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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder if Mumsnet is full of men who are a waste of space

252 replies

DownToTheSeaAgain · 23/10/2021 12:12

...or most men are a waste of space so Mumsnet just reflects the real world.

OP posts:
crackofdoom · 23/10/2021 13:46

User Yep, it’s the reality of having kids…….
…..with a man 🙄

Youseethethingis · 23/10/2021 13:47

Does nobody else have fathers, brothers, sons and uncles who they love for the wonderful, imperfect and unique humans they are? Where is the sense of loyalty? How can you possibly cast 3.5billion individual humans into the same bucket?

Bunnycat101 · 23/10/2021 13:47

I think there is obviously a spectrum between amazing and shit. My husband works really hard at his job which provides us with a nice lifestyle but an increasing tension has been the fact he literally does bugger all around the house, isn’t particularly good at engaging with our children and can’t go for a day out without being on his phone. He thinks I’m being a nag that doesn’t appreciate how stressful his job is.

TurnUpTurnip · 23/10/2021 13:47

You know you don’t actually have to be in a relationship right, if men are so bad and all of them then you can leave a stay single, women so quick to say how all men are bad but yet keep repeatedly getting into relationships, it’s not compulsory!

PicsInRed · 23/10/2021 13:48

It's the reality of having kids

It's the reality of having kids a low quality, selfish husband.

PicsInRed · 23/10/2021 13:49

@Youseethethingis

Does nobody else have fathers, brothers, sons and uncles who they love for the wonderful, imperfect and unique humans they are? Where is the sense of loyalty? How can you possibly cast 3.5billion individual humans into the same bucket?
Of course. Now if they could return the favour.
Yourstupidityexhaustsme · 23/10/2021 13:51

@PicsInRed

Porn and media conditioning has fucked an entire generation of men. That's not their fault, but of course that "no fault" reality does women no good either. We're still the ones being harassed, raped, domestically abused, slaughtered, and in our own homes where we are supposed to be safe.

History clearly instructs us that nothing short of a new women's movement - and I mean a movement centred on WOMEN - will fix this.

See I appreciate entirely what you’re saying but this is a sweeping generalisation.

‘Fucked a generation of men’ - surely the generation before were equally/more fucked than our current partners by traditional gender norms/societal pressures and conditioning/legal restraints etc.

Abusers are always at fault. It is a choice, yes there are external factors but if someone abuses another person that is a choice they have chosen to make.

A blanket men bad, women good does both the abusers and the abused a disservice.

We need to adjust our narrative where we are all held individually accountable for our own actions. Your sweeping generalisation of ‘it’s not their fault’ is in essence the grown up version of boys will be boys.

This doesn’t need a women’s movement. This needs a united movement of EVERYONE saying no more, men included.

MintJulia · 23/10/2021 13:51

@youseethethingis you're quite right. My greatest wish is that DS turns out to be a kind thoughtful man. Smile

Yourstupidityexhaustsme · 23/10/2021 13:52

Of course. Now if they could return the favour.

Do they not already?

mrgoodatfixingrhings · 23/10/2021 13:54

@User135644

Too many men grow up without a strong father/father figure and it leaves them wanting as adults.
I grew up without my father, it made me respect my mother more for the struggles she had and the person she helped me to become.

It's also made me the responsible father I am today, which is a good job as my ex has pretty much ticked every box in the box of red flags on here :
Gambling addict
Stolen from me
Drug user
Ridiculously manipulative
Nearly cost me my job due to leaving me literally holding the baby after disappearing at 3 am and not returning for days.
Total lack of respect or thought for our ds &dd

So no OP, all men are not useless as I'd happily stand up as a good one and be defended by those who know me and have told me just that. Brew

OnwardsAndSideways1 · 23/10/2021 13:58

Does nobody else have fathers, brothers, sons and uncles who they love for the wonderful, imperfect and unique humans they are? Where is the sense of loyalty? How can you possibly cast 3.5billion individual humans into the same bucket?

Because I believe social norms and pressure, of patriarchy, are so strong, that they bring out the worst in the majority of men. For example, in some countries I was reading about the other day, a recent survey showed 60/70% of men hit their wives and that women just expected that as part of marriage. Now, is that because 60/70% are really evil? No, it's for the same reason probably 60/70% of people used to discipline their kids by hitting 40 years ago. It's a social norm, a way of life and it suits the dominant groups to continue it.

I believe those norms are stronger than individuals a lot of the time, which is why the majority end up in the shit with their partners, and there's a minority of nicer more thoughtful people (both men and women) who reflect on what they do and see their partners as proper humans. The odds aren't great though.

There was a brilliant book which showed that in the West men and women start off equal when dating, all seems very egalitarian and domestic, then children arrive and it often reverts back to 1950 distribution of household tasks and emotional energy which is very very hard to fight from inside.

This is all more powerful than individual people. Even my lovely husband, who was brilliantly supportive of my career and would move location for it unlike the vast majority of men in the UK who only tolerate their women's jobs if it fits around their own, had his slightly sexist moments, and had to be actively challenged to step up to cleaning the toilet and parenting on his own his own children all by himself rather than defaulting to letting the woman in his life do it.

IWillFindYou · 23/10/2021 13:58

@stingofthebutterfly

”I wonder if there's a similar website where men frequently voice how rubbish their partners are.”

Yes. Yes there is.
Also filled with hatred, misogyny and violence againts women.
MN really has nothing on what men write online.
Be happy if you really didn’t know this, oh the innocence!!

TurnUpTurnip · 23/10/2021 14:01

[quote IWillFindYou]@stingofthebutterfly

”I wonder if there's a similar website where men frequently voice how rubbish their partners are.”

Yes. Yes there is.
Also filled with hatred, misogyny and violence againts women.
MN really has nothing on what men write online.
Be happy if you really didn’t know this, oh the innocence!![/quote]
I’ve seen post where people have said they wanted to punch / strangle their DH

OldScrappyAndHungry · 23/10/2021 14:04

Why do we have this 1984 narrative of Men Bad Women Good? As others have said there are poor female partners too. Obviously leaving out the domestic abuse statistics completely before anyone jumps down my throat, but I have people in my social circle who are awful to their husbands. It’s not a one way street. Why do we demonise all men?

OldScrappyAndHungry · 23/10/2021 14:04

Animal Farm not 1984! Hmm

SJWsAtItAgain · 23/10/2021 14:06

I've seen more than one post where someone said if all men died, it would be better. Some posters agreed and there were jokes about which way was better.

Yes, yes, all bantz. I'm sure some men would say the same.

Shehasadiamondinthesky · 23/10/2021 14:09

All of the men I've been out with have been a total waste of space, lazy and self absorbed. I don't have relationships now but then again at 60 I don't need one.
My son is a good person but then I had to work on that. My DiL thinks men's default state is let the woman do it but she wouldn't stand for that.

crackofdoom · 23/10/2021 14:10

SJWs yes, except that there is one huge, glaring difference between men joking about killing women and women joking about killing men, isn’t there? Which is that men actually kill women- in high numbers. Whereas women (with some rare exceptions) don’t kill men.

SunnyMustard · 23/10/2021 14:10

Aside from actual cases of space wasters:

  • People tend to see the speck in the husband's eye when they have a beam in their own.
  • Stories are told from the wife/woman's perspective here on mumsnet so obviously it will be biased from a woman's perspective and the woman will BR.
  • To work out relationship problems you usually start with the problem
  • Some women are massive whiners – love to nag and nitpick.
  • Our culture currently loves to hate men and our gut reactions is to defend women and play the victim

That being said, there are a lot of men out there with close to zero self awareness. This is why they get surprised when a women ask for a divorce "all of a sudden". Though most men I know are gold.

Redjumper1 · 23/10/2021 14:10

I work full time and all my married colleagues seem to spend their lunch breaks buying cards/presents for their DH entire families/stuff for kids hobbies/school stuff. They do way more cooking/cleaning/"wife work" even though they work full time. All their hubbies seem to have hobbies that take up weekends whilst the wife visits their MIL because "their mother should see the kids the same amount as her mother". In my estate all the men do cycling/golf/gym at weekends whilst the women are at home or going on walks with the kids.

I can't think of a single couple where the man is doing more and the woman is taking the piss. Not a single one!. None of these women would post on Mumsnet because they are happy with their lot. They see their husbands as the good ones.

I don't know many joined families/separated divorced couples tbh.

SJWsAtItAgain · 23/10/2021 14:14

@crackofdoom

SJWs yes, except that there is one huge, glaring difference between men joking about killing women and women joking about killing men, isn’t there? Which is that men actually kill women- in high numbers. Whereas women (with some rare exceptions) don’t kill men.
Oh no I don't accept hypocrisy or double standards!

Men who kill women are a total waste of space. Not the same thing.

Men and women who "joke" about violence against the other are the same. It either okay to joke about it or it isn't.

x2boys · 23/10/2021 14:15

@Redjumper1

I work full time and all my married colleagues seem to spend their lunch breaks buying cards/presents for their DH entire families/stuff for kids hobbies/school stuff. They do way more cooking/cleaning/"wife work" even though they work full time. All their hubbies seem to have hobbies that take up weekends whilst the wife visits their MIL because "their mother should see the kids the same amount as her mother". In my estate all the men do cycling/golf/gym at weekends whilst the women are at home or going on walks with the kids.

I can't think of a single couple where the man is doing more and the woman is taking the piss. Not a single one!. None of these women would post on Mumsnet because they are happy with their lot. They see their husbands as the good ones.

I don't know many joined families/separated divorced couples tbh.

You seem to know an awful lot about the ins and outs of your work colleagues,and neighbors lives ,I couldn't tell you what my next door neighbor,s has hobbies are and I have lived here six years and get along ok with them .
OnwardsAndSideways1 · 23/10/2021 14:15

@Redjumper1 don't worry, they pop up again 15 years later, bewildered that their wife divorced them, looking online for love, with pictures of them cycling/marathon running/paddleboarding every weekend, looking for someone to travel the world with, presumably whilst their wives get on with caring for the kids (age 9-18 by now) every weekend, doing the taxi service etc. Nothing changes. A few have 50/50 and I respect those men a hell of a lot more.

IWillFindYou · 23/10/2021 14:16

@Youseethethingis

Does nobody else have fathers, brothers, sons and uncles who they love for the wonderful, imperfect and unique humans they are? Where is the sense of loyalty? How can you possibly cast 3.5billion individual humans into the same bucket?
Honestly? No. I don’t know or have any men in my family who I would describe like this. What loyalty? Why would I own them that. All the’ve done is bully me.
IWillFindYou · 23/10/2021 14:17

@Yourstupidityexhaustsme

Of course. Now if they could return the favour.

Do they not already?

No.