To be upset that ds said this about Christmas?

[coffeerevelsrock]

He's 14 and has made a few comments recently about not liking Christmas. He's quite unusual for his age, not really a typical teen and loves history, cricket and politics. Not into expensive stuff so quite hard to buy for. He has an iphone 7 and insists he doesn't want an upgrade. He did ask for a gaming laptop a couple of years ago and is still very happy with it. Other than that all he's ever asked for is books though I get him some other thoughtful bits too that he's usually very pleased with. I'm aware that getting him loads of stuff he doesn't want would make him feel anxious and guilty so I don't do it.

His dad and I divorced 7 years ago and for the first 3 years ex came to our house for lunch on Christmas day. Since then they've stayed at dad's until the 23rd, seen him for a few hours on Christmas afternoon (except last year when he said he wouldn't be there) and then gone with ex to visit wider family 26th- 29thish. The rest of the Christmas holiday they're with me. Every year I ask what they want to do and they always say them same as usual.

We have our routines like most families, though from what I can see ex has never created any there. We get a real tree each year and dc help decorate - or do most of it now. We do a beige - everything - in breadcrumbs- lunch on the 24th, a walk late afternoon and back to Christmas eve bags from the elves, smashing up the gingerbread house for Christmas Eve pudding, always watch nativity and Father Christmas film after tea on Christmas Eve, stockings, multipack cereal for breakfast...just low key stuff but even at their ages (12 and 14) they insist on it all.

Now he keeps saying he doesn't like Christmas and that he won't ever spend it with me or his dad when he's an adult. He also said he thinks his dad's family do it well - they don't make a massive deal, don't decorate or wrap gifts, nothing traditional really. Extremely low-key. I just feel so hurt. I know he's young so it's not a pressing matter but I feel like everything I've tried to do has been thrown back at me. I have honestly tried to make it stress-free and accommodated their adulterous dad for 3 years. I honestly haven't tried to put pressure on but I feel instead of having happy memories he thinks it's all a pile of shit. He has pointed out I don't see my parents at Christmas ( we see them at new year) but my dad is an alcoholic (my kids don't know this as he manages to stay dry for the 3 days or so per year we see them) and my relationship is quite strained. They live 3 hours away too. I feel like my crap family has come back to haunt me despite it not really being my fault. I have mainly just laughed his comments off but I don't find it funny at all really.

AIBU to feel hurt by this?

@coffeerevelsrock

Well, I'm always pleased to see people saying my son is brilliant, and he is, generally. Not sure setting out to hurt someone's feelings is actually one of his more brilliant moments though!

I'm going to ask what he would like to do this year and won't make a fuss or a martyred face if he doesn't want to do the usual stuff.

I don't think he has set out to hurt your feelings. He's only expressing his own opinion -- he's not doing it "at you". You don't have to make it mean anything earth shatteringly devastating about your parenting or even his gratefulness for your parenting...

It's not about "you".

Well, he's growing up and developing his own view on things (which may change!) and also determined to be 'different' and not mainstream - I quite like that if it's authentic. It's easier to do the no-fuss Xmas at his dad's and maybe that just fits in better with his outlook at the moment.

Talk to your DC and form a plan for what stays and what goes. Tell them what it means to you. Teenagers do like to make dramatic pronouncements! I love to get away at Xmas so I may not be the best judge of how you keep a family tradition going but I'd say you can reshape it to suit him.

@TheKeatingFive

Does going for a walk and eating cereal normally exhaust you

🤣

Having to pretend enthusiasm for nativity, Father Christmas film and gingerbread house does sound exhausting to me. He's 14, not 4.

He may be at the age where it has lost the magic it has for small believers.
I would happily never celebrate Christmas, it’s all too much. I wouldn’t dare admit that to my adult daughter who collects sparkly reindeer.

I wonder if it's the shifting between homes that makes him uncomfortable. I mean there's not much you can do about it but I've had to shuffle between family members and it is an additional effort.

Nearer the time I'd do a list of activities and get them to tick off the ones they fancy. That hopefully you can cater for their individual needs and your own (Christmas isn't just for children).

And do NOT take it personally - he's finding his way of doing things and it's a good thing he talks to you even if you don't like what you hear.

By the way OP, your son sounds smart and interesting. I'm sure he would never really want to upset you. He's at the age where he needs more agency, and he wants to test out the limits to see what that feels and looks like.

By the way, I felt like this when I was 14... and I still do! In December my house stays tinsel-free and is my little clean, fresh, grown-up sanctuary from all the waste, noise and clutter.

But I'm still a little more grown-up than 14 - so I know how to pick my words carefully to make sure my family know I respect their choices. Tinsel makes my extended family happy in their own homes, and I love seeing them happy! Your 14-year-old doesn't have that ability to establish that kind of distance and self-agency yet, so I can see why he comes across as frustrated.

Maybe he'll grow up like me, or maybe he'll convert back to tinsel - it doesn't matter which! He'll still love you.

I loathe Christmas and have done ever since I was a teenager. One of the things that makes it worse is my mother complaining that I don’t appreciate all the effort she goes to. Well, no, I don’t. Because I have repeatedly explained to her that I don’t enjoy all those things, and while I am the scroogiest member of our family, none of the others particularly want all the bells and whistles either. She is the one who wants all the things, and chooses to do them, for a family that doesn’t want them.

I do sometimes still spend Christmas was my family, though I prefer not to and am much happier seeing them on other occasions. Your child is not rejecting you. He is learning to be his own person, and you have to let him. Christmas is not a good measure of family life and love.

YANBU to want your son to be like you, but YABU overall.

I think that there are plenty of people who hate christmas once they get past the age of 10 or 12. And there are plenty of people who just like their day to day lives and a special event of any sort of is an imposition.

@bridgetreilly

I loathe Christmas and have done ever since I was a teenager. One of the things that makes it worse is my mother complaining that I don’t appreciate all the effort she goes to. Well, no, I don’t. Because I have repeatedly explained to her that I don’t enjoy all those things, and while I am the scroogiest member of our family, none of the others particularly want all the bells and whistles either. She is the one who wants all the things, and chooses to do them, for a family that doesn’t want them.

I do sometimes still spend Christmas was my family, though I prefer not to and am much happier seeing them on other occasions. Your child is not rejecting you. He is learning to be his own person, and you have to let him. Christmas is not a good measure of family life and love.

well put

@mountbattenbergcake

I'd not show I was hurt but take him at his word.

• He just wants books? He gets books (and nothing wrong with an iPhone 7, I've still got an iPhone 5)
• don't ask him to help decorate tree
• he doesn't want the beige lunch on 24th? Tell him to help himself to beans and toast
• he doesn't want to do the walk? Go without him
• No Christmas Eve bag for him
• no smashing up the gingerbread house
• no wrapping his gifts

That would have been perfect for me at 14. And would now really. Not sure why you think it would be some kind of revenge or punishment.

Aw I kind of get where you're coming from. My son has Asd, he's 9 though and is incredibly factual. I asked what he wanted for Xmas this year and he's already worked out he wants cash only. I told him the budget was £100 and he's asked for £100 from me and £4 from my parents because this is the exact cost of the cinema trips he wants to make during the year. I said your younger brothers will have more to open and he said 'that's fine, you could get me a book if you want, but I'll get to go out for ages after xmas. I only like playing cards and darts anyway and the food' so I'm taking him at his word and doing a decent stocking. This is after his birthday when he asked for money but I got him a few small things to open. He was very grateful, but the day after at bedtime he told me how much he appreciated his things but that he would have preferred the money I spent on them instead. I was a little hurt as he's hard to buy for and I thought I'd done well, but now I'm glad he was honest. One less load of packaging and tat for landfill and charity shops aswell.

I understand why you are hurt but he'l come back round.

I felt like not bothering with Christmas any more when my son was a teen but now he's in his 20s with his own partner he's introduced most of the Christmas traditions I put in place for him when he was a child. It's really sweet. And so pleased that these things that I put so much effort into were appreciated and mean something to him.

I understand how hard it is when you feel you have been trying to do everything right and you ex who you feel hasn’t, is deemed by your dc to have done it best. That sounds challenging. However your son is being open with his emotions and experiences. Try to listen to him from a neutral place. He loves you enough to be honest with you.

My relationship is very strained with my mum, part of that reason is she never really listened when I told her my thoughts and feelings. Everything was the way she thought things should be, including Christmas. I hate gifts from her because they highlight how much she doesn’t accept or know me as a person. Every year I tell her I don’t need or want anything. Every single year she gives me a fortunes worth of stuff I’ll never use but will clutter up my house and cause me stress. I know it comes from a place of ‘love’ but it feels anything but ‘loving’.

He sounds cool, he knows his own mind. No excuse for rudeness though! I think you should tell him that he caused offence.

Scale it back this year if the 12yo agrees. It doesn’t sound “exhausting” but it does sound very precise. Sometimes traditions can feel too formulaic. Maybe be a bit more laid back?

I also think that he’s old enough to know the truth about your father.

I reckon that a chat is in order.

Please don't take this the wrong way OP but it sounds like he's outgrown your 'traditional' Christmas Eve and I wonder if you're clinging on to that pattern of doing things which does sound quite full on (and lovely) but lovely to a younger child. To a teenager it sounds a bit OTT and busy. Why not have a rethink, with him, about what Christmas Eve could look like.

"We get a real tree each year and dc help decorate - or do most of it now. We do a beige - everything - in breadcrumbs- lunch on the 24th, a walk late afternoon and back to Christmas eve bags from the elves, smashing up the gingerbread house for Christmas Eve pudding, always watch nativity and Father Christmas film after tea on Christmas Eve, stockings, multipack cereal for breakfast...just low key stuff but even at their ages (12 and 14) they insist on it all."

Sounds exhausting.”

It sounds lovely. You’ve created memories by doing stuff together instead of just a massive pile of presents under the tree. I’m sure he will appreciate it when he gets older and think back.

At that age I remember having one of those buttons that said ’F*ck traditions’. Then I went back to loving traditions again. 😂

I can understand that he prefers a much simpler Christmas elsewhere, and quite a wise choice. Lots of people set up their Christmas, to do far too much, things that they think you simply have to do , just because it's Christmas, as in all the rituals, that some people are not bothered about.

I don't think it's bad that he doesn't enjoy Christmas of that he's not materialistic, on the contrary. You should accept & respect him for who he is.
Also, what is true for him now may not be in the future.

I have a low key xmas, it suits me and sons aged 16 and 20. l refuse to force anything on them, it's up to them what they choose to do. As long as it's relaxing, we're happy.

For someone who likes quiet and low key - having to be cheerful to show appreciation to someone else's effort if exhausting!

It may be that he's tried for years as he knows the socially acceptable thing to do is just that but now he's older he's trying to communicate to you he doesn't enjoy it anymore the way you do it and wants to change. Teens don't always do conversation with tact!

I wouldn't be hurt. I'd just say that you understand the traditions have become something he doesn't enjoy and open up a conversation about what else you could do, how you could do it another way.

They are both at an age that they may actually have some ideas if some great alternatives!

I think it sounds lovely too @Zeev it's tradition and how memories are made. It's hardly OTT either when you hear other peoples Christmas plans.

This fills me with despair. I have tried not to replicate the relationship I had with my parents but I'm doomed to have a crap relationship with my adult children because I have one with my own parents?

Not read the full thread so not sure if this has been suggested but I think the book "The Book You Wish Your Parents Had Read: (And Your Children Will Be Glad That You Did)" by Philippa Perry might be really helpful for you.

But when are you planning to tell you DS about your dad being an alcoholic? One of my mum's parents had a mental illness and there was a very strained relationship between the two of them, and my mum hid it and so I never really understood why things were so awkward until I was an adult, it was confusing for me. I don't know why you are hiding it from him especially at 14, he should have an understanding and know how that impacted you growing up, and that's why (in his mind) you go a bit overboard with the traditions.

Maybe as he has a rep of being alternative , and apart from the usual teen grumps, and this rep has led him to reject tradition, materiLisim etc. Maybe he is reading politically, philophy or spirtituality, or about green issues which have led him to express these views as christmas can be seen as a time of access and materIsim.
? Also , i recall looking down on my parents ,almost arrogant ,thinking I knew it all at certain ages?

Is it possible he's mentioned his Christmas traditions in school and got the point-and-laugh response, so now he's decided he's too cool for it all?
Anyway, he is getting a bit old for it, so maybe leave the elf on the shelf and dig out Die Hard?
Also agree if he's old enough to notice the lack of visits to GPs, he's old enough to know the reason why.
Hope you work out between you all and have a lovely time