Is DS being an arse or am I nosey?

[Stirfriedbrian]

DS is 20, still lives at home, doing fine at his apprenticeship, drives, etc.

Since he turned about 16/17 he’s become very moody and defiant. He’s often very short and rude, not a bit helpful, won’t put himself out for any of us. For instance if you need a short lift somewhere he’ll be very evasive as to whether he can do it until last minute, he seems to love the power of you not knowing until last minute.

He’s very secretive, I have little clue who his friends are, I have no idea where he goes, he may just say he’s going bowling or to play snooker if your lucky to have him in a good mood that day.

He’s been out very late in the evenings lately and he’s let slip he has a girlfriend. Fine, I’m pleased for him. I asked the usual questions about her, where she’s from etc. That day he was obviously in a good mood as he volunteered the fact he’d booked a hotel tomorrow for them to have a night away.

I’ve just got in from work and casually asked whether tomorrow was still on and what hotel he was staying in.

Cue a big huff ‘here we go again, you’ve got to know everything I do, everywhere I go etc’ I’m just interested in his life! It’s common courtesy to say roughly where you’ll be I’d think, I don’t want a full breakdown of their itinerary, just an idea of where they are staying.

I reminded him that if he’s not mature enough to be open and honest about his whereabouts then maybe he’s not mature enough to do these things.

Apparently I’m not a ‘normal’ parent for asking.

By the way he lives at home rent free whilst he’s on his apprenticeship and he’s saving.

I feel I should tell him if he feels so secretive and childish maybe he’d be better off getting his own place, he can do what he likes without any questions then 🤯

She and I have a deal that she will email me the details of her holidays on the understanding it stays unread unless there is some kind of emergency.

People are mad!

For those who say it's just general conversation / chitchat...

Yes, that's what it should be, and if you've spent your life with appropriate freedom and privacy, that's what it is.

But if you've been questioned on almost everything since you were a child, it's not general chitchat. It may seem small, but it's yet another micro intrusion on your private life and it's absolutely stifling.

You can't understand if you haven't experienced it. If you can only see this as polite conversation, consider yourself lucky.

I reminded him that if he’s not mature enough to be open and honest about his whereabouts then maybe he’s not mature enough to do these things.

He’s 20! You don’t get to decide if he stays in a hotel with his GF or not.

But if you've been questioned on almost everything since you were a child, it's not general chitchat. It may seem small, but it's yet another micro intrusion on your private life and it's absolutely stifling.

You can't understand if you haven't experienced it. If you can only see this as polite conversation, consider yourself lucky.

Have you sought therapy for what happened to you? it sounds like you might need support 🌸

@RickiTarr

I reminded him that if he’s not mature enough to be open and honest about his whereabouts then maybe he’s not mature enough to do these things.

He’s 20! You don’t get to decide if he stays in a hotel with his GF or not.

missing the point entirely 😏

I remind my 18 year old sometimes that just because he’s an adult doesn’t mean he’s a grownup.

If he’s being secretive, staying out until all hours etc then I would be wondering if he had something to hide.

I wouldn’t be demanding to know or threatening to throw him out, but I think that when you live under the same roof a bit of common courtesy doesn’t go amiss.

My DS is 18 and although I don’t need to know where he is I do insist he tell me if he is going to be late home, and if he is out late that he lets me know he’s on his way back. Conversely if I was the one going out I would do the same.

OP’s ds sounds like he’s a rude little shit who is clearly taking advantage of the fact that he’s living at home rent free and his money is his own.

@QueenBee52

But if you've been questioned on almost everything since you were a child, it's not general chitchat. It may seem small, but it's yet another micro intrusion on your private life and it's absolutely stifling.

You can't understand if you haven't experienced it. If you can only see this as polite conversation, consider yourself lucky.

Have you sought therapy for what happened to you? it sounds like you might need support 🌸

Haha. @Snoozer11 is providing an alternative point, no need to be snooty.

Having said that, in my case, yes, I did seek therapy. It was incredibly helpful and my relationship with my mum improved immensely. It then further improved after I had DC1. It didn't make any of her behaviours okay, but it did allow me to see them from her point of view and to move on. Hence why people like Snoozer11 and me and others can see that while OP might genuinely be oblivious, it's not impossible to believe that she has been interfering and manipulating her son for years.

missing the point entirely

How so @QueenBee52 ?

With a twenty year old, your only jurisdiction is whether they live at home and what activities and behaviours you allow in your home. You don’t get to dictate their wider lives, especially not in “if you’re not mature enough….” tones.

That seems central to the dynamic in OP’s house.

@Snoozer11 yip, exactly what I was thinking. It’s not something I’ve experienced in my own house but I can imagine exactly the sort of controlling people that do that sort of thing.

My mother is very nosey, and asks a million questions in every conversation. it’s a pain in the arse but isn’t done in a controlling way. But if I told or asked her to back off, she would

I have an adult kid living at home. I expect the same sort of information back that I give out to kid and DH.

e.g. I'm going to so-and-sos. I probably won't be back for dinner, I'll call if I change my plans.

I'm going to be going to XYZ town tomorrow, I'll be leaving early and expect to be back before dinner.

I'm going out for dinner and to a movie.

I'm running errands in ABC area, I'll be gone a couple of hours. Do you need anything?

We made it clear that that is the respectful thing that adults living together do. I don't need a lot of details, just a rough idea.

Tell him he won't last five minutes with this girlfriend if he's as rude to her and, if he's earning payment from his apprenticeship then he needs to pay a small token amount of board or tell him to start buying his own food and cooking it and doing his own washing, if he wants to check out of household family chats.

@RickiTarr

missing the point entirely

How so @QueenBee52 ?

With a twenty year old, your only jurisdiction is whether they live at home and what activities and behaviours you allow in your home. You don’t get to dictate their wider lives, especially not in “if you’re not mature enough….” tones.

That seems central to the dynamic in OP’s house.

whether he goes or not with his GF wasn't the issue ...

In mumsnet nothing is anybody's business. You shouldn't ask friends or family anyhting. Not expect anyhting in return. If you are worried about a friend, don't talk to them, it's their problems. If you want to share something about your life, keep it to your self cause you shouldn't share your problems. 18 is adult so kids should be on their own. Also 17 is almost 18 and therefore you should keep out. And 16 is almost 17 so you should keep out. I wonder if people here ever have any conversations.

No, it's not OP's business. However, people living in the same household and being a family means having to share things. It's part of showing interest. Yes, it can be done over the top way but there is no indication of that. He sounds immature and maybe once he moves out the he can gain perspective and mature.

whether he goes or not with his GF wasn't the issue ...

Whether OP has the right to tell him not to, very much is part of the issue, though.

@RickiTarr

whether he goes or not with his GF wasn't the issue ...

Whether OP has the right to tell him not to, very much is part of the issue, though.

she didn't though ... did she ? or am I lost 🤣

Clearly.

@RickiTarr

Clearly.

Clearly

Look none of us know the OP, she may come across to her son as judgmental and nosey??
She knows a few things about him, that he has a girlfriend, where he goes most evenings what he doesn't need is the Spanish inquisition!

If DH goes out he tells me where he's going and roughly what time he'll be back. I do the same.

Jeez, I still have to text my mum to let her know I've arrived somewhere safely & I'm in my fifties & live in another country

If he wants to be secretive & rude, he can live elsewhere

Okay, let’s clarify a few things.

I have no problem with him having a girlfriend/, staying in a hotel, doing what the hell he wants to do.

All I expect is civility, a rough idea where he’s going and when he’s expected to be home. It would be nice to think we can chat about where he’s going - I’m pleased for him.

He’s living at home, rent free, his washing/ironing/food prepared for him. He does nothing at all unless asked - he will then do stuff to be fair.

We hardly ask for lifts but hoped he’d help by giving DD (his sister) a lift to work now and again to save us taking annual leave. He will not commit to helping just in case he’s asked to go out in the meantime, he wouldn’t stop any other plans to help us out.

He’s frequently rude and short, unless the mood takes him or another member of the family or friends speak to him then he’s like melted butter.

He seems to want to push back at me all the time. I’m treated with disdain or impatience most of the time.

Why are you doing an adult’s laundry?

Just step back generally. You’re feeling pissed off with his foul mood and bad manners. He’s probably feeling smothered and defensive. A tactical retreat is in order.

Twenty is a good age to redraw the rules.

He’s living at home, rent free, his washing/ironing/food prepared for him. He does nothing at all unless asked - he will then do stuff to be fair.

He's never going to grow up if you continue to treat him like a child.

OP,
I have 4 children around this age.

Whyare you accepting this bullshit?

Not in 5 life times would my husband and I accept what you have written.

Not a chance.

Teens can have attitude and be a bit off hand, but what you are accepting is truly off the scale.

He pays, contributes nothing and treats you like shit?

What are you teaching him about women, life, self respect, relationships?

You are doing him NO favours.

He pays for nothing and treats you like shit.

His bags would be packed and he would be getting the 🤚from me.

"Do not speak to me until you want to apologise".
"Move the hell out of MY home until you want to treat ME, your father and your family with respect".
" I don't care where you sleep, that is YOUR problem".
"Find somewhere else to live that will put up with your bullshit"

THAT is how you shoukd speak to your son.

I mean it very very kindly, but you have raised a brat, who is going to be a pig of a partner and a pig of a husband.
He has the makings of a shit father too.

Him confiding in you, is truly the very LEAST of your problems.

You have raised a pig.

It will come home to roost when he settles down with some poor woman.

If you care about him at all, you will take your husban aside and agree a plan to put manners on the little shit, and tell him to move out immediately if he doesn't do a 360 degree turn about with his attitude.

Totally non negotiable.

Otherwise help him pack his bags.

Apologies if I sound harsh, but you need to finally parent the scut you have raised.

How dare he treat his mother thus.