave

Maybe she just didn't think. Or maybe she thought they had two cars. I don't know the ins and outs of all my friends' cars and vehicles!

Why would a family of 4 take two cars on a weekend away?!

As I said, maybe she didn't think. Or maybe she thought that as she'd been invited to go with them, they'd take both vehicles to fit everyone in.

What are you talking about the expense doesn't change if they travel together, they can't travel together and no I wouldn't think any one would forget that you can't fit six people in a five seater car!

I don't know the ins and outs of all my friends' vehicles and how many people fit in them - do you, really?

She just assumed that as she was invited on holiday, she would therefore travel with the people who invited her. That's really not an outlandish way to think in real life

I would invite someone away, but I'd grace them with enough intelligence to realise they can't travel in a car they don't fit in.

Again, how would they know how many people fit in the car(s) without it being discussed first?

Honestly, all this could have been avoided if OP discussed travel arrangements before making the invitation in the first place like a normal person does

@fairylightsandwaxmelts

What are you talking about the expense doesn't change if they travel together, they can't travel together and no I wouldn't think any one would forget that you can't fit six people in a five seater car!

I don't know the ins and outs of all my friends' vehicles and how many people fit in them - do you, really?

She just assumed that as she was invited on holiday, she would therefore travel with the people who invited her. That's really not an outlandish way to think in real life

I would invite someone away, but I'd grace them with enough intelligence to realise they can't travel in a car they don't fit in.

Again, how would they know how many people fit in the car(s) without it being discussed first?

Honestly, all this could have been avoided if OP discussed travel arrangements before making the invitation in the first place like a normal person does

It could've been avoided if the friend was not such a CF!

I think that as she's aware of seven seater cars, she knows how many seats are in the OPs car. Why would anyone assume that a family had a larger than average car? I'm sure if she's been invited away that she's been in OPs car at some stage as she's a non driver.

If you're invited on holiday you shouldn't become a burden!

But I just can't imagine inviting someone away with me knowing they don't drive and will need to faff about with trains and taxis.

But surely that applies to literally everything, not just holidays. I don't believe that people who don't drive only expect to be invited out for dinner/drinks/theatre/anything by people who are prepared to pick them up, certainly not in my experience.

I'd either give them a lift, or, if that wasn't possible, I'd make it crystal clear from the start that we'd need to meet at the destination and was that okay?

Wouldn't the onus be on the person with no transport to confirm travel arrangements?

OP - the fact that she's suggesting you shoulder the majority of her travel costs (as well as doing the driving!), she clearly has some CF tendencies. If you're happy to just take her daughter, I'd do that and remember not to offer again.

Fgs. She gets the train, it isn't that hard. My friend and I went away by train the other week. We both drive !