Absent father taking DS abroad

[Hopelessandlost]

Hi

DS is 3, his dad only sees him when he wants to. Ive always contacted him every other week offering different times, locations etc but he hardly shows up

He has never been in our son's life and even when he sees DS, he just talks to me about legal stuff and how I should contact the Home Office and tell them how he's a great dad, so they should let him stay here (came on a spouse visa which was curtailed due to our divorce, now he's trying to stay here on the basis of our son)

Anyways, he started talking about how he wants to take DS back to his home country for 3 weeks next year as his parents want to see him

Can he do this even though he hardly sees DS? Our son cries everytime his dad comes near him, he's non verbal so he cannot express himself. I want them to have a relationship which is why I always message him asking him to let me know when hes free

Solicitor is trying to put together an agreement for contact and has put supervised, then unsupervised..then overnights

Ex is saying 'hes wont die if i take him back home will he?' No but it would be great if DS was comfortable with him first

Is he allowed to force DS to go abroad even though hes pretty much absent and wont spend longer than 45 mins when he shows up?

No. Does you son have a passport. Make sure it’s locked away from where he cannot get to it.

No way. And I'd stop chasing him for contact too.

Simple answer- hell no would I allow this. For several reasons.

1. no meaningful relationship with the child
2. little effort made to have contact
3. current no leave to remain, and flight risk back to home country with child

Does your son have a passport? If not, get one so you have control of it. Is it a Hague convention country? If not, hard pass, ever, unless he takes you to court, and even then I'd still be fighting it. I would see him as too big a flight risk with your son

Where's his home country?

Not a hope in hell

Nope nope nope

That's a huge no from me.

Not a chance. He never sees him for more than 45 minutes and what to take him abroad? Not a chance.

Whose solicitor is drawing up an agreement? If its yours, stop it.

Don't go out of your way to try and formalise contact.

Is this even a country that it would be fairly OK, to get your child back from if he decides he isn't bringing him back?

His home country is India. I have DS's passport with me. He keeps saying 'i'm allowed to go with him, hes my son'

What happens if he just disappears in India with your son?

Not a chance! Have you read some of the stories in the press about mothers separated from their children abroad? I second holding on to his passport, I think there's even a way of ensuring you dc cannot leave the country, you speak to the home office and state your concerns. Stop facilitating this waster.

Absolutely not. I’d call up and put a block on your child’s passport so he can’t apply for it / a new one, and if he has one hide it at a friends. Stick to the supervised for x months before he takes him anywhere plan. He only wants a visa, and telling you he won’t bring back your son would get you to write whatever he wants to the home office.

No way, because his parents told me 'you better hand over our grandson' and I worry he will never come back.

He's basically taking me to court - because his visa was cancelled and he had to make a court application to show he wants to see his son, and they shouldnt send him back home

His solicitor also sent my solicitor an agreement and said if its agreed before the court date, we wont need to go court. So my solicitor has made changes so its fair to our son

At this point im happy to go to court, especially now that hes saying this

If he doesn't have leave to remain then it is unlikely that he would be able to return to the UK if he went to India

Letting your son's grandparents meet him is fine, but I would insist you came with him to India, you remain with him at all times etc.

Delaying until at least age 5/6 is preferable and that his dad establishes a proper relationship. Does his dad have strong ties to the U.K.? I know several families in your position and whilst trying to flee with the child is a risk, it's not always the case, just that they genuinely want them to meet family. A blanket no way implies every expat is trying to abduct that simply isn't the case

I guess i worry that the court will see me as being too precious and will allow him to go off. Im actually really worried now

Not a chance in hell. And no, he's not entitled to do this without your consent. Please read through the advice here: www.reunite.org/

Could his family not come to the UK to visit your son?

My concern would be if he didn't bring him back, seen this a few times !!! Say no and stop contacting him!

Absolutely NOT. You’ll never see your son again.

NOT A FUCKING CHANCE IN HELL!!
Speak to your lawyer urgently. You can get your son’s passport flagged so he can’t be taken out if the country.
Also, does your ex have an Indian passport for his son?
He has no leave to remain and wants to take your son to India?! He won’t be back.
Sorry to be harsh, but no no no.
Don’t sign any “agreement” drawn up by a solicitor that has not been ordered by a judge.
I’m actually terrified for both you and your son here,

Not a chance. Alarm bells would be ringing for me that he even wants to take him. And INDIA? In light of Covid why why why? You'd risk him keeping DS there, either on purpose or because of the pandemic. No.

Plus it's not fair on DS even if your ex is absolutely planning and able to bring him home. He barely knows this man and now he must travel to a completely different country with him, different culture, different language, different everything.

NO NO NO.

You can't do that to a 3 year old. Stop doing what your ex wants, for the sake of your son. And it's really not in the best interests of your sons to chase his Dad either. Really. Don't.

Stop chasing him for contact, it's his job to chase you and for him to make himself available. He has shown you 100% who he is. His parents have told you 100% what they want. They want their grand son. They want him in India. His dad wants him in. You chasing him like a sad little puppy trying to force him into seeing his child means that he will then have a C relationship with this child and then will get overnights and entirely even be allowed to take him out of the country.

For god sake listen to your child. They don't like him, don't want to be around him etc. Stop forcing this relationship and make him go to court where you can answer HONESTLY that the dad doesn't bother, rarely turns up, threatens to keep his son in India etc.

@Hopelessandlost

His home country is India. I have DS's passport with me. He keeps saying 'i'm allowed to go with him, hes my son'

For Your child’s sake keep him away from your child and lock up that passport. You will not see him again if he takes him home. I know of 2 Indian cases, 3 Iraqi cases and there’s more. Don’t be so dim. There’s lots of stories out there of women who lost their children to fathers who took them to see grandparents.

Sorry I agree with everyone. I've actually seen (through work) abduction cases. Sometimes the parent who stayed home gets the child back, sometimes not, but it's always messy and traumatic for the child. If the GP want to see the child they'll have to come and visit. I wouldn't even offer to go with your child.

I might have answered differently if he was a devoted dad but he clearly doesn't care aside from getting his visa. I'd go to court.

Stop contacting him to facilitate visits to your son.
Let him make ALL the effort.
Don't engage with conversations about him taking your son "home" - change the subject whenever it's mentioned.
Hide son's passport.