Why do men do this

[Tevion28]

Following on from the Ashling Murthy murder and the likes of the Sarah Everard I've been thinking alot as to why men do this and I can only think that they must have a deep hatred for women and feel threatened by us for some reason. What do you all think I'm not convinced that these men all have mental health problems myself.

@BellatricksStrange

Why do people steal? Hatred or merely wanting to get something for nothing? I think by and large criminals commit crimes for their own perverse pleasure, and not out of a deep-seated hated or twisted ideology. It just happens to be that compared to men, women usually are weaker, and so an easy target. If women were physically as strong as men, physical violence would be far more balanced against both genders.

What a load of bollocks.

It’s women’s fault for being weaklings now

@Drinkingallthewine, I agree with you absolutely. If men were called out for minor sexual offences they wouldn't feel free to move on to bigger and nastier ones.

It’s because society (all of us) permit it to happen, if respect for women was enforced from day one it would reduce the incidence greatly.
Starting with removing porn and sexuality online there is no justification other than criminals or Google etc making money.

If we are going to remain the “liberal” society that we are there is no chance of anything changing.

@AnnieKenney exactly. Something I learnt only a few months ago, which blew my mind, is that “Stockholm Syndrome” is not a real medical diagnosis. It was made up out of thin air by a male psychiatrist who never even met the female bank teller caught up in the raid in Stockholm. She was highly critical of the police and government response at the time and thought their actions were going to get her and the other hostages killed. So she went down the “comply” route in an effort to ensure her survival and afterwards the psychiatrist claimed she did it because she had fallen in love with her captors.

Of course it now gets rolled out to explain those “crazy female behaviours” all because a man/patriarchal set up couldn’t cope with being criticised by a mere woman.

This explains it a bit more: www.themarysue.com/viral-tweet-exposes-sexist-origins-of-stockholm-syndrome/

I often think many men don't see women as quite human. More like animals, lesser, pets, useful for sex, entertainment and domestic labour. Silly, lower intelligence beings with foolish interests and nothing worth really listening to. It's easier to hurt something you don't see as real or equal if you think a certain way. Then there's porn. Dehumanising women from childhood, listening to their fathers do it, their peers, always that message bubbling away, add in porn showing women as constantly available and receptive to abuse, then add in a damaged, disordered man and that's a lethal combination.

@LondonWolf

I often think many men don't see women as quite human. More like animals, lesser, pets, useful for sex, entertainment and domestic labour. Silly, lower intelligence beings with foolish interests and nothing worth really listening to. It's easier to hurt something you don't see as real or equal if you think a certain way. Then there's porn. Dehumanising women from childhood, listening to their fathers do it, their peers, always that message bubbling away, add in porn showing women as constantly available and receptive to abuse, then add in a damaged, disordered man and that's a lethal combination.

I agree with this. I realised that I was in an emotionally abusive relationship when we got a dog. My ex treated me and the dog exactly the same. I even copied out a post from a MNer making the point explicit, if I can find it I will repost it. The gist was that a man might care for a dog, feed it and walk it but it is not an equal, it does not get a say in decisions about its life, and they see women the same.

Men hurt women BECAUSE NO ONE STOPS THEM. There are no or very few consequences for rape, DV, murder, financial abuse, coercive control, abusing us through hurting our children…

That’s the beginning and the end of it.

@HyacynthBucket

I think it is a deepseated hatred of women, and that it is definitely worse in Briatin than say, in southern Europe, where generally speaking men actually like women. They may be accused of being "macho" but that is more to do with themselves as men than anything to do with women. Here, particularly among upper class males in the past, nothing seems to stand between a dislike, probably based on fear, and women who take the brunt of it.

Pretty sure I've experienced outrageous sexual harassment in "Southern European" countries..:

I agree with this. I realised that I was in an emotionally abusive relationship when we got a dog. My ex treated me and the dog exactly the same. I even copied out a post from a MNer making the point explicit, if I can find it I will repost it. The gist was that a man might care for a dog, feed it and walk it but it is not an equal, it does not get a say in decisions about its life, and they see women the same.

Yes! This.

I remember it being made quite clear to me by my ex H that I didn't count in the household in the same way that he and the children did. I kept repeatedly and calmly saying "my happiness, needs and well being are as important as any other member of this family's". The rage on his face was terrifying. He was actually spitting rage as he screamed "no it fucking isn't! You've got kids now!" Presumably I was to be the equivalent of some kind of silent domestic appliance now that I hat given birth.

"There should be education around misogyny in schools the same way there is about other forms of hate. "

It's telling that there isn't. The way upskirting, Street harrasment and even stalking isn't taken seriously, shoes were our place is in society. Gay men couldn't do to other men what straight men do to women. We need to stop with viewing sexual attraction as something powerful that takes over. That excuse has been used for far too long. I've had ongoing harrasment since I was about 12. I've mixed with Lesbians and gone to gay bars. I've never had offensive, inappropriate behaviour from another woman. They do it because they think it's their right.

Again with the victim blaming - unattractive undesirable women get raped too. It’s not about getting sexual kicks, it’s about power

I don't think I suggested that only attractive women get raped.

You seem to be making an awful lot of assumptions, about sex and rape and also what other people think. And then being rude about it.

But you are making some bizarre statements. You must realize that there are all kinds of unattractive people who have consensual sex, so your idea that somehow that prooves rape is about something else is completely illogical.

Your assumption that sex and power are always going to be two separate things is foolish.

And the claim that rape is about asserting power only, but never about actual, standard sexual desire combined with not caring about the object, is unfounded. It's a theory a few academics have posited, there is no proof of it and I would argue plenty of evidence that it's not the case.

I'm also not sure why you'd think any of this has anything to do with blaming victims.

I had this colleague not that long ago who told me that women joining the man's workforce ruined employment for everyone and changed the dynamic of the family unit forever which he believes was a mistake.

I was gobsmacked. Apparently we women should be focussed on education up until 21 then we should marry and have babies, but no babies once we are 30, by then we should be running the home and IF we want job, it should be something with low commitment.

A colleague told me this. At work. Where we both worked together. And was SHOCKED when I kicked off.

Men hate women.
They are encouraged to do so from a very young age.
It is also reinforced from the very top.
Only men inherit titles and wealth, women can go and fuck themselves.
Boris Johnson was blessed by the Catholic church. He is an adulterer who has spoken many bastard children.
Would the church have welcomed him with open arms if he had been a woman? No.
Look at Afghanistan. Women openly beaten for daring to be in a public space, whilst men are not.
Anything remotely deemed feminine is laughed at.
Lockdiwn, another example football matches and pubs (the domain of mostly men) allowed to stay open and spread infection. Yet a mother wanting to go to a play centre- banned.

Thank you for the link CaveMum - I hadn't known that before.

@MorningStarling

I think it's unhelpful to try to rationalise it as "hatred of women" or "feeling threatened" by them. The problem with this kind of diagnosis is women inevitably try to understand men from a female perspective. We can only judge things from our experiences, but men's experiences are not the same as women's.

Personally I think it's just that men are naturally more violent. On average, the average man will resort to violence before the average woman would have done in the same situation. It's not hatred of women, it's merely the product of evolution - men have historically needed to use violence in a way that women haven't. There are few legitimate uses for violence these days (boxing, army, police) but even then, there is no lawful outlet for sexual violence or abduction/murder. Even a couple of hundred years ago there was plenty of scope for the type of man who liked raping/killing to join the military and give vent to his feelings, in an accepted manner.

That's the thing: society has changed faster than men have.

What is ‘society’ if not men?

Are you labouring under the delusion we live in a socially-progressive matriarchy? When women are murdered regularly with no repercussions, that is ‘society’. When rapes don’t even make it to court, far less get a conviction, that is ‘society’.

HyacynthBucket
I think it is a deepseated hatred of women, and that it is definitely worse in Briatin than say, in southern Europe, where generally speaking men actually like women. They may be accused of being "macho" but that is more to do with themselves as men than anything to do with women. Here, particularly among upper class males in the past, nothing seems to stand between a dislike, probably based on fear, and women who take the brunt of it.

Pretty sure I've experienced outrageous sexual harassment in "Southern European" countries..:

This. Men who profess to “like” women can still be very sexist and not actually see them as their equals. I don’t think you can have a “macho” culture without women being damaged by it.

To be fair humans are animal and display animal like behaviour we evolved through natural selection with females preferring to mate with males of certain characteristics. Male animals are violent, have you ever seen stags rut or duck mate? They are chemically programmed with testosterone to behave that way. For reasons of biological advantage for natural selection purposes. In a similar way that females are statistically more likely to be responsible for the death of the child yet nobody goes around saying women hate children. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.abc.net.au/article/10793162 . And at different times of their lifetimes are also affected by hormonal changes.

@Mouseonmychair

To be fair humans are animal and display animal like behaviour we evolved through natural selection with females preferring to mate with males of certain characteristics. Male animals are violent, have you ever seen stags rut or duck mate? They are chemically programmed with testosterone to behave that way. For reasons of biological advantage for natural selection purposes. In a similar way that females are statistically more likely to be responsible for the death of the child yet nobody goes around saying women hate children. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.abc.net.au/article/10793162 . And at different times of their lifetimes are also affected by hormonal changes.

Men and women kill their children in roughly equal numbers. Women are more likely to kill newborns or young babies from unwanted pregnancies, or to kill while having psychotic episodes. Men are more likely to kill their children from abuse.

But well done on normalising male violence on pseudo-evolutionary grounds.

In a similar way that females are statistically more likely to be responsible for the death of the child yet nobody goes around saying women hate children.

The report you've linked to doesn't even say that. It says:

The report shows that between 2000-01 and 2011-12 there were 238 recorded incidents of filicide in Australia, with 260 offenders involved in these incidents. Males constituted 52 per cent (124) of offenders and females 48 per cent (114).

So roughly an equal split with a small majority to male offenders - 52% compared to 48% female.

It also goes on to say:

However, within this, females were more likely to be responsible for neglect, whereas male offenders were responsible for physical, emotional and sexual abuse

It also states that men are more statistically more likely to be violent in their methods.

In the UK between 2010 and 2020, 90% of murder suspects were male and in 2019-2020 around 74% of violent crimes were committed by men.

If you want to read more on this subject (warning, it's depressing), try this: www.waterstones.com/book/men-who-hate-women/laura-bates/9781398504653

@Butteryflakycrust83

The one example I sum up to my husband whenever we discuss the differences between men and women is one day I was walking to work, 8am on a Monday, and some random bloke came up to me and whispered 'ANAL!'

Women do not do that.

In that moment, that man felt like he had power over me.

Yep it’s power definitely.

I do not believe for one minute they are unaware of how it comes across or that it’s a joke or they are having ‘Bantz’ 😣) it’s a power play.

When men say ‘smile love’ they’re not naively giving advice it’s a power play, designed to make you question yourself and feel uncomfortable.

The retort of ‘you’re ugly anyway’ when you deny a man something, usually your time or body is a classic example of this. They felt the power shift to you, so shift it back with an insult.

It’s happened since the dawn of religion, women kept in their place. Any confident (threatening) woman is… the devil, a witch, a prostitute, a ‘slag’…(sorry hate that word but needed to write it to explain what I mean). They must be a lesbian if they don’t welcome a man’s advances or ‘ugly anyway’

A woman dressed up is obviously dressing up purely for male attention and so is inviting comment and then you have the opposite, if a woman doesn’t dress up in a ‘man pleasing way’ she is also commented on because of course that’s what we are here for after all, pretty ornaments for men to look at, and I swear some men get offended if we don’t care.

I’m just so tired of it all.

The elephant in the room is that society can get it fairly right. Women and girls are not causing these problems so something is going right in how we're generally socialising the female cohort. If men were criminally inclined at the same level as women, we would have little to worry about.

So parents of boys and girls, educators of boys and girls, why are you treating boys differently, in a way that encourages and rewards this toxicity but are able to bring up well behaved and socially responsible (enough, generally) girls?

Alot of them view woman as less than - and have been socialised to think the same secondary to patriachy etc.

When they are given better chances in the world due them being Male - and they still make nothing of it - are rejected romantically etc it messes with their heads and they get exceptionally angry.

They are not able to speak about this and so it festers.

As my career developed and I became financially secure, my dating life got exponentially worse. I also went to gym 5 times per week and teach yoga. It was repulsion from a certain catergory of men. Which I suppose was good.

@AsYouWishButtercup

Why is it never a mental illness when it race related? Why do women only ever get the dishonour of “oh it’s just some loon”. Why are we so afraid to say out loud that men are sexist?

THIS!