Is this everyday sexism or am I being ludicrous?!

[harriethoyle]

Getting married (covid allowing) soon - very small ceremony. We have to apply for our marriage schedule and, on it, my DF is ie Tom Smith and I am Tina Jones formerly known as Jones. We are both divorced. I did not change my name first time around so have only ever been Jones my whole life.

This has really irrationally annoyed me! The assumption is because I was married before and am female, I changed my name but that assumption isn't applied to him. I rang the registrar and pointed this out. She said "It's because you're divorced." I said "we are both divorced. Why is he Tom Smith and I am Tina Jones formerly known as Jones when I have only EVER been Jones." She said "Well that's just the way the system works." I said "It's inappropriate to assume that I changed my name and it's incorrect to imply that I have." And she was completely perplexed by what the issue was.

When I told her that I wanted an email address so I could register my pleasure (I suspect she thinks me a Karen), she went off and checked with the senior registrar and then said that she COULD change it, despite having said it was the way the system worked. So now we are Tom Smith and Tina Jones. Which is correct!

Let's be honest, it's the tiniest blow ever struck against the patriachy but was I right to challenge what I saw as everyday sexism?

YABU - what a thing to expend energy on

YANBU - smash the patriachy one tiny blow at a time!

@VladmirsPoutine 😂😂😂

The name/term describes a white woman who is entitled or demanding beyond the scope of what is reasonable and more so, ..Ironically enough a hallmark of Karenism is railing against its usage!

Well there you have it - just destroyed your own argument. Women are unreasonable for complaining about terms of abuse used against them. A concise illustration of how Karen is used to shut women up for rationally objection, by using a slur which labels them as unreasonable.

Thank you for so brilliantly illustrating the point we have been making @VladmirsPoutinea

I would be furious that it was highlighted I had been divorced and not my partner just because I am female. The only reason to make that statement would be if your name had changed and no other reason. The ms, miss, mrs thing is every day sexism too. YANBU.

It is wrong to just assume that a married woman took her husband's name and you were right to challenge it, but I wouldn't get overly worked up about it.

I think realistically for a long time many women (if not most at certain times historically) have taken their husband's name while comparatively very few men have changed theirs. It takes a long time for systems (and assumptions) to change, but with fewer women choosing to change their name after marriage, systems (and assumptions) will catch up eventually.

strawberrymilkshake, you can leave it blank, I did.

@lostintheday You're welcome Karens never believe they are in the wrong, in fact that they've been able to spin the term so that they become the victim of it, or something else. Again, it's a true talent. Remarkable in my opinion.

Hilarious you think Karen is a "term of abuse"

Thank you for strengthening my argument even further @VladmirsPoutine

You are illustrating even more effectively how terms like Karen work to prevent women from being able to defend themselves as every attempt to do so is used as evidence of their Kareness. You couldn't be more clearly illustrating the misogyny.

In fact you are doing this so beautifully you could even be a feminist working undercover to expose the sexism of the term Karen.

@VladmirsPoutine

Hilarious you think Karen is a "term of abuse"

So what do you think it is?

Agree with YABU about the term Karen - sexist and ageist term that implies middle aged women should shut up since they are uninformed, morally corrupt, small minded dinosaurs. But YANBU to complain! What a ridiculous system. That would really annoy me too. Fine to have the option, I appropriate to assume.

Well there you have it - just destroyed your own argument. Women are unreasonable for complaining about terms of abuse used against them. A concise illustration of how Karen is used to shut women up for rationally objection, by using a slur which labels them as unreasonable.

Exactly. It's designed to shut women up. Well we won't. If you're going to use my name as an insult, then damn right I'm going to speak up. I just knew someone like @VladmirsPoutine would come along and say "Well that means you're a typical Karen then", which is a perfect example of how it's designed to shut women up who say anything anything at all.

@VladmirsPoutine you are using a typical misogynist tactic and I agree with what a pp said, the worst people for using it are other women. It's a "cool" thing to join in with it, to show you're not like other girls etc. It's pathetic that men have enticed women to do this to each other.

In case you missed it earlier, type your name into this website and see how it feels. karenismyname.org/renamer Read through all the results. They include death threats.

@VladmirsPoutine

Hilarious you think Karen is a "term of abuse"

Hilarious you thought you were making some kind of unarguable point.

Exactly. It's designed to shut women up. Well we won't. If you're going to use my name as an insult, then damn right I'm going to speak up. I just knew someone like @VladmirsPoutine* would come along and say "Well that means you're a typical Karen then", which is a perfect example of how it's designed to shut women up who say anything anything at all.

But if you want to shut down use of the term Karen then aren't you trying to shut up black women who use the word to challenge bad behaviour from white women who use their whiteness to get black people in trouble with the police? Black women are some of the most disenfranchised women in the world.

It's weird how Muslims are told they have to accept offensive cartoons of their prophet in the name of free speech, and black people are told they have to accept a disproportionate % of stop and search attacks, and yet it's unacceptable to call white women Karen.

@kness I can assure you I am not 'joining in' with it because I think it's a "cool" thing nor to appear "not like the other girls".

I'm black/mixed and if I had a penny for every instance since childhood a Karen has intervened, tried to 'help', been condescending, displayed micro-aggressions (to me and my family) I would have long retired.

I don't deny the term has been co-opted and thus used as a pejorative in a sexist manner by men but its origins still carry meaning for those of us who coined it and those of us who have to put up with Karens day in day out. P.s there's also other names - Becky, Sally - from HR etc etc. Karen's just the one that went mainstream when white women, and more specifically, men cottoned on to it.

Hilarious you thought you were making some kind of unarguable point.

Those that understand the intention, meaning and usage of Karen absolutely don't need it explained to them or indeed justified. A knowing look is really all that's required. I don't think in general most white women will welcome the term - that's sort of the point.

Oh god! 😴

@Meraas No I'm not. I'm asking people to stop using my name. If you want to talk about racist people, call them by their own name, or call them racist people.

In fact, every time until you use my name, knowing full well that women will object, you detract from the real message because your original meaning gets lost. That's on you. You cold easily make a clearer point by not using my name, but no, you ddeliberately chose the misogynist route.

I'm black/mixed and if I had a penny for every instance since childhood a Karen has intervened, tried to 'help', been condescending, displayed micro-aggressions (to me and my family) I would have long retired.

@VladmirsPoutine Here's a better version:

"I'm black/mixed and if I had a penny for every instance since childhood a white person has intervened, tried to 'help', been condescending, displayed micro-aggressions (to me and my family) I would have long retired.*

Easy. And I'm well aware that I've intervened, but if your going to deliberately use my name as an insult then damn right I'm going to intervene.

@kness you're*

HTH

Oh no, I made a typing error on my phone!!! Scandal of the century, clearly

Stop being such a Harriet.

Here's a better version

No. I don't need nor want your 'better version'. I'm black - my voice and experiences are already silenced enough as it is. I don't need any 'helpful' rewording, restructuring or intervention. I said what I said. Interesting that you are more concerned with the name 'Karen' as opposed to the behaviours they display. The daily aggressions they act out which lead to all manner of problems for those like myself. My friends and I often joke that if white women were as riled up about white women's active participation in racism as they are about being branded a 'Karen' then we could dismantle racism in probably half the time it might otherwise take.

Stop being such a Harriet

That might catch on...

Easy. And I'm well aware that I've intervened, but if your going to deliberately use my name as an insult then damn right I'm going to intervene.

But no one has asked you not to intervene? It’s you who is trying to shut people up, no one is trying to shut you up.

@Neron my dad changed his name to my mums

[quote harriethoyle]**@kness* you're

HTH[/quote]
Grammar policing - why do posters do this?