Is this everyday sexism or am I being ludicrous?!

[harriethoyle]

Getting married (covid allowing) soon - very small ceremony. We have to apply for our marriage schedule and, on it, my DF is ie Tom Smith and I am Tina Jones formerly known as Jones. We are both divorced. I did not change my name first time around so have only ever been Jones my whole life.

This has really irrationally annoyed me! The assumption is because I was married before and am female, I changed my name but that assumption isn't applied to him. I rang the registrar and pointed this out. She said "It's because you're divorced." I said "we are both divorced. Why is he Tom Smith and I am Tina Jones formerly known as Jones when I have only EVER been Jones." She said "Well that's just the way the system works." I said "It's inappropriate to assume that I changed my name and it's incorrect to imply that I have." And she was completely perplexed by what the issue was.

When I told her that I wanted an email address so I could register my pleasure (I suspect she thinks me a Karen), she went off and checked with the senior registrar and then said that she COULD change it, despite having said it was the way the system worked. So now we are Tom Smith and Tina Jones. Which is correct!

Let's be honest, it's the tiniest blow ever struck against the patriachy but was I right to challenge what I saw as everyday sexism?

YABU - what a thing to expend energy on

YANBU - smash the patriachy one tiny blow at a time!

YABU. Women do change their surnames upon marriage, men do not. Of course they will not assume that about a man.
Go ahead and complain if it will make you feel better.

Yabu to complain about perceived everyday sexism then use the term 'Karen'.

@Neron

YABU. Women do change their surnames upon marriage, men do not. Of course they will not assume that about a man. Go ahead and complain if it will make you feel better.

Not correct Women can choose to change their name on marriage Men can choose to change their name on marriage The options open to both men and women are identical.

YANBU

It's appropriate for there to be an option, but it should be equally available to men too (who do sometimes change their names on marriage), and the system should be able to 'switch it off' when it's not needed.

@Neron that's just not true. It's less common for a man but I know men who have changed their name.

Yabu to complain about perceived everyday sexism then use the term 'Karen'.

Yep. YABU

It’s tricky... it’s not the form that’s the problem, because the vast vast majority of their cases will fit this format. The form needs to be suitable. But I’m not saying there isn’t an issue, I just don’t think the form will change (or even needs to change) until there are enough cases for it to be unsuitable. If that makes sense.

“Well that’s just the way the system works” / “computer says no” doesn’t shock me as an answer. She had no interest in looking to see whether that was actually true. Not a unique experience to find people unwilling to go beyond their usual formulaic approach to their jobs.

I wouldn't see at as sexism, just bureaucracy/systems being slow to adapt to changing cultural norms.

The use of the term 'Karen' though is sexism.

@bravotango

Yabu to complain about perceived everyday sexism then use the term 'Karen'.

Yep. YABU

You certainly are !

YANBU at all.
I am also getting married soon, and was annoyed (read furious) to find that they need my (estranged and abusive) father's name and occupation for the marriage certificate, but not my mothers. What sort of sexist shite is this??? surely we've moved on from marriage being a transaction between father and husband???!

YANBU OP and I understand your frustration. earlier posters have made the false statement that 'women change their surname, men don't'. this is bullshite! both women and men can CHOOSE to change their name, mix both names or double barrel their names.

it's awful that this is still allowed to happen because 'tradition'.

Saying that you suspect someone sees you as 'derogatory term' does not mean that you subscribe to the basis of the derogatory term. It just means that you know it exists in the world and you know how people use it, so you can predict times when you might be called that term.

YANBU OP!

@DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult exactly what I was going to say

YANBU this kind of thing winds me right up. Some men do change their name, it’s not common but is a thing

YANBU, systems only get changed because people demand they are.

HOWEVER your feminism medal will be rescinded because you used the term "Karen".

@ContessaDiPulpo

Saying that you suspect someone sees you as 'derogatory term' does not mean that you subscribe to the basis of the derogatory term. It just means that you know it exists in the world and you know how people use it, so you can predict times when you might be called that term.

YANBU OP!

The more times an expression is used or referred to, the longer it exists in the world.

Totally agree with you.
It's a major bugbear for me. I am married but use my name most of the time. For simplicity I have my husband's surname on my passport because it's the same as our daughters and it makes traveling easier. However this has also meant I have changed my bank account details too..
There is increasingly less expectation for a wife to take her husband's name. I would rather not.

This wouldn't even register as a thing to me.

How will they handle same sex couples who've divorced? Will they assume neither man in a gay couple is changing his name? Or that both women in a lesbian marriage are changing their names?

If it assists, had I been a man I would have said she perceived me as a Kevin 🤷🏻‍♀️ Guess it shows we're all wound up by different things!

@Neron

YABU. Women do change their surnames upon marriage, men do not. Of course they will not assume that about a man. Go ahead and complain if it will make you feel better.

When did that get enshrined in law then????

The irony of being told to get a life by someone insulting a stranger on the internet! 😂 Too delicious, @WhatATimeToBeAlive!

@harriethoyle

If it assists, had I been a man I would have said she perceived me as a Kevin 🤷🏻‍♀️ Guess it shows we're all wound up by different things!

But nobody says a "Kevin". And you wouldn't have done really.

I don't know what a marriage schedule is, but I don't see why it needs to flag the fact that you are divorced, and I agree it is unequal treatment if your partner's status has not also been flagged.

YANBU

Presumably if a man had changed his name by deed poll or had changed his name on marriage, they would have to add in Tom Smith, formerly known as Tom Jones to the marriage schedule because it is important that any former names are known in case there are any legal objections to the marriage so it is necessary. Therefore, they should remove the "formerly" known as part from the schedule for a woman who is divorced and didn't change her nameas it is unnecessary.

It's not sexist to insist that all former names are listed on the schedule as they are treating both men and women the same. It is everyday sexism to insist on listing a women's married name, even if she didn't change it, just because she has been divorced, because that is based on a sexist tradition and assumption that women change their name and belong to men after marriage. They don't list men (or women) as Tom Smith formerly known as Tom Smith if they haven't changed their name by deed poll, do they?