Please give it to me straight - am I a bad parent?

[NCJuly2021]

Posting on AIBU for traffic and also because there is a question of whether I’m reasonable or not.

I’m a FTM, to a nearly 4 month old. I do the majority of childcare. I exclusively breastfeed so since birth I have done all night feeds and wake ups. DS wakes between 3 and 5 times every night (plan to sleep train when he’s a little older). When DS was a newborn, DH helped for a couple of weeks with the night time nappy changes but then we slept in a different room because I realised I needed the TV on to get me through the night feeds (ie to stop me falling asleep whilst DS is on the breast). After a couple of weeks we came back to the bedroom and since then it’s just me who does all the night work.

It’s also just me who looks after baby Mondays to Fridays. DH will watch for 10 minutes every now and then in the mornings so I can shower, but that’s maybe once every couple of weeks. He also will watch him for 10 minutes in the evening so I can eat my dinner and then DS is back to me. DH has a very demanding job and he’s wfh but works very long hours.

On weekends, DH is very hands on with DS. I lie in on both days (DH is a natural early riser), he takes DS for walks so I can have some me time and we share looking after DS.

Re housework, we have a cleaner for cleaning, I do 80% of the laundry, and cooking is generally 60 / 40 to me.

When DS was small, he would usually go down for the night at 1am. We’ve now brought that forward to around 9.30 to 10pm and that’s where I’m happy with. Means we don’t wake up too early the next day, and DS isn’t alone for too long in the bedroom before I come to bed.

DH, however, is of the opinion that DS should be going to bed at 7-8pm, simply because that’s what babies do. My issue with that is purely selfish - I don’t want to wake up at 6am in the mornings and I don’t want to go to bed at 9pm either.

The issue is there have been 3 times I’ve been out late with DS and I end up like feeling the worst parent ever.

Once, I was at a friend’s house and left at 10.30pm.

The second I was at my parent’s house and left late, which meant I travelled on the train at 9pm.

The third was tonight, when I met a friend for dinner at 7pm and got home at 10pm.

Apart from those 3 times, I’m home with DS late evenings and the other very few times I have met friends, they come round to our home or we’ve met for lunch in the day.

So each time, DH has complained about DS being out late and I feel like an absolutely terrible parent. Honestly, I feel like shit. I need that time with friends to feel like myself but after DH comments about the time, I end up feeling like I’m neglecting my child. The way I see it, DS is still small and will fall sleep anywhere, but when he’s a few months older, he will need more of a routine and rigidity in his bed time but for now, it’s not the end of the world if his bedtime is 9.30 or he’s out and not in bed until 10.30pm.

Is that a normal way of approaching things or am I actually just a really bad and selfish parent? What is normal for a 4 month old?

Thank you for reading if you got this far.

@reluctantbrit

I may go against the grain here but I may also had the worst non-cot-sleeper ever.

Portable? Sleeps everywhere? Pah, they didn't meet my DD. She would be just totally overstimulated, refused to go to sleep and just would be a loud and cranky baby.

Saying that, that was for evenings, during the day I had a baby who loved to sleep in her pram for hours. Seems she had an in-built manual what to do where and when.

DD normally went to bed around 8.30pm, that was after we had dinner, she in her bouncer/playmat next to us. She then would have a wash/bath, story, song, milk and depending on age help with falling asleep or not.

But I also had a baby who would wake up around 6am regardless of what we did or how late she went to bed. So, the OP's life would be absolute havoc for us.

Oh the overstimulation!!

Yes, mine were both like little dynamos - the more they ran around, the more energy they seemed to have.

I wanted to SCREAM every time anyone (mostly MIL but lots of other people too) said smugly "they'll sleep well tonight" - no they bloody won't, they're too hyped up!

You are absolutely not being a terrible parent! Sounds to me like you're following your baby's needs while also giving your own mental health a boost, which is just as important.

I did similar when my first was little. I was at a house warming party where we were staying over and it was about 10.30pm and DS was sound asleep in my arms while everyone was chatting. One guy asked me, "when does he go to sleep?" I was confused and said, "well, he is asleep!" but the guy answered, "yeah, but like... properly asleep?" (he didn't have kids I might add!)

Some people have rigid ideas about what babies need, apparently based on what they see on TV, what "everyone does", and so on. Tiny babies don't actually need cots and noise machines and blackout blinds and routines. They need their mum and food on demand, so it sounds like you're doing perfectly!

I don’t usually comment but I loved it when our first baby was a newborn, we used to go for days out shopping, out for tea with them with our friends. I loved it as she just used to sleep and she was a very settled baby so was no bother. No way would I be putting the baby to bed at 6/7, my first used to go bed eventually at 8/9 and get up at 8/9 which suited me, once she was bigger the earlier evenings came.

He is being unreasonable ! Honestly for the first two years at least of my son's life, going out late in the evening just to GET him to sleep in the pushchair was a regular thing. I cannot count how many times we did it. With a baby, you do what you gotta do ! Baby dousnt care what the time is

I think the posts taking about babies sleeping everywhere are referring to the old baby who clearly does sleep without needing a dark room. Babies that don't aren't broken, they're just not the subject of this thread!!

I agree with lots of PPs. At that age make the most of it. Thats why many prams are ok for overnight sleeping.

*Ops baby, not old baby!!

youre not doing anything wrong. Youre striking a balance with keeping your own life and sanity which is really important. Tell your dh to give over

Some of dc do fall asleep anywhere and some need one place so maybe you'll be lucky?

Sorry I haven’t rtft but it might be worth pointing out to your dh that what British babies typically do is very different than what e.g. Spanish babies do in regard to bedtimes.
These things are socially constructed norms, generated by lifestyles, not driven by babies’ needs or development.

Yy make the most of it, ignore your dh it's ridiculous as soon as you get to Spain and Italy you'll be joined

sounds a bit risky getting on trains at 9pm alone with a baby.

What's the risk exactly?

You are doing nothing wrong OP, and I say this as someone who is an absolute slave to an early bedtime routine with young children! But babies are a totally different kettle of fish; it's perfectly normal for a 4 month old to go down late and have no routine if that's what works for you. Three late nights out in 4 months hardly seems chaotic or like bad parenting!

X post ^^

Personally couldn’t have a baby out that late, the same as I’d not have a 3, 6, 9 year old out that late. But that’s my personal preference and does it really matter if anyone but you and your partner believe you’re doing the right thing?

You'll end up with a much more manageable baby and child if you get them used to moving around now. Obviously full on chaos all the time isn't ideal but the odd late night, no problem. In most other cultures it's perfectly normal to take babes in arms out to dinner quite late.

Saying that, if your DH isn't happy could he but stay home with baby so you can go out?

What's the real issue here? It sounds like the times you have been outs you've been back more or less around 10pm when DS goes to bed anyway. So what's the issue with you going out? Is it somehow putting out your DH because he's normally working until late at night and so has to look after his own child instead?

I have 3, and each one has been so different in term of their sleeping patterns.
DD1 was so easy, she has a routine that worked for us that included bedtime at around 11.30pm that we gradually made earlier as she began to sleep longer stretches at night.
The others had earlier night start. In part, due to the fact that if I anyway was doing bed time for DD1, it made sense to have bedtime for everyone at the same time. Routines for bedtimes etc are mostly for the adult I find. Although, every baby is different, some do need the routine and others can't fit into one. We create the routine for them, so it makes sense that we create one that works for us and the baby we are looking after - and sometimes this means no routine at all!
If you are the main caregiver, then you do what works for you. Otherwise it is YOU that will suffer. If he wants it his way, then he should be the one to look after the baby.

No - enjoy the freedom you have at this stage when the baby is totally portable and not grumpy in the evening.

But - you may find your baby changes and you will get the hint they need an earlier bedtime.

With my first - he had to have bath, bottle, bed at 7pm from new born as he over tied in the evening and just screamed for hours otherwise.

This baby just wanted to be with us in the evening but at about 5 months he started getting really cranky so he now goes to bed at 7 with his brother.

So no I don't think it's bad to have a later bedtime or take your baby out

First of all no you are absolutely not a bad parent! When DS1 was small we would frequently take him out with us to restaurants etc especially in the summer when the evenings are long. They sleep anywhere at that age and I would make the most of it! It's not quite the same with a toddler!

However it sounds like you need time without your baby and your husband should support this. Yes it sounds like he works long hours but having your baby full time is also working really long hours.

Have you tried expressing? Get some milk in the freezer and organise yourself a night out or whatever it is that helps you unwind.

I forgot to add, my DS3, was a very fussy sleeper, and he only slept in the bassinet on the buggy until he was too big for it, at around 5/6 months (he's a big baby) and he still needs quiet and dark conditions for sleeping. But when he was sleeping in the bassinet it could be anywhere - including in noisy places. Every baby is different!!

You’re doing nothing wrong, sounds really nice to be honest. My 3 month old is easy and portable until about 6 at night which is when she has a 2-3 hour session of screaming, scrabbling and kicking whilst feeding. I would hate to be out of the house for that to be honest.

I have a bouncy chair for her to go in when I take showers etc. She doesn’t like being put down either (screams blue murder) but the bouncy chair hits the spot!

I must be terrible then I took my 4 and a half month old baby to Australia (twice in one year we went again at 7 months) . He was very chilled, eldest of my 4 and I liked he was ok to take places and slept in his pram as he got older the bedtime routine kicked in and some more routine. You can’t do the same with baby no2 as you then are at home for older child mine was 4 nearly going to school when ds2 arrived. You’re def not a bad parent, the time for routine will come, enjoy the phase

I used to have a pretty regular 'bedtime' between 7 and 8 most evenings, but we did go out a lot in the evenings, to friends and family or out for a meal or whatever and on those occasions we did bath and PJs, feed and put them down in their buggy sleepy and they came with us. As others have said, they're really portable at that age. But we opted for an earlier bedtime routine when at home because we wanted our evenings together back again.

I settled my ds into a routine at that point and it made a big difference to
His demeanour and my MH.

But ds was bottle fed so it’s different

All babies are different and if your baby is happily going down to sleep, not wailing with over tiredness then you’re doing a fine job

In my case, bringing his bed time earlier (7pm) meant he slept sooner and better and was a lot happier in himself

As Your baby grows, and maybe the expressing will come to help too, he should settle to a routine

When we lived abroad his bed time was about 9pm and he slept till 7am

Sometimes he’d be out late, but then I’d either prepare for it or let him catch up the next day with a longer nap at lunchtime

This is the time the routines start to form and I took my ds all over the world between 6m and 3yo and he would nap when he needed to.

Don’t worry about sleep training just yet

You’re not a bad parent, far from it.

I would say though that you should work towards carving out an evening for yourself and for dh to do the same- you need couple time too. This is important

You’re doing a great job!

Yes yes to the poster who commented that these are socially constructed norms. The British rigidity and obsession with 'routine' seems to me to be largely about keeping the baby separate, at (IMO) too young an age. When they're that tiny they need closeness to their parents and immediate responsiveness to their needs, not the holy trinity of bath-'story'-bed at 6.30pm in a dark room alone. That closeness and responsiveness, at that age, can be achieved on a train at 9pm just as much as it can at home. I, like others, think there's something else going on here, and IIWY I would be looking at my dh's attitude rather than my own parenting.

I also - having had three children, none of whom would ever have gone to bed at 7pm or even 8pm - think it's entirely fair enough to do what suits you and not become a slave to the 7pm bedtime if it means you're up for the day at 5am and that's your worst nightmare (though if you're a natural lark, why not?).