Bitchy mums at school

[Iamcatwalk]

Ok, long story cut short. My kid is in a school ( particularly in his class) where mums insist too much on socialising. There’s is group of four mums who are bitchy and quite snobbish. These mums when together wouldn’t talk to me but if I meet them separately, three of them are quite nice to me. When we gather together in a party ( they talk through eyes ), not a single of them say hello or acknowledge my presence. I tried my best to be good with them for years but now recently it feels like it’s NOT ME actually, it’s THEM. I thought I am not trying enough. They also try to include others with them and try every possible way to make me alone and miserable. They are very good with other mums or any new people for that matter. I am Asian so is it just because of my skin colour that makes them hate me or something else ? I can’t believe what happiness people get by making other people feel so miserable. Are they not happy in their life so they feel happy after bitching about others ? Seriously can’t understand at all. Help me with your views and opinions.

Myself and an in law are white & have had this off other female relatives.

It’s always done in a sickly tinkly toned voice too 🙄. Their just women who haven’t got past the age of 14 mentally.

Honestly, @Emilyontmoor, I'd say it was equally possible to explain it as the fact that when they're together, the four of them who are specific friends are more focused on their interaction with one another than on making eye contact with someone they barely know and appear not to like.

I mean, what strikes me here is that these four women clearly don't like the OP, and she doesn't like them either, as is very plain, but she still seems to be looking for some kind of acknowledgement from them, or to want them to conceal their dislike when she meets them, as she clearly does. And this has all been going on for years...?

The reason they smile at OP when alone but blank her when with the group is that it is a group behaviour, and they know the rules

Yes this is true. It's interesting to see how some people behave in groups. They're such cowards, they are scared the group will turn against them. It's pathetic.

@Emilyontmoor

Posters on here saying this behaviour is not intentional are seriously missing the point, or perhaps they have some skin in the game. Exclusive behaviour like this is always intentional. By setting themselves norms and excluding those who don’t conform these women (and girls, since it is a continuation of classroom behaviour) are propping up their self esteem with illusions of superiority. The reason they smile at OP when alone but blank her when with the group is that it is a group behaviour, and they know the rules.

It is always rude not to return a smile and a greeting, it is pretty automatic for those of us who are inclusive. To not do so is intentional, and it happens at every school gate and in every classroom in the country!

But it’s not always intentional. And I doubt anyone on here knows the op so unlikely anyone has skin in the game.

I have been honest about my own behaviour, which could have come across like this,

I’d pull up at school, for whatever reason. If say I was early for pick up, I’d walk to the nearest and largest group of mums I recognised snd chat. I would not walk about smiling and waving to every mum en route like I was the queen. If I caught someone’s eye I’d smile or nod or say hi. Past that I’d just be walking over and not looking,

Now that could be construed as deliberately blanking someone I’d prev said hi to as I was in a group, but the truth was I was just not paying attention. In most schools there’s a lot more than four other kids in the class. And often many year groups, so lots of parents around.

So if the op was standing watching me she’d possibly think I’d deliberately blanked her, in reality it’s just lack of attention snd thoughtlessness,

Plus truth be told although I’m quite extroverted and confident, even I wouldn’t walk about waving and saying hi to everyone like I was the queen on a royal visit. You just walk over to where you’re going. It’s fairly typical behaviour. In my daughters whole school career I never once saw any parent get out their car and walk around smiling and saying to every single parent they recognised.

@Iamcatwalk

Mind it these women are working mums but when they open mouth, they only talk shit or about wine. Nothing else !

Maybe they sense you aren't really interested in what they are talking about so don't bother any more?

Because of your culture, you have a more gentler way of how you treat and respect people in general. Sadly you are always going to meet people, in some groups, who are not in the same mindset as you. It is best, that you don't get concerned,or worried about some people who are unfriendly towards you. They are not worth bothering with,if they appear rude and unkind, and you can never trust them.

I dont think you should take the party thing to heart as anyone can forget to cater for someone when theres a huge party to organise and really it was their childs party so parents are least of the worries. You can take a bottle or non alcoholic something next time, you shouldnt see that as being mean. The photo thing isnt nice, thats weird. You should move them off your radar of care, it doenst help to dwell on things but find a nicer group, surely there are some others to chat to?

Bluntness I am not talking about the normal interaction of parents going about their business at the school gate. I am talking about the members of the clique that has existed in every year in every school my DCs attended. They will walk past you at the school gate when passing one on one in the pavement and not return a smile even with eye contact to the extent it is bizarre, and yet bestow a big greeting on you in Waitrose and engage you in their latest peev project at the school. Only out of the other shoppers in Waitrose do you emerge as a possible source of social capital but at the school gate you count for nothing! That is part of a wider pattern of exclusive behaviour. Motherland nailed it, together with the root cause being insecurity.

It has never bothered me as there have always been nicer more inclusive parents to interact with but it is interesting to observe as the rules are remarkably consistent.

By skin in the the game I mean that I wonder if there are posters who embrace a chance to be part of an exclusive clique, not necessarily OPs Fab Four.

I think the issue is that OP feels it is something she is doing wrong whereas actually they need women they can actively exclude to prop up their illusions of superiority.

@Emilyontmoor. Ok that’s not something I’ve ever experienced or witnessed so will take your word for it.

Emily could thatnot just be that on a drop off they have a million things on their mind and not in the world of saying hello/not had their coffee yet etc rather than in waitrose where its lovely to say hello? I have defo blanked people without meaning to in the school run chaos - Im sure its overthinking it to think it being mean.

No they don’t have hundreds of things in mind. They are always curious to know what’s happening, whose kids are going on a play date with who ? Who is doing clubs and who are not ? Etc etc

They also secretly organise some dinner out or coffee mornings and exclude me but make sure that I somehow should know about it.

They dont have to include you if they happen to have a small friendship group. It sounds like they are a small group who like each other and have probably got no idea you want to be a part of that friendship. They are not "excluding you" they are just making plans as friends.

You sound quite focussed on these particular 4, maybe just move on and hang out with someone else?

And I am not overthinking. You don’t know my position so it’s very easy for you to assume. Only I know what I have went through. I am not stupid to talk bout it and making it a rage over here. Thousands of unpleasant things happen in lives but I never go talking or even bother about it. This specific issue i posted here is because it happened to such extent that I couldn’t keep it to myself.

Bluntness Perhaps it is particularly a affluent south east thing? It is tied up with snobbery and also in many cases being new money (not that there is anything wrong with that unless it gives you a point you feel you have to prove).

Please read all my posts. Why would I bother if these 4 go around and have coffeee together. When it supposed to be al class coffee morning then I should be included too. That’s it !

scully No. Actually in Motherland there is a scene where Amanda does just that. Sharon Horgan did really send up the behaviour very accurately. My DDs recognised it all as well and commented just how awfully those women behaved.

And I was the working mum careering up to the school gate with a million things on my mind. If I noticed it it must have been obvious!!

I think what most of the cliques in primary schools, and the parents who feel excluded by them don't realise is, once your children are in secondary school, all of the ridiculous things they did whilst their kids were in primary school don't matter and were completely fruitless. I wouldn't waste any energy on this. Smile and say hello if you see them, and then carry on. You don't need to pay them any attention. But for all the time you're spending thinking about them now, it seems you care too much, which is probably what they want.

There is a big difference between genuine friendship groups and cliques. In dc1 class there was a group of mums who were friends but you knew if you approached them or said hi, they'd respond and be friendly. In dc2 class, there is a group of mums who are most definitely a clique...they are not just friends, they are a group who deliberately exclude others. If you haven't experienced it then count yourself lucky.

Because they asked in group what they would like to drink. Everyone said wine or Prosecco but I mentioned I don’t drink so anything that Is non alcohol.

Absolutely right ! Someone who hasn’t experienced this should consider themselves lucky. But these things happen - it’s a REALITY

I always remind myself I have done my time at school, there are of course some mums who want to be the most popular one in the playground but I don't entertain that shit.

There's always a bit of this,I just ignore it. There's a small group of mums of kids in my sons class, in my first year I would try and say hi, be friendly etc, mostly got ignored, so now I just don't bother talking to them and head straight to my own friends!

At a party if only alcohol was offered the non drinkers I know would just cheerily say "no booze for me thanks! Can I have a glass of water/cup of tea would be lovely if there's one going".

I really doubt it is about race, honestly. It could be cultural differences, if perhaps you grew up in another country or in a very homogenous community with it's own specific ways of doing things. I have a good friend from eastern Europe and she initially struggled to make school gate friends as she had different expectations about what was intended in certain situations, there was a bit of language barrier etc. In time she got past it and now is well liked and has a couple of very close mates at the gates.

They will walk past you at the school gate when passing one on one in the pavement and not return a smile even with eye contact to the extent it is bizarre, and yet bestow a big greeting on you in Waitrose and engage you in their latest peev project at the school.

So in waitrose you just breezily say "sorry, in a bit of a rush today, can't chat" and bustle off. People can only do this to you if you let them.

NoIDon’t Well I would if I was in a hurry, but actually as a working mum it was sometimes useful to hear what was peeving them at the school gates. I really didn’t care enough to respond in any other way than I would to any other parent.

OP Are you in an area where competition for secondary schools is an issue? If so beware Year 5 and 6 and develop an iron skin. It becomes way more unpleasant and competitive.