to say that working parents need a Plan B (and all parents are responsible for their children's Covid-appropriate behaviour)?

[SaltyAndFresh]

We're kidding ourselves if we think we really have the data to say that opening schools with no social distancing, no PPE (not through choice, it's not allowed) and in many cases inadequately ventilated and crowded classrooms is safe. We can't possibly know. Secondary teachers will be in standing in front of around 300 pupils a week, and there isn't the space for a 2m distance at the front of the room.

Teachers are not saying they don't want schools to reopen (not that they were shut) which has been said and ignored multiple times. I'm both a working parent and a teacher.

AIBU to say that schools don't exist for parents' economic convenience and that if too many school staff become ill, it's up to parents to have a Plan B if schools have to scale back their opening? If in the coming months, we as parents end up having to reduce our hours to facilitate blended learning, it will mean difficult financial times ahead but that will not be the fault of schools and school staff.

Please note the 'if'.

Furthermore, AIBU to say that parents of mainstream pupils who want schools open, come what may, should be accountable for their DC's Covid-appropriate behaviour, whether or not they believe the virus is a hoax?

My only plan b is to to adhoc TOIL and use my rest days I have saved up. I only have about 6 though.

That’s all I can manage but nowt I can do if her class closes for isolation.

Furthermore, AIBU to say that parents of mainstream pupils who want schools open, come what may, should be accountable for their DC's Covid-appropriate behaviour, whether or not they believe the virus is a hoax?

I don’t really understand what you mean by this?

(not that they were shut)

My children’s school was shut.

AIBU to say that schools don't exist for parents' economic convenience and that if too many school staff become ill, it's up to parents to have a Plan B

Schools exist to educate, society works on an economic level which generally requires parents to work, most parents work during school hours. What’s your Plan B if your child’s school closes and the school you work at doesn’t?

it will mean difficult financial times ahead but that will not be the fault of schools and school staff.

It’s not the schools fault but it is a direct consequence of schools closing and parents have a right to express their disagreement, annoyance and frustration about that without schools and teachers thinking it’s a personal attack. Parents also have the right to question the rationale behind removing school provision to their children.

parents of mainstream pupils who want schools open, come what may, should be accountable for their DC's Covid-appropriate behaviour,

Parents should support their children to follow reasonable school rules, schools should ensure the rules are reasonable as far as possible, irrespective of Covid.

I’m not sure what the point of your OP is but it’s pretty goady.

I think we've all grasped that after six months of juggling school/work/home/health.

But thanks

Oh and teachers in both my daughters schools are allowed PPE. Youngest teacher isn’t wearing it though.

I think YABU.

Most people do have a back up plan for when their kids are sick or schools are closed for short times.

These back up plans normally involve sharing childcare with friends, asking work for flexibility around annual leave, emergency childcare, grandparents help etc. Most of which is not available at the moment because holiday or goodwill all used up at work, grandparents vulnerable, no mixing of bubbles etc.

No body had a back up plan for a global pandemic even the NHS etc so asking parents to have a back up plan is a big ask.

Also I'm not actually sure what you want or expect parents to do. Some people just don't have options and they can't just magic them up.

YANBU to expect children to abide by school rules in respect of covid measures and there should be consequences for breaking those rules no matter what the parents believe.

@RiteAid

Furthermore, AIBU to say that parents of mainstream pupils who want schools open, come what may, should be accountable for their DC's Covid-appropriate behaviour, whether or not they believe the virus is a hoax?

I don’t really understand what you mean by this?

It's a separate issue but what I mean is that parents need to be laying the foundations for their children to comply with codes of conduct (which you'd hope would happen anyway) but particularly with regard to behaviour that might increase spread. My water bottle was nicked and passed around the room a few months ago for example. I've also heard of some pupils deliberately coughing in others' faces.

@OoohTheStatsDontLie I want (some) parents to accept that this isn't teachers' responsibility.

I think, actually it has become clear that schools are there for the economic benefit of the country. It seems everyone, except some teachers knew that already.

I do agree though, that the best chance we have of keeping schools open is if families (and staff) respect social distancing etc out of school to reduce the possibility of one of them taking it in. I'm fed up of hearing parents and staff say things along the lines of "I'm not bothering as I'll/they'll be mixing with 200 teenagers from Sept". That's exactly the reason to get it right now.

Schools exist to educate, society works on an economic level which generally requires parents to work, most parents work during school hours. What’s your Plan B if your child’s school closes and the school you work at doesn’t?

My Plan B is that myself and my DH will have to reduce our working hours to cover it.

It would be silly not to have a backup plan. Teachers are not responsible for childcare, that’s down t the parents who choose to have them.

The government should have insisted on home school agreements so that parents had to adhere strictly to all guidelines, test when schools ask them to etc. Given how many have said they won’t test or haven’t been following the guidelines I doubt schools will be open long.

But how can teacher parents have a plan B? And it's not just teachers who are parents, but what about all of the other professions where you can't work from home if your child's school is closed because of a local outbreak?

What Plan B do you suggest? I'm fortunate in that I work part time. But that still doesn't cover the rest of the week if my dcs school has to close.

Fwiw, I don't think the majority of school aged dc parents see school as a babysitting service that allows us to work. But it is true that without schools being open and the wrap around care that goes with it being available, it's impossible to do a job out of the home and have those children out of school.

I've got a plan B for childcare but expect the school to have a plan B to educate my kids if they cannot physically be in school.

I think most parents DO have back up plans for when school isn't available. Unfortunately for our family, as well as most others, the situation with Covid and lockdown took most of them off the table. Childminder/Nurseries - Closed
Other family members - Not permitted because of lockdown/shielding and vulnerable.
DH and I are lucky enough to have two very flexible employers and a relatively large support network for childcare emergencies and even we struggled in lockdown!

It’s fortunate you’re in a position to do that, some simply don’t have that option in that employers want them there full time or not at all. I’m fortunate to have a very flexible employer and I already work part time, the flexibility in my husbands job is limited to be here or leave. I’m not sure what you expect parents to do in that situation.

I also think the government pretty much settled the education -v- childcare debate when it opened schools to provide childcare for key workers. You might not think school provides a childcare function, the U.K. government respectfully disagrees it would seem.

And it’s kinda hard to plan for something when you have no idea if/when it is needed.

I’m not sure what the point of your OP is but it’s pretty goady.

My point is that I'm sick of the 'retail/NHS/care/policing sectors dealt with it so so must you' with apparently no ability to comprehend that schools will have none of the safeguards of those roles and many more prolonged interactions per week than many. And anyway, it's not a race to the bottom. I have no more immunity to this than anyone else and I'm worried about the shit I and other teachers will get if we're unable to work due to illness.

I've got a plan B for childcare but expect the school to have a plan B to educate my kids if they cannot physically be in school.
This 👏👏👏👏

It’s fortunate you’re in a position to do that, some simply don’t have that option in that employers want them there full time or not at all.

Quite likely to be the same scenarios for us, so that's going to be our issue to deal with as parents.

What Plan B are the schools offering.

@Jellycatspyjamas

I've got a plan B for childcare but expect the school to have a plan B to educate my kids if they cannot physically be in school. This 👏👏👏👏

But don't you realise that schools are being told to open in full and that the government has no plan B if this fails? It will be on schools again.

Yes, mine a grown up now but I always had plenty of back up emergency childcare, other parents who could collect from school, my own parents who were happy to help out from time to time, an old school friend who had previously worked as a nanny and who I could pay if needed, but none of those are available in a lockdown situation.

I know teachers love to say they're not babysitters but that is an important part of their role to society, the society that pays them! Even in usual times it's ok to say parents should have backup but are all these backups supposed to be sitting around waiting to be needed?

I’m a police officer. How likely do you think it is that my colleagues and I, many of whom also have school age children, will all be allowed to reduce our hours? We are thinly stretched as it is.

@Parker231

What Plan B are the schools offering.

We've certainly been working on our online offering if that's what you're getting at, but if we can't have all pupils there all the time, that's for parents to sort out.

schools don't exist for parents' economic convenience

In practice, yes they absolutely do.

I genuinely don't understand why so many teachers refuse to accept this.