Dh shouts at 3 year old if she won’t sleep

[Pipesofpeas]

Our Dd is 3, she’s very lively and has always struggled on and off to fall asleep at night. She’s been going through a few weeks of not being able to fall asleep easily and then waking up early, so is overtired.
We’ve been putting her to bed earlier and doing the routine we’ve always done-teeth, story, lights out, cuddling up to her etc.
We alternate bedtimes and Dh just isn’t able to cope with it, she definitely can be hard work but is only 3. I had to come up and take over tonight as he was shouting at her to go to sleep, getting angry and storming around. She was being difficult, running around, not getting into bed etc. I totally get how hard it is, parenting is hard, but shouting and getting angry just makes it so much worse. I’ve just been lay here cuddling to to her whilst she cried and said she can’t sleep and is trying. Just feel so sad for her and wish he’d just step up and be a better parent. He always says he’s tired from work, yes I get it, I’m tired too, we’re all tired ffs

[quote Pipesofpeas]@Minimananna That sounds exactly the same as us! I breastfed too, co-slept and then we started taking it in turns. I also can’t face it every night, after all day I need space away from everyone 🙈
Is it an app? I will download it[/quote]
She's very used to sleeping with you and isn't running to your timetable. How is dad with her during the day?
Can you stay with her in the dark, not talking, even lay down and sleep?
The trick is to leave just as she drops to sleep, at least at first, so she isn't scared when she wakes in the night.
Will take a few nights but really you're scaffolding sleeping alone for her.
Might be worth buying her a double bed when she's a bit older. My youngest was like this and at times of heightened anxiety she'd like me stay with her til she fell asleep, up until puberty

@AlmostAlwyn

But yours is 20 minutes of quiet time, and he falls asleep. That is a routine which works for him and for you. He goes to sleep calmly, reliably and quickly. That's what you're looking for so that's good.

The OP is spending 2 hours lieing in bed with her while she does a mixture of getting up, running around, talking, asking for "stories from your mouth". Just distraction techniques and mucking around until she is crying because she is so tried.

The OP's routine of getting into bed with her child doesnt work. If lieing there for 15 or 20 minutes did the job then great. But it doesnt. She needs to find something else that works for her child. Stronger boundaries and teaching her that bedtime means so more talking or "stories from her mouth" might actually help this child learn that bedtime is for sleep. Right now, it's a fun 2 hours of loads of attention. That is never going to teach her that sleep time means sleep time.

If lieing in bed works then do it. It's fine. But it doesnt work for this child. They need to try something else for a few nights but OP doesnt want to so what was the point in posting?

She could try story, goodnight, audiobooks and leave. Then no more attention after that. Just put back into bed.
She could try yoga, story, lie down together and do a child's meditation then leave.
She could try story and then saying, "I'm just going to go and do some jobs in the halls. You stay in bed and listen to this story/music and relax. I'll be back in a few minutes but the only rule is that you need to stay in bed and listen quietly".

There are all sorts of ways she can do this without climbing into the bed with a child who relishes distraction and chatting and attention so will never sleep easily with that.

@Itsalmostanaccessory Are you ok? It’s almost like you’re taking this personally. Op has stated her views, maybe don’t be so invested and so..angry 🤷🏻‍♀️

Have you tried doing the routine, putting her to bed then leaving and ignoring her and just taking her back to bed quietly and gently every time she comes out and saying nothing ? Or just saying ok you need to be in bed now and taking her back ?

We have similar issues with our 3 year old OP. Completely agree with @SarahAndQuack that a lot of bedtime routine advice only works it you have an easy child. Our daughter stays up later so that she is properly tired when she goes to bed. We lie with her & cuddle her & co-sleep. I completely understand why some posters use the put back to bed method & it works well for some. I do think some children find it much harder & are more resistant to winding down that others & agree with @SocialConnection that expecting a 3 year old to be ok with going to sleep on their own is quite a big ask.

[quote ETmagicfinger]@Itsalmostanaccessory Are you ok? It’s almost like you’re taking this personally. Op has stated her views, maybe don’t be so invested and so..angry 🤷🏻‍♀️[/quote]
How on Earth does @Itsalmostanaccessory sound angry?

Sounds like my DS when he was younger, i started calming the games down an hour or so before going up for a warm bath with a splash of lavender oil in it and lots of bubbles, warm towel for a wrap up cuddle after and into warmed pjs then into his own bed for cuddles, story, then story tape on and a little stroke before last kiss goodnight, if there was any fuss story tape went off and id sit with him quietly, just saying shush now sleep time if he started talking, if he was quiet tape could go back on as long as he would let me leave, Dad would pop in for goodnight kiss too and leave. Worked quite well after a week or so of being consistent with the routine. Good luck, its a desperate time until they learn to sleep well on their own.

@OneRuleForThem

"How on Earth does
Itsalmostanaccessory sound angry?"

Perhaps not angry, but definitely seems affronted that the OP is not immediately agreeing that what she is currently doing is ridiculous and she should start, basically, some form controlled crying

[quote ETmagicfinger]@Itsalmostanaccessory Are you ok? It’s almost like you’re taking this personally. Op has stated her views, maybe don’t be so invested and so..angry 🤷🏻‍♀️[/quote]
Eh? Are you reading something else?! That poster doesn’t sound angry at all… are you ok?

@Itsalmostanaccessory

But the OP has said that her routine has been working up until recently and her issue is her husband's lack of patience. I don't think the answer is to suddenly start leaving her 3 year old on her own at bedtime. There is obviously something that has changed, which I would be approaching with sympathy.

@Itsalmostanaccessory

Dont lie in there with the lights on!

Story. Goodnight. Leave.

If she gets up, you put her back in, goodnight and leave. You dont give loads of attention or hugs and kisses because that encourages her to keep coming and chatting and whatever else she is mucking around with. No extra attention.

Goodnight and leave.

The first night, this might go on for a couple of hours. The next night might be an hour. The third night, she'll start to get the message.

She needs to learnt to go to sleep. This is a really important age for that. As a parent, it is hard to step away but giving her the attention and staying in bed with her so she can chat and sing and everything else is contributing to the problem.

All of this.

OP, you need some advice and guidance around her sleep asap. What you're doing isn't working.

@ETmagicfinger

The OP posts for advice. She gets given it in spades, with suggestions for many different ways to leave her in her room alone and see how it goes. The OP's answer is that she knows what her child needs so wont be doing any of that.

It's a waste of everyone's time. And on top of that, what she is doing isnt working and I've seen marriages fall apart over the stress this sort of thing brings. One parent clearly at the end of their tether and the other steadfastly refusing to alter their method because, "it works." Except, it doesnt.

@Itsalmostanaccessory But, reading through the posts, it seems the op *Does take advice, but perhaps just not yours? That’s ok though, isn’t it, we’re all different.

You made the rod for your own back OP with the ridiculous 2 hour pandering to get your child asleep yet you expect to sit back and have a break and let your husband deal with the bedtime chaos you created. You have had loads of good advice to help and refuse to even consider it. I can totally understand your husband getting angry. While shouting at a child is never ok he must be at the end of his tether dealing with the nonsense of bedtime every night while you sit downstairs and listen to the mayhem you insist is working.

Hi op you say your husband won't try other techniques , seems you won't as well . What techniques have you already tried?

[quote Itsalmostanaccessory]@ETmagicfinger

The OP posts for advice. She gets given it in spades, with suggestions for many different ways to leave her in her room alone and see how it goes. The OP's answer is that she knows what her child needs so wont be doing any of that.

It's a waste of everyone's time. And on top of that, what she is doing isnt working and I've seen marriages fall apart over the stress this sort of thing brings. One parent clearly at the end of their tether and the other steadfastly refusing to alter their method because, "it works." Except, it doesnt.[/quote]
But she didn't.

She posted complaining about her DH. Her whole OP is about that.

You decided she wanted advice (so did I, so did lots of other people - it's natural, we want to help). She's been perfectly polite in response, but given she didn't actually ask us to advise her on getting her child to sleep, there's no special reason she should feel bound to agree with us when we do, is there?

(And, FWIW, I do not think it is a waste of time to be able to discuss this stuff. Feeling your partner isn't on the same page is horrible; it needs talking about.)

Could you start "winding down" for bed earlier? If she's not feeling calm, then maybe the bedtime routine should be longer.
Ex. Dinner at 5:30. Bath at 6. Pajamas and teeth brushed at 6:30. 6:45 jigsaws/quiet play with low lighting. 7:00 story. 7:05 lights out (she is in bed, you sit beside) and quiet chat about the best part of her day. 7:15 "Goodnight, Mummy and Daddy love you", and you no longer engage in conversation.

I think you’ve created this situation by turning bedtime into a fun event where she gets hours of attention and the only time you leave is when she falls asleep, so it’s no wonder she doesn’t want to fall asleep and is fighting it.

No one is suggesting just saying “it’s bed time now” and putting a three year old into bed alone in a dark room and leaving, people are saying have a wind down period for bedtime, have bath-time, dim the lights, read a nice story and have a cuddle then after twenty minutes you leave, regardless of whether she is asleep, leave an audiobook running if she can’t handle the silence, but leave, if she gets up then put her back to bed, spend a few minutes comforting her then leave again, if she keeps doing it then just silently take her back to bed. She needs to learn how to fall asleep alone or this will continue for years and years.

Realistically I think it takes the patience of a saint to cope with an hour plus long bedtime.

Sorry OP but I agree you should leave her to it. Or just accept she won't sleep until 8pm. A child shouldn't be worrying about not being able to fall asleep. What you're doing isn't sustainable and sounds miserable for everyone (including your daughter).

@SarahAndQuack
You decided she wanted advice (so did I, so did lots of other people - it's natural, we want to help). She's been perfectly polite in response, but given she didn't actually ask us to advise her on getting her child to sleep, there's no special reason she should feel bound to agree with us when we do, is there?

She posted in AIBU. Some posters told her she was being unreasonable because of XYZ. OP replied actually she’s not being unreasonable because of XYZ because of ABC… etc etc

You post in AIBU then you expect to get told when you are.

[quote OneRuleForThem]@SarahAndQuack
You decided she wanted advice (so did I, so did lots of other people - it's natural, we want to help). She's been perfectly polite in response, but given she didn't actually ask us to advise her on getting her child to sleep, there's no special reason she should feel bound to agree with us when we do, is there?

She posted in AIBU. Some posters told her she was being unreasonable because of XYZ. OP replied actually she’s not being unreasonable because of XYZ because of ABC… etc etc

You post in AIBU then you expect to get told when you are.[/quote]
Oh, sure, I get that AIBU can get heated.

I'm just making the point that the original OP wasn't actually about asking for advice about the child's sleeping patterns, it was about how her DH and she cope differently with the DD. Sleep patterns might well come into it, but there's nothing rude about the OP coming back to say, actually, she doesn't feel that much that it's the issue.

@SarahAndQuack The OP actually says she wants her DH to be “a better parent”. She believes she is “a better parent”. There is absolutely no way either of my DPs would have tolerated lying in bed with us (me or DB), nor do my DB and SIL do it with their DC.

OP thinks she isn’t doing anything wrong, admits they’re all tired, so naturally pp have responded with ideas for EVERYONE to get more rest, but OP is fine with her current routine, but annoyed that her DH gets frustrated with it and wants him to be “better”.

There is no room for male aggression in a child's bedroom, ever, though, regardless of your opinion of the OP's approach.

@SarahAndQuack
I'm just making the point that the original OP wasn't actually about asking for advice about the child's sleeping patterns, it was about how her DH and she cope differently with the DD. Sleep patterns might well come into it, but there's nothing rude about the OP coming back to say, actually, she doesn't feel that much that it's the issue.

But surely the premise of the OP was “AIBU for thinking DH is wrong for this”? And some people told her no, he’s not, and maybe this would be a better way… and OP hasn’t (so far) seemed to take any of those posts on board. So it’s like…why did you post then?