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AIBU?

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Original poster

To have called DB out on not proposing?

213 replies

Iamthehedgehogqueen · 21/12/2020 19:40

NC as very outing circumstances.

DB is early 20’s with a GF of about 2 years. They have had a couple of big blow ups (covid played a big part) but otherwise very happy. They live together and own a pet.

GF is from a different culture, higher empathise on marriage and commitment. When GF moved in a fancy engagement ring was bought (DB asked GF to pick it out). DB excitedly shared this news with family. She didn’t push him, it was his choice.

This was months ago. He’s not popping the question any time soon. He states ‘not right timing’, he wants to visit her parents for ‘permission’ (they live a long way away and he doesn’t drive). It’s just obvious he’s not gonna do it any time soon. (Has form for dawdling and talking stuff to death).

GF is frustrated and gets upset.

Today DB brought up wedding venues on the phone and said he would to bring the ring to Christmas dinner to show DH and I.

I snapped a bit and sent him a polite but firm message after to say ‘I think you either need to put the ring on her finger or put it away for a while. You’re enjoying going through the motions of being engaged without actually being and I can understand why it’s causing GF distress. Either propose or stop dangling it in front of her.’

DH agrees with me but Im not often this blunt with DB and he can be pretty sensitive. I worry he’ll take offence.
Honestly though I do get a bit fed up of talking about something that’s hypothetical so much!

I’m also good friends with his GF and like her a lot so feel sorry for her.

OP posts:
Veterinari · 22/12/2020 08:39

@Ohalrightthen

I may be being cynical, but it sounds like your brother used the promise of an engagement ring to convince his GF to go against her cultural expectations and move in with him before marriage. And now he's got sex on tap (which could well be making her chances of a relationship with someone else in the future much, much harder, depending on culture) he's wanting to wriggle out of it.

I'd be pretty ashamed of him, tbh. The fact that you called him out on it is a credit to you.

This.

And I'd be pointing this out to him.

He's potentially using her emotionally and physically and will eventually just walk away unscathed leaving her to pick up the pieces if his deceit.

I'd be having a clear conversation pointing out that his behaviour is cruel and cowardly and that he needs to think about the impact of his actions on her and stop being so selfish and unkind.

MrsToothyBitch · 22/12/2020 08:50

GAH fucking touchscreen!

YANBU. It's not unreasonable for them to have discussed marriage etc before making their relationship more serious, even at a young age... but he's being very unreasonable to have bought a ring with her input then show it off and dangle it in front of her without letting her have it. He needed to be told to shut up for a bit.

It sounds like he used marriage as a big carrot for her for all the wrong reasons, he's realised it and he's now hoping that talking the talk will distract from him not walking the walk. Someone needed to tell him. For both their sakes, especially his poor GF.

I'd be tormented if DP did that to me. It's incredibly cruel and I wouldn't take it. That sort of man then migrates onto "we're pregnant" and being all over YOUR ante and post natal experience without doing any of the heavy lifting, IME. GF should be careful.

ScrapThatThen · 22/12/2020 08:53

I think however right she is for him, sadly he is not right for her and their relationship has future pain written all over it. I think your message was fine.

LawnFever · 22/12/2020 08:55

I offered to help him propose of Christmas dad btw, plan something nice as he was complaining that covid has removed the options for anything ‘perfect’ or ‘romantic’.

Why are you enabling this bizarre concept he needs to propose?

They’ve bought the ring, they’ve discussed getting married - that is/was the proposal!

It’s done, anything else now isn’t a proposal, the decision has been made, once you’ve agreed to get married you’re engaged

Since he’s now made this whole thing so weird can’t he just needs to give her the ring on Christmas Day and be done with it?

Redwinestillfine · 22/12/2020 08:58

My sister had to wait 7 years from engagement to wedding so I made it clear to my now DH that if we ever got engaged the wedding would be within the year or not to bother. We married almost a year to the day I got my ring. If I were her I would ask him to move out until such a time as he is prepared to properly commit (if I was still around and hadn't found anyone else). That should focus his mind. Oh and new ring as this one clearly means nothing.

Sally872 · 22/12/2020 08:58

You aren't pressuring him to get engaged you are highlighting to him it is hurtful to gf to keep talking about engagement and showing off ring if he isn't actually getting engaged. He should propose or stop talking about it. He has 2 options.

Original poster
Iamthehedgehogqueen · 22/12/2020 09:12

I spoke to DM about it just now as wanted to be on same page for Christmas Grin

She totally agrees and also feels sorry for GF.

I think it’s a unanimous ‘no one is pushing you to do it but we expect you to be respectful of GF and stop dangling it or talking about it until you do!’

I suspect DB may be somewhat put out and deflated that he’s been told to stop.

OP posts:
Ohalrightthen · 22/12/2020 09:15

What culture is his GF? Is he materially damaging her chances of a future marriage with someone else with his bullshit? Is he aware that the way he is behaving is absolutely abhorrent?

gurglebelly · 22/12/2020 09:29

@SarahBellam

This is absolutely none of your business and you e wildly overstepped the park. He has every right to tell you to fuck away off and get over yourself. You have no idea what their relationship is like, whether he’s getting cold feet, or whether he ever wanted to in the first place.
If he were getting cold feet, or didn't want to get married, he probably shouldn't be crowing about the fact that they 'will be getting engaged' and showing off to all and sundry
MacbookHo · 22/12/2020 09:49

My brother has been with his GF for six years. She’s desperate for him to propose. She confided in me that she was hoping he’d do it on their anniversary this summer. I got the impression she was hoping I’d have a word with him and give him a nudge.

I didn’t, and I wouldn’t! If anyone has to be nudged into marriage, they’re just not that into you, and the subsequent marriage will be awful for both people.

Marriage is a strange decision, in that it’s the easiest thing to do when it’s right. When it’s wrong, it’s really hard to identify why, so people tend to waffle around, hoping that time, or living together will give some clarity or that “aha!” moment.

If this girl is westernised, surely a long-term sexual relationship wouldn’t ruin her chances with all other men forever? Far better she leaves this foot-dragging bloke while he ogles women who are more his “type”, instead of letting him to use her to get attention and approval from his family.

Chamomileteaplease · 22/12/2020 09:58

I too didn't realise at first that he hadn't even proposed! I thought he was stalling about the actual wedding!

If I were you I would put all my energy into supporting your friend. She has been shafted IMO. And after your updates I would really feel sorry for her if she did marry him as he sounds very immature and frankly not ready to commit himself.

Can you be a friend to her and get her to consider any options that do not include your brother? She may feel backed into a corner and it sounds like she could do with some support if her family are going to be tricky.

JohnMiddleNameRedactedSwanson · 22/12/2020 09:58

Whilst he can walk away pretty unscathed I’m not actually sure how true that is for her. I think her parents are pretty westernised but her community pretty traditional. I think returning home from having lived with a boy who didn’t marry her would have a much higher impact on her than him.

I'm afraid that there are numerous cultures where this will almost certainly be the case. His behaviour is appalling.

EmilySpinach · 22/12/2020 10:03

If this girl is westernised, surely a long-term sexual relationship wouldn’t ruin her chances with all other men forever?

In many cultures, families who are in many other respects very liberal and integrated into western communities can still be very conservative when it comes to marriage and relationships, especially for their daughters.

I know it sounds like something out of Jane Austen and I'm not condoning it but I think a lot of posters do not appreciate the potential implications for this young woman in her community. She wouldn't have moved in with him if he hadn't promised an engagement.

Rainbowqueeen · 22/12/2020 10:07

Agree with @Veterinari
Your brother is behaving like she is an object not a person with feelings.
It’s fine not to be ready for marriage. It’s not ok to mislead your partner.

Hangingover · 22/12/2020 10:10

It really is sounding like he’s very immature, and just wants attention

That's what I thought too.

PerveenMistry · 22/12/2020 10:14

@JohnMiddleNameRedactedSwanson

Whilst he can walk away pretty unscathed I’m not actually sure how true that is for her. I think her parents are pretty westernised but her community pretty traditional. I think returning home from having lived with a boy who didn’t marry her would have a much higher impact on her than him.

I'm afraid that there are numerous cultures where this will almost certainly be the case. His behaviour is appalling.

Well, no one had a gun to her head to cohabit before marriage. Don't infantilize her by making him responsible for her voluntary choices.
PerveenMistry · 22/12/2020 10:17

@Ohalrightthen

What culture is his GF? Is he materially damaging her chances of a future marriage with someone else with his bullshit? Is he aware that the way he is behaving is absolutely abhorrent?

Is she not a sentient adult? He's not "damaging her chances;" she chose to live and presumably be sexual with him. If it were that important she could have waited for marriage.

PerveenMistry · 22/12/2020 10:25

@garlictwist

I don't think it's your business and do you really want him to marry someone he's only been with two years in his early twenties? He's so much life to live before settling down. If anything you should be encouraging him not to.

Exactly. The notion that he's now locked in to "save her honor" or whatever bullshit is so absurd.

Early 20s is so young. If he gets pushed into this, the next thing you know it will be "DB is an irresponsible lazy father not doing his share with the baby/supporting the family " and off we go to another dysfunctional family and kids who will perpetuate the cycle.

JohnMiddleNameRedactedSwanson · 22/12/2020 11:07

@PerveenMistry She was made a promise by someone that she loves and trusts. He’s reneging on that promise.

Bluntness100 · 22/12/2020 11:11

It’s not about being pushed, that’s missing the point totally. It’s about telling someone you want to get married, buying the ring, and then not proposing and getting the ring out at family occasions to show off with and get attention for. No one pushed him to tell her h wanted to marry her and buy an engagement ring, it was his choice.

What they are saying is it’s not fair now to keel taunting her with it like this when he’s no intention of proposing any time soon. Christ he even wants to bring it to show everyone at Xmas. The only way it should be shown at Xmas is on her finger. Past that he should put it in a drawer, tell her he made a mistake, he doesn’t wish to get engaged, and not mention it again. She can then make her decisions.

He’s acting like a spoilt selfish little boy.

PerveenMistry · 22/12/2020 11:39

@Bluntness100

It’s not about being pushed, that’s missing the point totally. It’s about telling someone you want to get married, buying the ring, and then not proposing and getting the ring out at family occasions to show off with and get attention for. No one pushed him to tell her h wanted to marry her and buy an engagement ring, it was his choice.

What they are saying is it’s not fair now to keel taunting her with it like this when he’s no intention of proposing any time soon. Christ he even wants to bring it to show everyone at Xmas. The only way it should be shown at Xmas is on her finger. Past that he should put it in a drawer, tell her he made a mistake, he doesn’t wish to get engaged, and not mention it again. She can then make her decisions.

He’s acting like a spoilt selfish little boy.

So why doesn't the woman propose and settle the matter one way or the other?

PerveenMistry · 22/12/2020 11:43

[quote JohnMiddleNameRedactedSwanson]@PerveenMistry She was made a promise by someone that she loves and trusts. He’s reneging on that promise.[/quote]

Again, if it's that crucial to her culture, she should have waited for marriage vows rather than investing so heavily in the vague 'promises' of an immature 22-year-old after very little time dating.

Her cultural issues are her own and not reason to rush a young man into a lifelong commitment. Especially one as callow and dithering as this specimen.

Thewithesarehere · 22/12/2020 11:45

I would call his girlfriend and will ask her to keep your advice private. The advice will be to take the ring and wear it. That is the only way out for her in this situation.

NeverRTFT · 22/12/2020 11:46

Do you think maybe he was going to propose over Xmas lunch? He's excited and was giving you a subtle heads up? 🤷‍♀️

TheGoogleMum · 22/12/2020 11:46

I agree with you. He's young and 2 years is fast but if that's the case he shouldn't have bought the ring. She can show everyone once its on her finger its weird to show it around before then! Why is he willing to plan the wedding but not propose?

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