To advise friend to ditch baby bottles, pushchair and nappies?

[feelinghappy]

My friend's children who are 4 and 6 drink squash from baby bottles (during the day at home - not at school - and take bottles of squash to bed with them), wear nappies in the car (not at night) and use a Phil and Ted pushchair if we go anywhere. My son was in pullups at night until 8 so I know the battle of accidents when they sleep - it's just seeing them get ready for driving home by lying on the floor to have nappies put on felt strange. Both children have speech problems (6 year old is seeing speech and language specialist) and neither have been to a dentist. I tried to encourage them to walk today but after a few steps they were both too tired and climbed back in the buggy. The nappies and buggy do not affect their health so much as the bottles - I wonder if she'll say to me in the future 'why didn't you say I shouldn't use bottles so long?' Or should I just mind my own business?

FWIW my dd2 was still having drinks out of bottles at 3, and her adult teeth (she’s long grown up) were always perfect. She used a dummy until well after 3, too.

I was amazed at the number of parents at our school taking reception children home in a pushchair after a 3 hour morning at the start of term. Cooing "oh they're so tired and they're just babies really aren't they". We live in a village where all the children live within a ten minute walk of the school!! These kids are 4 and 5, they are not babies. It's not true that all kids will insist on walking at 4 & 6. Plenty can't be bothered to walk and will happily sit bone idle in a pram if given the choice.

To the outside world dd is a perfectly fit and healthy 8 year old. However due to complex health issues and meds she suggested painful muscle fatigue. She cannot play out for hours or walk miles without it causing crippling pain. Therefore if it has been bad or she has done lots of exercise then I still use a pushchair for her. She has recently had covid. It has left her with chronic fatigue. We went to a local attraction on Monday. She sat in the pushchair most of the day.

I'm quite surprised whatever health professional your daughter is under hasnt suggested/provided a wheel chair. A friend had similar with their child & the occupational therapists said a wheelchair was important in terms of her peers not perceiving her as a baby etc.

@DeepaBeesKit

I was amazed at the number of parents at our school taking reception children home in a pushchair after a 3 hour morning at the start of term. Cooing "oh they're so tired and they're just babies really aren't they". We live in a village where all the children live within a ten minute walk of the school!! These kids are 4 and 5, they are not babies. It's not true that all kids will insist on walking at 4 & 6. Plenty can't be bothered to walk and will happily sit bone idle in a pram if given the choice.

This!! Some kids are still treated like babies when they are not babies.

How can you say they have no SEN when one is already being seen by a speech and language specialist? It really is quite difficult to get referrals to them, you know.

@Cheeseycheeseycheesecheese

I don't think she'd blame you for not passing comment in the future. Everyone does something others find odd.

I did think bottles were supposed to go by 18 months and be replaced by cups. is this true though? Sorry to derail slightly, ds is 2.5 and still has a bottle of milk at bedtime and a bottle when he wakes up. Cups all day otherwise, should I be stopping this?

2.5? Yes its bad for their teeth and isn't necessary. He could have a sippy cup of milk instead. Or normal cup better still.

The children's teeth seem fine. School made a s&l referral. The children are clean and well looked after and clearly adore their mum. I mentioned my son as it was tough on him wearing a pull up at night (he hated them) but he wet the bed every night until he was 10. I sought help from HV from when he was 5 but they kept saying not to worry 'it happens to lots of children' - the sheets were soaked through every morning. Then on advice from a friend (not this one) tried a bed alarm which eventually worked - it was exhausting but we got there. The bottles are cleaned but now discoloured from the juice in them - my friend has aways said 'they love their juice just like me' - the eldest used to take two bottles with her to bed to have at night but now only has one in the evening. So it is getting better. Neither of my children had bottles and yet one of them has always had problems with his teeth whereas the other has been fine plus we've just had to pay for braces 😬. Watching your child have a filling is awful 😖

I think of the 6 year old has a general developmental delay then I can see why she’d be treating the 4 year old the same. She may not know what is usual development and what is part of the delay.
The fact that she doesn’t send baby bottles to school indicates that she is well aware it’s not usual for children of that age to use them. Using a baby bottle should be stopped at 12-18 months.

I'm glad my other friend gave me advice but as others have pointed out I sought that advice so it wasn't judgemental. I don't believe the children are neglected or in danger of harm. There were just moments yesterday when I thought to myself should I say anything? I made them drinks with lunch in cups which they drank but when they started to get upset (later that afternoon - arguing with each other) they were given bottles of juice so it is being used as a comforter. But she has never mentioned it being difficult moving them from a bottle so it has never come up in conversation.

At our v large primary a few years back one mum used a pushchair for reception child. Never seen anyone else do it as catchment is less than 3/4 mile. She did it to stop him moaning on the ten minute walk home. Everyone used to comment behind her back that it was very odd. Might be wrong but it's true. The child is older now but never ever plays out and is the most unsporty child ever & has no coordination / balance. All prob linked.
People do judge.

My dd did the school run in a buggy until she was 6, we lived remotely and school was a 30 minute walk away through country lanes.
I would keep out of it, if services are involved the nappies, bottles and buggy will be brought up.
Contrary to the poster saying buggy use is linked to being uncoordinated my now adult dd is a professional sportswoman.

@Cheeeeislifenow

You should mind your business unless she asks for your opinion.

It could be that your friend is your friend because she feels comfortable in your company because you havent given her unasked for advice or commented on the way she parents her children. I am pretty sure that other people will have made remarks, raised eyebrows, whispered behind her back etc etc. Unless she lives in a vacuum she will be aware of the way children develop and will be aware that hers are not making the expected progress in many areas. Just carry on being her friend until she asks you to be her advisor.

@massiveblob

At our v large primary a few years back one mum used a pushchair for reception child. Never seen anyone else do it as catchment is less than 3/4 mile. She did it to stop him moaning on the ten minute walk home. Everyone used to comment behind her back that it was very odd. Might be wrong but it's true. The child is older now but never ever plays out and is the most unsporty child ever & has no coordination / balance. All prob linked. People do judge.

That's very unpleasentbif the other parents ,did it ever occur to any of you there might have been a reason ,why the child could only walk short distances and is now unsporty , uncoordinated etc?

OP a friend of mine had similar. They used a method where he had to drink gallons in the day & train his bladder / brain reaction. He bed wet lots until age 9. Really hard going. I think it's more common in boys

It might be worth talking to her about it and finding out what's going on. Maybe she needs some support as the longer this goes on the harder it will be to stop. I had a friend who put her 6 year old in nappies because she couldn't be bothered to take him to the toilet when we went out! Our friendship ended because I couldn't keep my mouth shut about it, but I don't regret trying to stand up for that poor child.

@x2boys she told everyone she couldn't be bothered making him walk. Her elder one walked the journey: he's 4 years older. The child has no SN and is very bright

Like some others on here, I'm astounded at the responses "mind your own business". So many asumptions that the children have SEN or autism.

Is that the get out of jail card? Just make that assumption and you will absolve yourself of any responsibilities.

Unfortunately this is more common than people realise. I work in an ARB with teenagers with SEND and there’s a few students that don’t need to be there but their parents are convinced that they need to be.

One family in particular had their children strapped in wheelchairs saying they couldn’t walk. It was only when the school got hold of their medical records they found that this wasn’t true and now as teens they’ve come to us but their years in the wheelchair means they struggle to walk very far.

Over the last few months there have been plenty of threads discussing why if people have concerns they don’t report them yet most people on here have said to mind their business.

As they’re at school I don’t think they need reporting as I’m sure school would do that but they absolutely should be kept a close eye on by OP.

The children's teeth seem fine. School made a s&l referral. The children are clean and well looked after and clearly adore their mum.
Then they're not being neglected, possibly delayed due too babyish upbringing, then again most DC want walks and a runaround I suspect they're not reaching milestones because there is a problem not their DM.

Is your friend especially sheltered or unobservant? If not she must know most children don't use bottles, nappies and buggies at this age.

Is she an attentive mum generally? Then I wouldn't expect the nappies to be to avoid cleaning up an accident. It doesn't really seem like a lazy option anyway as must be some job pushing children of that age in buggy.

Speech and language can be first step on path to diagnosing sen. I suspect there may be more going on than you realise.

@Cheeseycheeseycheesecheese. My daughter is five and still has a bottle of milk at night. She drinks out of a cup all day. I've spoken to my friends and all their children same age has bottle at night. Saying that I'm on the verge of throwing them as we forgetting them so forcing her to drink out of a cup. My daughter teeth is perfect and no problems with her speech and she very bright five year old.

Madness

Yeah. Do point it out! These poor kids!!!

And if she doesnt listen .... and....lets face it.. she wont...then you need to let it go. Or find different friends.

She sounds like she needs some help

Mention ONCE that drinking juice from a bottle is much worse for their teeth than drinking it from an open cup.

Then she's got the information and she can decide what to do with it. She might not know, and might be grateful for the heads up. But if you kept on about it then she probably wouldn't want to be your friend anymore...

@londonrach do you clean her teeth afterwards. The problem with bottles I think is that the liquid pools round the teeth and can damage them.

If you are close to her, I think that you could perhaps suggest that they need to see a dentist (especially the 6-year-old, who will be beginning to get their permanent teeth) and that taking squash bottles to bed is probably not great for their teeth; could the squash be replaced by water?

For the rest, I think it's not really your business. I suspect that they do have some sort of special needs - after all, they wouldn't be getting SALT for no reason - and that she may not be telling you everything about it, or may not have a full diagnosis yet. It is NOT typical for children this age to become tired after walking a few steps. If they don't have special needs, then they'll soon solve the problem themselves by rebelling - what school-age child actually wants to be pushed around in a buggy in front of everyone, if they can manage the walk? - and you need do nothing..

Lots of parents do these and more for various reasons. My nephew at 3.5 still sleeps with his DM a lot (probably because she’s put him in nursery every day 8-5) and when they go on walks he prefers to be carried or piggy backed but then he is a threenager. Would never dare to say anything! Their child their choices.