Is this everyday sexism or am I being ludicrous?!

[harriethoyle]

Getting married (covid allowing) soon - very small ceremony. We have to apply for our marriage schedule and, on it, my DF is ie Tom Smith and I am Tina Jones formerly known as Jones. We are both divorced. I did not change my name first time around so have only ever been Jones my whole life.

This has really irrationally annoyed me! The assumption is because I was married before and am female, I changed my name but that assumption isn't applied to him. I rang the registrar and pointed this out. She said "It's because you're divorced." I said "we are both divorced. Why is he Tom Smith and I am Tina Jones formerly known as Jones when I have only EVER been Jones." She said "Well that's just the way the system works." I said "It's inappropriate to assume that I changed my name and it's incorrect to imply that I have." And she was completely perplexed by what the issue was.

When I told her that I wanted an email address so I could register my pleasure (I suspect she thinks me a Karen), she went off and checked with the senior registrar and then said that she COULD change it, despite having said it was the way the system worked. So now we are Tom Smith and Tina Jones. Which is correct!

Let's be honest, it's the tiniest blow ever struck against the patriachy but was I right to challenge what I saw as everyday sexism?

YABU - what a thing to expend energy on

YANBU - smash the patriachy one tiny blow at a time!

I find it much more sexist to use the term Karen in a derogatory manner to be honest.

@Neron

I know men do - my DH double barrelled his, however the majority of women DO change their name. You can be offended by this, or you can simply get the record changed without making a big deal about it. Why are people always looking for an issue when there isn't one.

Ok boomer

You lost your moral high ground op, the moment you started complaining about sexism then were even more sexist snd mysogynistic your self.

Do you actually live in a misogynistic little cupboard under the stairs?
OMG yes! How did you know?!

I bet if you were around when the Suffragettes were protesting, you would have told them to calm down, have a nice cup tea and stop looking for an issue.
Yes absolutely I would have

Women do tend to change their names more than men do which is why they system will have been set up how it was. We are lucky in that times are changing, that things are evolving. We are also capable of having a simple discussion in order to change it. I managed to have a discussion when I got married, about my biological father not being on my marriage cert, without a complaint or a mnet thread being made about it.
By all means, stand up for what you believe it, but even the OP said it made her 'irrationally angry'. It didn't need to be this big of an issue.

@istherelifeafter40

British marriage is one big sexist procedure. A woman is asked her father's profession, but not her mother's! Both my parents are engineers and my mother always worked, - why is she only implied as a womb while the father is defined through his contribution to society? And I am defined through his contribution?

I mean the whole inability to have a registered partnership for heterosexual partners is a travesty

Not British - English. (Scotland has different legislation, and is much more equal). Come and get married here - I've heard Gretna is nice.

I genuinely just wouldn't care. Picking fights like this would be exhausting but if it irritates you that much, I guess you did the right thing because its something you feel strongly about, even if it won't change the system or how its managed. Perhaps if it irritates you that much you could get stuck in and challenge the system and actually get it changed? Just a thought.

This has really irrationally annoyed me!

🤔

Well done you, I would have done the same. Have a great wedding when it comes

Well the whole institution of marriage is fundamentally sexist. I seem to recall when I got married they needed to know my fathers occupation, no interest in my mothers of course. I think you were right to get it changed, yes it’s a small thing but lots of small things can make change eventually.

YABU to use Karen but YANBU for complaining about this.

Yabu to complain about perceived everyday sexism then use the term 'Karen'

I agree with this.

Kevin just doesn't have the deeply sexist undertones,or currency, of Karen. Hear women saying, ' I don't want to be seen as a Karen', never heard a man say the same.

Yanbu, it’s daft to make that assumption in this day and age

Marriage isn't the only reason someone would change their name though. Mine was changed when I was a kid. I dont really see the issue. I'm guessing a box came up for formerly known as and someone just put your name in again.

Ok boomer
Alas, I am not. Far too young to be a boomer unfortunately. I would be living it up in my massive house I bought for a fiver, instead of living in a cupboard under the stairs...

@Happyheartlovelife

Eh? I changed my name by deed poll. Then got married. When we applied for our marriage license. This wasn’t even brought up. I wasn’t married before. But I did have a different name.

I’ve never had formerly known as. Because I’ve never been divorced.

I wonder if they looked It up. In the divorce courts etc.

That surprises me. All incarnations of my name over the years are on my marriage certificate as previously known as.

Must be different in Scotland where I got married. Makes much more sense from a record keeping perspective to have a clear record that "Lyra GrandparentsName" was originally "FuckingStupidName Lyra Mothersname or Father'sName"

@lostintheday

Yabu to complain about perceived everyday sexism then use the term 'Karen'

I agree with this.

Kevin just doesn't have the deeply sexist undertones,or currency, of Karen. Hear women saying, ' I don't want to be seen as a Karen', never heard a man say the same.

Exactly, Karen is blatantly sexist, I really can’t believe anyone would think it’s benign to use a woman’s name in a derogatory fashion like this.

You loose all credibility when you do it.

It’s like complaining about racism then making an openly racist remark when you’re doing it.

Op. You should at least own it. Instead of hiding behind the rather silly “oh I’d say Kevin” . Sure you would. Because that’s a thing right.

YANBU. It's actually embarrassingly antediluvian and sexist (but I have to agree with PPs on the 'Karen' thing, too).

My DM sadly died in 2002. She was still legally married although separated from her ex, my father, who was an abusive and intimidating man against whom she was too afraid to start divorce proceedings in case she shoved a knitting needle into a gigantic hornet's nest and got stung. Having grown up with him I can say she had justification.

The registrar insisted her occupation be registered as 'wife of HusbandsName, HusbandsOccupation'. NOT as HerName, HerOccupation.

It might well be said that having been prostrate with grief over the death of a mum to whom I was incredibly close, and whose death had left me reeling, it would be the last consideration on my mind and I should have had better things to worry about. But that truly fucking hurt. Both she and I feared and loathed that monster, who had caused us nothing but misery when I was growing up. She had finally found courage to leave him and then only lived for five more years. I was outraged and complained in the strongest possible terms to the registrar.

The registrar told me no one had ever made such a complaint before (a thing I don't believe) and the death certificate was indeed registered as wife of HisName HisJob.

It's a document no one but me is ever likely to see. But I cringed in the face of it, not least because I knew how much my mother would have hated this. 15 years later that still rankles with me.

It shouldn't matter. In fact, her absence is the only thing that truly matters, as I still grieve for her and miss her every day of my life. But it does matter. It matters hugely, and in a way I can't even adequately define.

YANBU. At all.

@strawberrymilkshakemonkey The putting the Fathers name and occupation on the marriage certificate but not the Mother really, really annoyed me as well.

The only thing my Husband and I could do was to have my Mother and his Mother as our witnesses as that meant both our Mothers were on there as well - so it was more fair, however I think a marriage certificate should put both parents and both occupations or neither.

Neither of us changed our surname
Neither of us changed our title

However, I am glad that our marriage certificate has both Mother and Fathers names on there......

18 years. Disclaimer: my maths is shit.

@Bluntness100 it absolutely is, whether you believe it or not. Commonly used where I'm from.

Use of Karen, please no.

Everyday sexism to assume name changes upon marriage, when use of maiden name is commonplace- yes.

The irony of someone complaining about every day sexism using the term Karen! And then one of her defenders coming out with “boomer” ...

This place is fucking unreal sometimes.

Yes, this is sexist bollocks. No, you weren't unreasonable to question it - well done!

@Neron I know two men who've changed their names on marriage. One is now divorced and has gone back to his old name.

YANBU.

I am Irish, but spent years living in the UK. What I was really surprised by was how impossible it was to be a 'Ms' - I have only ever been Ms, since I discovered it existed aged 8. Interestingly in my convent secondary school all the teachers were 'Ms" because it was none of our business if they were married or not. So basically, I have never in my entire life filled out a form and ticked a box that says 'Miss', yet it was impossible to do that in the UK: I would tick the 'Ms" box and post would come as "Miss' or "Mrs". I told my bank they had changed it and they tried to convince me it must be my error, and that nobody ever really wanted to be Ms.

Weirdly, I have not once had this issue in Ireland, but water bills, gas bills, bank accounts magically stopped being Ms and became Miss. And I corrected it every time, and it wrecked my head. These things are really bloody annoying, and people need to challenge them when they occur. Because it just reinforces this idea that being a woman = X (where x = changing your name, being Miss then Mrs, working part-time, etc etc) and being a man = whatever the fuck you want it to.

My name and title have been the same since I was 8 years old. The same is true for my DH. The amount of times that has caused any comment or confusion in his life = zero, I couldn't count the amount of times it has been an issue or point of discussion in mine. It is absolutely everyday sexism.

YABU to use and the defend your use of the word “Karen” as it’s a misogynistic slur designed to get women “back in their box”.

So far that reason your small step forward is countered by your giant leap back.