People who have nannies and cooks around the clock etc

[claramonica]

I know this is unreasonable and none of my business and also not my place to make a judgement on.

But people who have nannies from basically day one and cleaners- do they really know what parenthood ( especially baby stage ) is actually like for people who don't have that ?

@Yetano

I don't know what that would be like to have multiple staff any more than I know what it would be like to strap my baby to me and spend 14 hours picking tea leaves, or sewing clothes for UK customers or walking miles to get water. They're all along a spectrum of difficulty.

This!

I remember feeling so incredibly grateful I could afford a lactation consultant and how hard it must be for new mums who can’t

And I remember my pretty skint friend telling me she felt so lucky to live within walking distance of a 24hr Asda and how hard it must be for new mums who had to drive to the shops, or couldn’t nip out if they ran out of nappies or formula in the middle of the night.

We all live on a spectrum of enormous privilege compared to many people in the world, and who have gone before us.

I don’t think we need to pick on a tiny group now, when none of us have to worry about the malnutrition, diseases and starvation facing millions of mums around the world, and those who were only a few generations before us in the UK

@Hallyup6

People who can afford nannies and cleaners etc. generally have no idea what it's like to live in the real world.

You see I find this such an inane comment. Their world with its nannies and housekeepers is every, single bit as real to them, as your world is to you.

I remember some going back to full on 12 hour a day city jobs and thinking thats so different to me who wanted to the direct experience of raising a child. However they will definitely earn more than me! Some of us work very long hours for little pay with no help. We still bath out kids and put them to bed each night.

I've never had a nanny for my children, wouldn't be able to afford one. However I've met many who have including now grown children who had nannies take care of them. Apart from the very odd one, all parents have still done tasks such as bathing and bedtime. Having a nanny does not equal no interest in your children.

People who can afford nannies and cleaners etc. generally have no idea what it's like to live in the real world

Go and have a look at the dollar street project. It's great. You learn interesting things, like that , globally, an "average" family shares a toothbrush between all of them. The poorest people in the UK are some of the richest people in the world.

It's all the real world.

@DysmalRadius

Does a parent raising in a child in relative affluence and safety know what parenting is 'really' like for someone raising their children in a war zone, or during a natural disaster, or even in the same city but in severe poverty? Surely there's nothing inherently superior about experiencing hardship as a parent when you can avoid it?

Every other thread on here is about fathers who know nothing about their children's activities, shoe sizes etc because they leave it all to the mother to manage.

A parent that acknowledges that they don't want to deal with uniforms and meal planning and chooses to pay a professional to take on those tasks seems preferable to the status quo that so many families fall into whereby it all becomes the mother's job on top of everything else.

Well said. Many different forms of parenting. And we all don’t understand how hard/easy it is for the other person.

@AvantGardening

The thing is you’re saying people who have nannies, but you mean mother’s who have nannies.

My husband works full time and I’m home with the toddler. His experience of parenthood is exactly what it would be if we had nannies and other household staff. It’s just I’m the staff. And no one is judging him for that.

It’s just another stick to beat women with and keep them in their place (below men).

I wish Mumsnet had a like option! Like, like, like! So true.

It’s like a martyr competition on here sometimes. And in real life. Like you’re only worthy of anything if you have it hard. Is it envy?

@Hallyup6

People who can afford nannies and cleaners etc. generally have no idea what it's like to live in the real world.

I have a nanny, a cleaner, a dog walker. My kids are 2 & 6. I work full time as the head of legal for a large company & DH has a similarly senior role. I get up in the night to my kids and front up at assemblies, school sports days etc.

I grew up in a family with very little money, I remember mum’s card being declined at the supermarket and having to leave a trolley full of groceries, not being able to fix the hot water cylinder when it broke and having to have cold showers in the middle of winter. That experience has been a driving force for me in my career to ensure my kids will never experience that. I am well aware of how lucky and privileged my life is now.

It's got to make a difference having someone even doing your cleaning. Before I wfh weekends were taken up with cleaning, gardening and shopping. Most weeks now I fit it all in the week ie using my travel or lunch times. My weekends are mine now.

I'm a nanny (now with my own small children), and I think it's different strokes for different folks. Ive worked full time for people who don't work themselves, full time for people who work very hectic jobs and also park time for people who work part time. They ALL love their kids and know what parenting is about. They are good parents (sometimes mediocre employers but that's a different matter!) and their kids have secure attachments regardless of how long they spend with me as opposed to their parents. It's no different to sending kids to nursery full time and having a cleaner, but people don't have such an issue with that. 'Nanny' seems to trigger weird responses from people who don't have one themselves. It's also mums that seem to draw the short straw and receive the majority of the negativity with the 'outsourcing'. Dads can not work and have a nanny at home but no one really cares.

People who can afford nannies and cleaners etc. generally have no idea what it's like to live in the real world.

What utter bollocks. Many people who can afford those types of things didn’t start out having that money automatically or coming from families that did.

@AvantGardening 100% yes.
Women are our own worst enemies

This thread feels like it is just trying to pull other women down.

We all make individual decisions based on what works for our family, what we can afford and we were are comfortable with everyday. There are plenty of 'normal' mums who parent in a way that I wouldn't but that doesn't mean I get to judge them or make out my way of doing things is better.

How about we just build each other up for once rather than trying to knock each other down.

Op wasn’t asking about normal families with normal average childcare practices. I have been a nanny employer when my kids were young and also had and have a cleaner. She was asking about what people who have round the clock assistance understand about normal parenting. I think it’s a valid and interesting thing to wonder.

It is, @Foxhasbigsocks, and there have been some thoughtful replies digging into the idea that it's all relative, so i think it's been answered. Round the clock paid help may be comparable to someone with little money but loads of family support, or part time support compared with none; the idea that doing the cleaning and cooking for your child is somehow a realler experience of parenting doesn't bear much examination; and in the grand scheme of things and the sweep of history, the level of affluence and attention from parents that all our children get now is very unusual and at a high level.

@Octopuscake yes cleaning and cooking are not relevant. But doing normal things like bathing, dressing, putting to bed are parts of parenting. If your only experience of parenting is playing games happily with your child and you let paid staff take over anytime your DV are unhappy or awkward or difficult, you have a more superficial relationship with your child.

I am defensive 😂

My mum recently remarked on the “stream of servants at my house”. I was stung! Of course I don’t treat my nanny or cleaner as servants, I don’t come from privilege and I try to bend over backwards to be a good employer but I do feel awkward about it. I couldn’t manage my job/household/kids without them - I don’t have any practical family support so I out-source everything.

@claramonica

I know this is unreasonable and none of my business and also not my place to make a judgement on.

But people who have nannies from basically day one and cleaners- do they really know what parenthood ( especially baby stage ) is actually like for people who don't have that ?

I would say of course they know thats why they have the help, and why shouldn't they good luck to them, im not sure what ur implying but it does sound nasty. And i dont have a nanny or cleaner.

You know there are people in some cultures who are surrounded by all their female family members for months when they have a baby - they cook for them, help care for the baby and clean the house. The mother in law will sometimes take over the child rearing . Not very different to having cleaners and nannies except unpaid . Having support doesn’t make you less of a parent . I think all mums could do with help and support with babies.

Also add i was a nanny

In many ways life is easier if you have money.
Is that really a surprise to anybody?

Surely the hardships are part of the experience.

What the fuck is the point in having children if you don't want to spend any time with them?

@Tossblanket

Surely the hardships are part of the experience.

What the fuck is the point in having children if you don't want to spend any time with them?

What counts as a hardship?

If you find breastfeeding really easy, have a good sleeper and a baby that takes to weaning, does that make you less of a mother than one who has a reflux baby who howls 24/7 and becomes a fussy eater?

Hardships do not make you a parent
They just make the experience of parenting harder than it would otherwise be

It's like Monty Pythons' Yorkshire Businessmen sketch on here.

Women throwing mum guilt at other women.

Saying that 'You're not a proper mum ( like me) because you don't hoover.' is appalling.

Women putting down other down, keeps all women down.

The only winners here are men. Anyway, carry on.