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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Absent father taking DS abroad

179 replies

Hopelessandlost · 06/07/2021 14:03

Hi

DS is 3, his dad only sees him when he wants to. Ive always contacted him every other week offering different times, locations etc but he hardly shows up

He has never been in our son's life and even when he sees DS, he just talks to me about legal stuff and how I should contact the Home Office and tell them how he's a great dad, so they should let him stay here (came on a spouse visa which was curtailed due to our divorce, now he's trying to stay here on the basis of our son)

Anyways, he started talking about how he wants to take DS back to his home country for 3 weeks next year as his parents want to see him

Can he do this even though he hardly sees DS? Our son cries everytime his dad comes near him, he's non verbal so he cannot express himself. I want them to have a relationship which is why I always message him asking him to let me know when hes free

Solicitor is trying to put together an agreement for contact and has put supervised, then unsupervised..then overnights

Ex is saying 'hes wont die if i take him back home will he?' No but it would be great if DS was comfortable with him first

Is he allowed to force DS to go abroad even though hes pretty much absent and wont spend longer than 45 mins when he shows up?

OP posts:
Pinkdelight3 · 06/07/2021 14:49

ABSOLUTELY NOT.

He does not want to see your son. He's demonstrated that time and again. He wants a visa and is using your son to that end. There's also an element of pleasing his parents. Beyond that, he does not give a shit.

Stop pushing for contact - it's clearly not helping your DS anyway, do not tell the Home Office he's a good dad - if you talk to them at all, be clear he's a shit dad who wants a visa, and do not under any circumstances let your DS go to India with him. Unlike a PP, I also wouldn't take DS there myself. If the parents want to meet him, they can come to visit here when covid restrictions allow. If they can't be arsed, why should you? Take care of your DS and don't fall for any crap.

titchy · 06/07/2021 14:49

Why does your solicitor seem to be going along with contact? Or am I misunderstanding? If I'm not you need a new solicitor pronto, one who is well versed in international custody disputes from non-Hague countries.

BunnyRuddington · 06/07/2021 14:51

I wouldn't even be letting him have him under those circumstances. If he wants to see him, in this country I'd be telling him to apply through the Court.

Is there a Child Arrangement Order in place?

GertietheGherkin · 06/07/2021 14:53

OP I have much experience with this situation. Do not under any circumstances whatsoever let your Son leave the UK. Especially not with his Dad. You need to contact Reunite and get help and support.
You will never see your Son again if you allow your Son to leave.

trevthecat · 06/07/2021 14:55

Absolutely not. Stop all contact now, only through solicitor. And hide that passport

ReallyRatherBlonde · 06/07/2021 14:57

Oh my god no! Not a chance in hell. Aside from any of the other completely valid reasons other posters have said above, the fact that your son is not comfortable is enough - I can't imagine how he would feel in a place he doesn't know, surrounded by other people he doesn't know, with a man he barely knows and doesn't like. For both of your sakes do not let this happen. I'd stop pushing contact too personally - a come-and-go Dad how you have described is worse than no Dad in my opinion.

Teacupsandtoast · 06/07/2021 14:58

I remember your previous post. If he takes your child to India, you'll never get him back

LobotomisedIceSkatingFan · 06/07/2021 14:58

It's not as simple as hiding the passport, either. You need to inform the Passport Office that you fear he may apply for a second one.

Polkadots2021 · 06/07/2021 14:59
  • stop all contact immediately unless required through court
  • flag his passport
  • hide his passport
  • find out if he has Indian issued passport

Be really careful OP!

GenuineKlatchianPottery · 06/07/2021 14:59

OP. I was “lucky”. It took me 4 months to get my children back. Hague Convention, High Court, CAFFCASS. Four months of gut wrenching hell for me and my DDs.
India is not a signatory of The Hague Convention.
Do not let your child go, look into an all ports alert on their passport. Contact reunite.org they have lawyers who specialise in parental abduction. Ordinary family law lawyers generally don’t know enough about it.

iwantalicencetocrenellate · 06/07/2021 15:02

No way on earth would I allow this. You will never see your son again. It happened to an ex colleague of my husband - father took her son to Pakistan, and she never saw him again until he was 20. 16 years without her child.

BunnyRuddington · 06/07/2021 15:02

God Genuine, I can't begin to imagine what hell that must have been for you Thanks

NewlyGranny · 06/07/2021 15:03

I would ask your bank to keep DS's passport in a safe deposit box. And given that he is already talking about taking the child out of the country - which he can't legally do without your consent, btw - I would not be facilitating unsupervised contact unless it was ordered by the court.

You might never see your child again. Sorry, but this happens and it ruins lives.

QueeniesCroft · 06/07/2021 15:05

The father you want for your child doesn't exist. His actual father is not capable of becoming that man, not does he want to.

The man he actually is, makes your child uncomfortable or afraid. Don't get so tied up in wanting to be one of the "good" mothers, who doesn't prevent their child from having a relationship with their father, that you can't see that the "good" thing to do in this situation is actually to keep them as far apart as possible!

Sometimes, wanting to be fair and reasonable is a dangerous thing.

SD1978 · 06/07/2021 15:05

Also, not a bauble convention country, I believe. Less that no chance of having him returned if his dad didn't want to.

notthemum · 06/07/2021 15:06

I haven't RTFT. I know, I know. I'm sorry.
Stop chasing him to to have contact with your son. Make certain that he cannot access passport, birth certificate or anything else.
Do not ever sign anything . As your child lives with you he would only be able to take him with him if you wrote a letter agreeing to this.

FlyingBattie · 06/07/2021 15:06

Stop trying to facilitate contact, let him take you to court if he wants contact, as a first step.

Is there a risk he has or can get an Indian passport for your son?

MinervaMcGonagall45 · 06/07/2021 15:06

It is in your DS’s interests for you to go to court and have a legally binding agreement re contact with your ex. It should clearly state that your ex is not allowed to remove him from the UK in any circumstances.

In the interim, hide his UK passport somewhere safe where your ex would be unable to access it eg with a friend/ relative.
Has your ex applied for an Indian passport for the child? If so, he is a flight risk.
If your DS goes to India you will never see him again. Your ex would not be able to return to UK without Leave to remain even if he wanted to.
Do not go to India with your ex. You will find it much more difficult to defend your rights there.
Also, given your DS’ age, your ex would only have to drag out proceedings for a few months and India would become your DS’ country of habitual residence. You would then find it even more difficult to bring him home.

Original poster
Hopelessandlost · 06/07/2021 15:08

I totally get what you are saying about not pushing for contact with a man who clearly does not care

My solicitor told me I need to keep offering days as it could go against me in court if I dont, seeing as they have applied to the court already. He said the judge will most likely say every other week etc so its better I just start from now

I know what I need to do now. Im going to stop with the agreement, and offering contact...and go to court. I will explain that he does not show up, and is only using DS for a visa because thats the truth

Thank you all by the way

OP posts:
FakeColinCaterpillar · 06/07/2021 15:09

Stop facilitating contact, tell him to go to court if he wants it. He wants to use your child to gain residency.
Follow all the advice about passports. You need to step up and protect your son!

Sharkology · 06/07/2021 15:10

NO and FFS make sure he does not have an Indian passport for DS as well...

Flag it up now with all the authorities, get legal advice and get a court schedule for contact. If he has got your son an Indian passport you are a bit fucked to be honest as he could just take him - don't raise it with him directly but perhaps ask the Indian Embassy whether he has.

This has actually made my stomach turn.

BunnyRuddington · 06/07/2021 15:12

Only just seen your updates.

Exactly what does the Consent Order specify?

You know that if you have an agreement that's not from the Court it's meaningless don't you?

Even if it's a Court Order saying that the child lives with you, it can't be enforced if he's taken your child to India and won't ring him back.

His DPs have made it quite clear "just hand him over". They see you as an inconvenience stopping then from brining you their DGC.

I'd stop all contact and do not sign anything until you've spoken to reunite Thanks

1forAll74 · 06/07/2021 15:12

No, mainly because of some horror stories that you read about such issues,and of course the lack of attention that your partner shows towards your son.. Some people from different cultures take a different view on family things. I am not sure I would even accompany this man and your child and go to his country anyway.

BunnyRuddington · 06/07/2021 15:14

And if he is going for contact, make sure your Solicitor pushes for Supervised Contact.

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