Why do men do this

[Tevion28]

Following on from the Ashling Murthy murder and the likes of the Sarah Everard I've been thinking alot as to why men do this and I can only think that they must have a deep hatred for women and feel threatened by us for some reason. What do you all think I'm not convinced that these men all have mental health problems myself.

Deep hatred in a world that lets men do whatever they fuck they want to women with very few consequences.

@AsYouWishButtercup

Deep hatred in a world that lets men do whatever they fuck they want to women with very few consequences.

I think that pretty much sums it up.

The one example I sum up to my husband whenever we discuss the differences between men and women is one day I was walking to work, 8am on a Monday, and some random bloke came up to me and whispered 'ANAL!'

Women do not do that.

In that moment, that man felt like he had power over me.

@Butteryflakycrust83 that’s absolutely horrific, and very intimidating! Poor you

I highly recommend a book called Signature Killers. It’s written by one of the FBI profilers that was represented on the Mindhunter Netflix series.

psychologists do generally class these sort of murders as “rage/retaliation” murders. These men generally have been enraged by a woman at some point in their lives (abusive mother or abusive father who makes the son believe mother is terrible & deserves what she gets). They then take this rage at one woman and take it out on womenkind.

You say you believe it’s intense hatred of women and not mental illness but I’d say having an intense hatred of someone because of their gender and gender alone is a sign that you are not mentally sound. Deplorable actions being caused by mental illness isn’t excusing those actions. Plenty of people are mentally unwell and have had horrifically abusive childhoods and don’t go on to murder anybody. But mental illness can be a reason, not an excuse.

Why is it never a mental illness when it race related? Why do women only ever get the dishonour of “oh it’s just some loon”. Why are we so afraid to say out loud that men are sexist?

Hatred, of women and probably themselves for wanting a woman. The incel mindset glamorisation of violence against women?

The power imbalance of physical strength. It’s why I am uncomfortable with super hero movies with characters such as Black Widow. The truth is, that even with training, a woman is not going to be able to beat up or overpower a man that easily.

So in the horrible example shared above, a woman can do nothing, we are powerless. And men get off on that.

The other thing that I hate, is knowing that when women share their experience of gross, repugnant, or violent male behaviours, a significant number of males will use those experiences for wank fodder.

I don’t even necessarily think it’s hatred of women specifically. It’s just that women are easy targets for violent men who want to hurt, kill or demonstrate power.

Women are also often seen as not fully human like men are, so it doesn’t matter as much. (Reference being the ongoing 2 women per week murdered over decades and absolutely nothing done).

Because their parents raised them that way, IME

I think it is a deepseated hatred of women, and that it is definitely worse in Briatin than say, in southern Europe, where generally speaking men actually like women. They may be accused of being "macho" but that is more to do with themselves as men than anything to do with women. Here, particularly among upper class males in the past, nothing seems to stand between a dislike, probably based on fear, and women who take the brunt of it.

You aren't being unreasonable in my view, ISTM that these sorts of crimes are clearly a result of hatred for and a twisted sexual view of women. I'd also add that men express violence ridiculously frequently. There's a woman killed by a man every 3 days or so in the UK. It's about one a day for male victims.

I think it's unhelpful to try to rationalise it as "hatred of women" or "feeling threatened" by them. The problem with this kind of diagnosis is women inevitably try to understand men from a female perspective. We can only judge things from our experiences, but men's experiences are not the same as women's.

Personally I think it's just that men are naturally more violent. On average, the average man will resort to violence before the average woman would have done in the same situation. It's not hatred of women, it's merely the product of evolution - men have historically needed to use violence in a way that women haven't. There are few legitimate uses for violence these days (boxing, army, police) but even then, there is no lawful outlet for sexual violence or abduction/murder. Even a couple of hundred years ago there was plenty of scope for the type of man who liked raping/killing to join the military and give vent to his feelings, in an accepted manner.

That's the thing: society has changed faster than men have.

Ugh the minimisation on this thread is depressing AF

• need for power and control
• views that women are inferior/not actual human beings
• porn and a society in general that objectifies women
• being rejected by women romantically and thinking a woman 'owes' them access to their body so they get revenge by hurting them
• mental illness in some instances
• the fact that some religions see women as second class citizen and pretty much the property of their husband/father
• general sense of entitlement...

As long as the law continues to treat offences like rape and domestic violence so poorly then this will carry on.

I think some men do have a deep hatred of women. Definitely.

That's the thing: society has changed faster than men have.

Aw the poor little lambs just can’t keep up! I wonder so many of them take it out on women

That's the thing: society has changed faster than men have.

Poor little poppets, good job people like you are here with handy excuses for their behaviour.

I dont think its hatrid anymore then you hate the pig you casually just ate for breakfast as bacon.

its disdain a sense they are not sentient in a way, a means to an end, a commodity to be used and thrown away, the killing is just to cover tracks to prevent being caught or part of the fun or both.

to hate you have to have an emotional attachment to someone, to have an emotional attachment to someone means you have to acknowledge it as an individual in some way or to be connected to someone you do have an emotional connection to and to somehow represent them.

but in general to be able to use, abuse and kill with a clear conscious, the victim has to be dehumanished and thus seen as nothing a thing to be used and thrown away without a care, that includes without hate.

I agree with all the comments here. Sometimes I do wonder if on a deep level all men do despise us.
I have two sons. The only way we can change things is for all mothers to really, really work with their sons and raise them to see the patriarchy for what it is.

@stupendousfragmentariness

Because their parents raised them that way, IME

I think this is completely wrong. I know of men who have committed violent offences who have come from nice families.

There may be men who are violent who may have had adverse childhood experiences. Plenty of men who have had those experiences though, don’t go on to rape and murder.

I don’t think they necessarily have mental health problems either. I think a lot of it is about power, control and domination.

I think the porn industry has given men a very skewed view of what a normal sex life is and this starts from them being teenage boys viewing porn for the first time and onwards.

I think misogyny and thinking of women as being lesser than men is something that maybe starts from high school onwards. I think that by the time these teenagers are adults, those damaging views are engrained.

I think it’s also important to recognise that bad experiences as a child or young adult don’t in any way excuse or explain going on to commit violent offences as an adult.

I think it's worth remembering that the people who do this sort of thing, especially to random strangers, are not usual. Most people never beat anyone at all to death, so when it happens, whomever it is, there is something about the perpetrator or situation that is different from what happens to most people. So that's where we have to look for an explanation, mainly.

I do think these cases where one person does this, there is at least some kind of rage or hatred involved, that is beyond the norm. Possibly also a lack of self-control, which may be something in the person or could be caused by something external like drugs or booze. Booze is implicated in a lot of brutal violent crimes.

Are there rational but evil people who just decide they are going out to beat some woman to death? Maybe, but it's a pretty risky thing to do no matter how smart you are. I suppose the cases where it happens are where you get serial killers who plan their exploits, but that is a much smaller group I'd think.

When you have groups of men who do stuff like this, I think there can be more complex things involved, people can do terrible things in a group that they would never do alone.

@Mistlewoeandwhine

I agree with all the comments here. Sometimes I do wonder if on a deep level all men do despise us. I have two sons. The only way we can change things is for all mothers to really, really work with their sons and raise them to see the patriarchy for what it is.

Just the mothers job?

I think that there is a lot to unpick.

And adding to what has already been said I don’t think it’s helpful that many of the most powerful men in society studied, and in many cases majored in rape mythology, otherwise known as Classics.

Oh, I'd agree that men are more prone to violence than women. Sometimes that's good, sometimes it's not. So that's a factor overall.

Also, yes, the fact that men are generally speaking sexually interested in women is a factor for some. It's one of the most powerful drives and it also links in some ways to violent feelings.

It's not just the violence though and its not just a few men. How many dads do you hear joking about "getting the shotgun ready" for when their daughters become teenagers or insisting that she will never be allowed to date? It's because they know first hand what other men are like.