AIBU to ask about the life experiences of unattractive women

[Iamnotattractive]

Was impressed by the recent thread about pretty privilege, and stories there. Was so different to my experience, it sounded like a different planet.

So, I am an unattractive woman, and have been all my life. No obvious single disfigurement, I just look weird, overall badly put together.

I've been asked out only twice in my life (once at 17, once at 27) - had children with the second guy, despite having serious misgivings, but he was really the only option (it did not last). Men never notice I even exist - even the ones I work with for a year or so struggle to recall my name (I don't mean the immediate team members, but someone further out). I remember all the compliments I was given in my life, as the total number is under 10 . If a guy offered to buy me a drink or offered to carry something heavy for me, my first thought would be that they have some criminal intentions - hypothetically, of course, it never happened in reality.

On the positive side, I have never experienced any inappropriate sexual attention or harassment. I don't also have to worry about losing my looks as I age - if nothing helped me at 16, nothing will help me at almost 40.

So wanted to ask other unattractive women, how does life look for you? Similar to mine?

I've read your posts several times @scottishnames and I still can't fathom what they mean in the context of this thread - did you mean to post on this one?? If so, are you suggesting that men judging women on looks is a new thing? That nobody insulted ugly women until sexual liberation? Is it the ugly women or the pretty women who need to have more self respect? I cannot for the life of me follow your train of thought.

@DDUW

Never been asked out, never been on a date.

Have any of you been ridiculed for trying to make an effort with your appearance? I used to try to wear nice clothes but I was humiliated by people finding it funny so I stopped.

At school I got laughed at for having highlights in my hair. Everyone else was allowed to have highlights but I wasn't.

Later someone said it was because I denied having them that they went on and on and one about me having them. I don't think that was the reason - and the reason I denied it was because I knew they'd bitch either way.

But I didn't have problems attracting men when I was younger and they were pretty nice in the main.

For what it's worth I've never really seen an ugly woman. Some are too fat, but that can be fixed. I did have a work colleague who was ugly but I think that was down to her glasses, I really wish someone close to her had told her to go to the opticians for new frames!

With respect maybe it's not the way you look, but the way you come across as in victim mentality, and negative vibes.

It really isn't - that's quite a hurtful, victim-blaming thing to say. These are people's lived experiences. If someone was complaining they'd experienced prejudice because they were disabled, say, or because of their skin colour, would you tell them it was their fault for having 'negative vibes'.

I know many ordinary looking women l won't use the word unattractive as beauty is not just skin deep, but they just shine, they have this glow, and energy and vitality that makes them attractive, and attractive to be around.

There's a difference between being ordinary-looking and being physically unattractive. Ordinary-looking people might not get much positive attention, but they probably don't get called 'ugly' by complete strangers.

Oh yeah.
I’ve been bullied (by boys) as young as I can remember.
They made songs about me being fat when I walked by, beebing sounds (you know, those that big cars have) and the ever so kind ”hey fatso, you know you’re fat right” and other comment.

Boys/men have only ever noticed me when they wanted to bully me.
Never asked out, never been on a date, mid 30’s now, will live and die alone as a virgin.

Whenever I read/hear women gushing about men, I just can’t relata, I don’t regonaise what they are describing at all.
Obviously our experiences are very different, but I can't ever see myself ever trusting a man and it's so crazy seeing women with men so comfortable with men, trusting them, wanting to be with them.

I think ugly women see the real men, what they are like.

I’ve read a little bit of the pretty one’s thread, couldn’t read it, too painfull to read them take beauty for granted and complain about it.

@emsyj37, Ilooked back at scottishnames' posts to see what you meant. she mentions being older than most here as am I (over 60 now grew up in 1970s). I can say I was very aware from an early age and I mean age 5/6 of comments on physical appearance and being valued accordingly from schoolmates and adults. I was the fat little girl and then teenager and got constant comments even from my best friend and was physically bullied and name called in the streets by boys. As a result when other girls started going out with boys as teenagers I assumed I had no chance and also had an old-fashioned father who did not encourage socialising out of the family. At the same time I was aware of feminism and the unfairness of the double standard - the girls were supposed to resist the boys' sexual advances while making themselves as attractive as possible. Early marriage was the norm, my friend got married as soon as we left school at 16 and we never saw each other again. I never had a boyfriend then but as soon as I left home to work in London I was beseiged with sexual attention which confused me as I did regard myself as unattractive and dressed older. I also felt excluded from female comradeship as I had no knowledge of make up,hair styling or fashion and hated discos etc and at the same time had a mentally radically feminist world view. Just saying we older women did not all have the same experience or outlook then or now.

@colinthekoala, Quote "For what it's worth I've never really seen an ugly woman. Some are too fat, but that can be fixed. I did have a work colleague who was ugly but I think that was down to her glasses, I really wish someone close to her had told her to go to the opticians for new frames!"

You are obviously not aware this is classic excusing of bullying. If only they'd change to fit in eveything would be fine. Well I've read plenty of threads in Relationships were women thought they'd had relationships with men who considered them good enough to marry/sleep with until they crossed them in some way . Then they are suddenly fat, ugly slags/bitches (other insults freely flung about). If only they'd diet and get contact lenses eh?

@IamthatB, hope you don't mind but i just wanted to offer you some support as I recognise exactly that kind of bullying from my early life. And the pain you are feeling now in your thirties. It is very much an internalised thing but it goes deep if you feel you don't match up, there is always someone there to put you down. But it is not you, do you insult people for their appearance? No probably not. No one ever deserves such treatment and the people who do it are revealing themselves as limited idiots.

Recently I came across a saying I had never known in 60 years: " Other people's opinions of me are not my business". have you heard it? It may seem like a harsh saying but I think it relates to the importance of building up your own boundaries and deciding what you value in yourself regardless of anything others may think or say.

Also if you read the relationship threads you will see that good looks, love, loyalty, chidren, ties of home, family or business are sometimes not enough to stop some men turning on the women they supposedly love with the grossest insults. The insults people use in anger or as 'jokes' aren't about the one insulted they are about the insulter.

I'm interested in what features people who say they are ugly have that makes them so. Most unattractive people I see look that way because of the choices they make, their hair style, clothes, posture. Other than exceptionally pretty people, faces on the whole tend to be rather ordinary, with attractiveness reduced or elevated by other aspects of appearance. What is it about facial features that people deem as making them unavoidably unattractive?

@5128gap

I'm interested in what features people who say they are ugly have that makes them so. Most unattractive people I see look that way because of the choices they make, their hair style, clothes, posture. Other than exceptionally pretty people, faces on the whole tend to be rather ordinary, with attractiveness reduced or elevated by other aspects of appearance. What is it about facial features that people deem as making them unavoidably unattractive?

As said upthread, I have a square, masculine jaw, heavy brow and huge nose. My eyes are small and deep set. My face is not symmetrical. I look rather like a wonky Neanderthal except I don't have a low forehead.

I've got rubbish posture because my rib cage is ridiculously large and if I stick my chest out I look even worse.

I don't think I dress badly - I make an effort. I dye my grey hair and wear make-up. My skin isn't too bad for my age. But however smart/presentable I look, nothing can ever make me attractive because my bone structure isn't made that way.

I was badly bullied at school and college for my looks. I was just a hideous looking girl. I was spat on, called names every single day, had my lunch stolen off me. i just basically went to school to be tormented. Hell even walking down the town centre the bullies would be with their other friends from other schools to yell abuse. I still got called ugly into my 20s and well into my 30s. My self esteem is non exsistent and im pretty sure i have ptsd. On my previous post i wrote about the 2 times people commented nice on how nice i looked but honestly i dont have time to spend hours at a mirror making myself up.
Thats why i got into care work to treat people how i never was. Im kind, caring and the people who i support dont care how i look as long as i make them laugh. Ill never progress to anything and thats ok, id rather be who i am than the nasty mean people who made my life hell. Would i spit on people or call them ugly, no because i think regardless of looks it costs nothing to be a decent human being

I was a really cute kid, but From the age of 12 I became covered in horrific acne, and overweight. (Probably due to a hormone imbalance that nobody bothered to investigate, my family were pretty neglectful). From that day onwards I was called ugly. Boys would recoil at school and literally look scared of my face/me. They would point and laugh. I remember as a teen walking down the street, I had very long thick hair at the time and a long dress. A builders van started following me and cat calling from behind. When I turned round they literally made vomiting noises and laughed at me. I remember ducking down a side street and crying my eyes out. Had a serious relationship with the first person who showed an interest due to low self esteem, despite him being horribly controlling and a lot older than me. Aaaanyway, at age 25 I decided to change my life. Went on a serious diet, detox, exercise plan, left the boyfriend, started dyeing hair, used clever make up. Suddenly I was “attractive” even though I know inside it’s not real and all just smoke and mirrors. Suddenly had masses of attention and it was so hard to handle. Married my now husband and I’m in my 40s now..considered attractive according to friends etc. Inside I still feel like an ugly freak though and always will.

@uglyinside you are not, genuinely horrified to hear women speak this way about themselves, especially as I don't have daughters

Do men think like this?

Only read a couple of pages of this.

Girls tend to hate me. I don’t know why.

Men see me as friends, not attractive.

All my life I’ve been ‘fine’ but people have always been more beautiful etc. I used to find it quite hard to be just ‘blah’ but actually, my female friends are actual friends, and men don’t want anything from me other than actual friendship. Luckily I have a DH who while I think he is out of my league, he thinks the opposite. I suppose that helps.

Ugly, lumpy and given up on the possibility of meeting anyone. I hate it when people say it’ll happen when you least expect it or there’s someone for everyone. Neither statement is true if you’re not attractive.

I'd say I was below average, with some good features. Underbite, some crooked teeth, bad nose, currently a bit dumpy, pale. I was an awkward teenager, and had awful hair then though now it's probably one of my best features.

I think confidence makes a lot of difference though I couldn't tell you where mine comes from. My career literally involves charming people, and I appear to be decent at it. I'm intelligent, funny, creative and very confident socially. I've never had guys handing me their numbers, and I suspect I wouldn't do so well on today's dating apps, but I never had a shortage of boyfriends, usually met through shared interests, and they've been lovely, intelligent, successful and I suppose range from above average to objectively very good-looking. My confidence and personality are the only ways I can account for what some might call punching above my weight.

Male colleagues treat me with respect, are friendly and helpful. There's always the odd wanker, and the occasional horrid comment from groups of men in cars, and there's still sexual harassment at times.

I'm sorry people have had such awful comments from others. I suspect there's something wrong with people who hurt other people like that, a major personality flaw, or secretly very insecure so need to put others down to make themselves feel better.

Weirdly I have no facial memory at all so when I walk away from someone I have no memory of their face at all, and just don't notice when I'm talking to them. I can't even visualise my own family! What I do take away from encounters is how that person made me feel. So I guess in some ways I am blind to how people look.

@malificent7

I do think men are also fed an unrealistic view of female beauty. They expect to land a gf who looks like a model when model types are rare and often heavily airbrushed.

This is, I think, very true. I was very conventionally attractive when younger (reading this thread like I did the other out of interest and learning people's experiences) and my boyfriend was probably a smidge above average (liked him because he was funny but unfortunately he turned out to be abusive) and his Dad very definitely average at best. They would constantly - and I mean constantly- go on about how unfair it was that they didnt have a girlfriend like one in whatever movie we were watching and when would they get one. It was like they just expected they were entitled to a model type but I think came from what they were fed in the media. They'd then say if they had money they would as all women are fickle and then slag off women generally. Did wonders for my self esteem. My boyfriend seemed to fail to realise that I liked him, at least initially, for him and not anything else as he wasnt well off, didnt have a great job, was average looking etc. Regrettably though he never did it infront of me I could imagine him being someone who would be nasty to people he found ugly. Unfortunately there are some really mean people out there. Take some comfort from the fact that it isn't a reflection at all on you. They are just horrible people who are horrible to most people.

I like the last part of OP :)
I'm not the most beautiful, not ugly as per se, small, but not nicely petite, but just... short. Nothing ever fits properly without tailoring (which I can't be bothered with nowadays),...
I had many boyfriends, my colleagues always know my name, even the ones quite far away.
had a kid with guy I met when we were 21. he is still my husband.
got attention always.
because it is not how you look, but how you behave and what vibes you give off. And if I'm in the mood I can give off exceptionally good vibes still :)
The one thing I never got: random guys randomly wanting to have sex with me. For that I was/am not beautiful enough. but I can live with this fact.... easily.

But the upside really is that aging is not a big issue. :)

@FrenchToasty

Ugly, lumpy and given up on the possibility of meeting anyone. I hate it when people say it’ll happen when you least expect it or there’s someone for everyone. Neither statement is true if you’re not attractive.

Is that the case though. Am I being naive in thinking that attractiveness is to a large extent subjective albeit undeniably there are societal ideals as to what is conventionally attractive. And so there will be people that find some qualities and looks others might not, attractive. And not everyone is conventionally attractive nor can date someone who is. So surely there are other not conventionally attractive people looking for those like them who they would find attractive? And many intelligent people arent just looking for someone based on looks. Kindness and being a good conversationalist stand for something?

@YeahImThatB

Oh yeah. I’ve been bullied (by boys) as young as I can remember. They made songs about me being fat when I walked by, beebing sounds (you know, those that big cars have) and the ever so kind ”hey fatso, you know you’re fat right” and other comment.

Boys/men have only ever noticed me when they wanted to bully me.
Never asked out, never been on a date, mid 30’s now, will live and die alone as a virgin.

Whenever I read/hear women gushing about men, I just can’t relata, I don’t regonaise what they are describing at all.
Obviously our experiences are very different, but I can't ever see myself ever trusting a man and it's so crazy seeing women with men so comfortable with men, trusting them, wanting to be with them.

I think ugly women see the real men, what they are like.

I’ve read a little bit of the pretty one’s thread, couldn’t read it, too painfull to read them take beauty for granted and complain about it.

I agree with this about ugly women seeing what men are really like. To know someone you have to see how they react when there isnt an audience. When it isnt to their benefit. Are they kind? Are the considerate? When there is nothing in it for them. I do believe there are good men but I also believe there are many who are incredibly shallow

I am totally invisible to the opposite sex - or more accurately, men 10 years either side of my age. They completely ignore me nowadays.

Never been asked out by anyone.
Not even my DH ‘perused’ me. We just fell into a not very romantic relationship which was convenient for both of us more than anything else.

I always seem to get on (platonically) with older men and nowadays much younger men chat to me constantly. They see me just as I am - a platonic work colleague much older or younger than they are.

When I was younger I had lots of male friends my age but I was the ‘friend’ never the potential girlfriend. I’m definitely not someone anyone has found particularly attractive.

I’ve wasted far too many decades worrying about how physically unattractive I am. At school I was voted the ugliest girl in the year, it stuck with me throughout my adult life. I’m now nearly 60 and genuinely don’t care anymore..it’s very liberating and wish I had the courage to be like this sooner. It’s a shame we’re conditioned in the first place.

As said upthread, I have a square, masculine jaw, heavy brow and huge nose. My eyes are small and deep set. My face is not symmetrical. I look rather like a wonky Neanderthal except I don't have a low forehead.
Well hello, long lost twin! All of the above, but with a bulbous nose rather than large.

I am also 5'10", but with a very masculine build (ultra wide shoulders, all my shirts are tailor made as I don't fit into the standard female sizing; narrow hips, no bum; generally thick built). I have large breasts, but they look completely out of order on my body, as if I am wearing a stuffed bra. I just don't look feminine at all, and actually was mistaken a couple of times for a cross-dressed man.

Also have a receding hairline now, and some bad acne scarring from my teenage years.

Neither single feature is an absolute disaster, and indeed is something that could be camouflaged / masked. But all together, it is a full house.

I think ugly women see the real men, what they are like.
Oh yes, I agree. My judgement about my female friends' male partners has never been wrong so far - and a big part of that was based on how they treated me vs our more prettier friends.

With respect maybe it's not the way you look, but the way you come across as in victim mentality, and negative vibes.
Maybe. I don't think I have a victim mentality, to be honest.

@FrenchToasty

Ugly, lumpy and given up on the possibility of meeting anyone. I hate it when people say it’ll happen when you least expect it or there’s someone for everyone. Neither statement is true if you’re not attractive.

Absolutely this