To say women can have it all?

[BlossomOnTrees]

1. A strong and loving marriage or relationship
2. Gorgeous kids
3. Financially stable with lots of extra left over
4. Close family and friends
5. Fantastic and high paying job.

allfurcoatnoknickers sounds like you’re fortunate enough to have a child who sleeps. 7pm bedtime is a distant dream for me! If DS goes to sleep by 9pm it’s a very good night, otherwise it can be as late as 11pm. I also note that you go out without your DH, so your lives are effectively separated because only one of you can go out. We used to go out together a lot and since we became parents that’s not possible. I suppose it depends on your location too - no way could I drive to a restaurant and get parked in 15 minutes. Sounds like wfh is giving you time to exercise too, which you wouldn’t otherwise have.

Well, the well paid job should pay for a cleaner etc. Potentially even for a nanny.
Having your kids raised by a stranger is not “having it all”.

@Donitta

Well, the well paid job should pay for a cleaner etc. Potentially even for a nanny. Having your kids raised by a stranger is not “having it all”.

No, I tend to agree. But in the OP spending time with the kids wasn't mentioned!

I think it is actually very hard to 'have it all' and most of us have to choose at some point.

I have a housekeeper/nanny and she is not raising my children.
I or my husband do the morning school run, make lunch kits, we cook the dinners (unless she gets them BK), we do their homework, we read with them, build LEGO with them, hang out with them, put them to bed.

It is offensive to assume that all working parents with help absolve their responsibilities of “child rearing” if they have a full time, high pressure position and “have it all”.

Who decided that what’s on OP’s list is ‘it all’?

Why is that the metric for success and who set it?

Are you implying that men "can" have it all?
I think, if you read a lot of posts on this forum, you may see that neither is a given.
For what it is worth, my parents ticked your checklist.

@Donitta DH and I went out to breakfast this week :). We also usually manage a couple of lunch dates a month if we can make the schedules line up. We also go out to dinner as a family. We both have our own friends as well as sharing some friends, so we do the friends socializing separately. Works for us - I don't like to be joined at the hip.

I also sacrifice space so I can live in the city center and walk everywhere. It buys me so much more time in the day to have everything on my doorstep.

Pre-pandemic, I worked from one one day a week and went to the gym, or I went to a late night class after he was asleep. When I go back to the office I'll probably turn my day around and Peloton after he goes to bed.

DS bedtime is a non-negotiable. Sometimes he'll stay up until 8pm if we're out and about, but then he's tired and grouchy in the morning, so I try not to make a habit of it.

I actually think the OP’s having it all list is really pretty achievable.

The more senior the job the more likely to have earned flexibility.

If you’re dynamic and interesting enough to hold down a high flying career you’re likely to be the sort of person who attracts and keeps like minded, interesting friends.

Isn’t the key just being super organised? Ad finding a partner that pulls their own weight.

And yes getting kids into a good bedtime routine is non negotiable. They need a lot of sleep. I can’t help noticing many of the friends who have kids with issues with sleep (without any SEN) are the ones who have mums who don’t work who seem to revel in being needed and no desire to help their kids develop healthy sleeping habits

@Jangle33 Agree. I get a decent amount of flexibility because I bring in a LOT of money, so as long as my work gets done, I can make my own hours up to a point. DH is in a similar position. I spent a decade doing really grim dues paying to get to this point and DH did his time pulling 80 hour weeks and back to back business trips.

@Strokethefurrywall LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK.
I'm not cut out to be a SAHM and the help I have allows me to spend more quality time with DS because I'm not also trying to run a household. I'm an Expat though, and it seems to be much more accepted where I live.

Nobody has it all.

Also "work full time" can vary a lot in different jobs and industries, 9-4pm switch off is very different to 8-8pm, always on-call, client-facing or shift patterns

Finally luck has a part to play with relationships, health, circumstances etc. It's not always within control even with best efforts.

@allfurcoatnoknickers yes I chose to have kids in my 30s not 20s, and others wait later. The flexibility of the pandemic has also allowed me to get more balanced. It helps if you are damn good at your job...

Threads like this make me want to go live on my own in a narrowboat. A dirty one full of old stuff, and I'd throw my empty cans of beer through the window at passing dog walkers.

Where do you find the time though? If you get up at 7am, do the school run, work all day, pick up the kids and cook dinner, bedtime then tidy up - it’s at least 9pm and all you can do is read or watch tv for an hour before it’s time for bed. Weekends you do chores and laundry, the obligatory visits to grandparents, and you still don’t have time for friends or hobbies

Location is mega important. For example I generally get woken at 6.30/7.00 but we don't need to leave for school until 8.40am as it's around the corner with nursery on site. So often I put on a wash or do a quick tidy, admin in the morning. I could do exercise but generally can't be bothered.
I then walk to work which takes 1/2 hour & DH is now fully wfh (pre covid was 30/70).
On my lunch break I or DH might do a quick shop for anything we need. Then dc need collecting at 3.30-4.30 depending if there are any clubs on. Whoever is at home will put dinner on & I finish at 4 so will go to the park near school with dc & catch up with school mums who are friends.

Home for dinner latest 5.30, bath & reading/homework for bedtime at 7pm & I like it over asap, dc2 was a shit sleeper compared to dc1 so that was hard. 7.30/8pm our dinner & tbh I don't do much cleaning/tidying, maybe finish up a bit of work/emails. Bit of TV, exercise zoom & then bed for 11pm. Defo don't read enough though.

Cleaner comes on Fri so house is clean for weekend & only really have 1 wash by then to do. Pre covid would always see friends on the weekend whether that's on the sidelines at dc football, play date at the playground & a coffee, lunch/day out, evening drink, etc Grandparents will often have dc to stay over a night on the weekend too so dh & I can go out, get on top of something. We also holiday as a group with friends & family.

Threads like this make me want to go live on my own in a narrowboat. A dirty one full of old stuff, and I'd throw my empty cans of beer through the window at passing dog walkers.

🤣🤣

I also sacrifice space so I can live in the city center and walk everywhere. It buys me so much more time in the day to have everything on my doorstep.

Yes we often talk of moving further out for more space but having work, school, friends & gps on our doorstep makes a huge difference to our lives.

Yeah I know plenty women with all that. I have it a myself minus the kids (one on the way though).

I genuinely don't get the point of this thread?

Hard to have it all. I cut back as zero downtime doing ft hours. Cant meet friends as visiting elder parents at wends. Just chasing tails. Better balance now I do part T

I think a 9-4 job very close to your home is hugely different to a 9-6 job with an hour commute.

If you can get your kids from school (and drop them at 8.45) then that makes a massive difference. Home by 4.30 versus 7.30 is tons more time.

There are many variables!

The list does not include good physical or mental health. Without this the rest is pretty meaningless.

The women i know who have it all have parents just round the corner who drive and babysit.

Yes but bouncing between work, family, life it will never run smooth- if it did I would consider I have it all"

You've missed out by far the most important thing. Good health for all members of the family.

People with health problems, which either emerge later in life or throughout their life, struggle.

A child with complicated health issues cannot go to wrap around care. Therefore one parent cannot do a longer hours job.

A parent with health problems cannot always do the job, the house, the family and everything else.

People without health problems simply underestimate and don't understand the impact that they have on individuals lives.

I don’t think you can do everything and it is silly to pretend you can. Something always has to give. I also noticed from your list you just said ‘gorgeous’ children rather than happy children or spending enough time with them.

1. A strong and loving marriage or relationship - yes but we have had our form points during lockdown
2. Gorgeous kids - yes but that’s a pretty low bar in terms of parenting
3. Financially stable with lots of extra left over. - yes we’re comfortable
4. Close family and friends - yes but friendships have been pushed out a bit re small kids, work pressure, lockdown etc
5. Fantastic and high paying job. Yes- I’m not Uber high flying but in a sought after role and earn well.

What that list doesn’t say is that during lockdown we were run ragged. Huge stress levels, lots of comfort eating, very long work days, unhappy children. Generally felt like we were doing everything appallingly. We’re in a good position coming out into normality but the last year has been a shit show quite frankly.

“Gorgeous children” are genetically determined though. So some women can’t have that one.