Female friend not invited on stag do

[ConkerGame]

A very close male friend of mine is getting married next year. Whilst I was originally friends with him and consider him a really good friend, I have also become close to his fiancée over time and she has kindly invited me on her hen party. I would never have expected an invite on the stag as hens/stags are always women/men only in our group. I only invited the women on my hen.

DFriend’s and my mutual female friend has always considered herself one of the “lads” (I’m not to sure why as she’s actually not very “laddy” at all!). She always calls the boys in the group “her boys” and says she feels closer to them than the girls. She has a boyfriend so she’s not after the guys or anything, just seems to want to hang out with them more than the girls for some reason. I can’t tell whether she doesn’t make much of an effort with the girlfriends or whether they don’t make one with her (or if it’s a bit of both) but while she meets up with the girls who were originally in the group (like me), she never meets up with the girlfriends of the guys for dinner/lunch etc (like I do). So she hasn’t been invited on the hen like I have.

However, she’s not bothered by that. What she’s annoyed about is that she’s not invited on the stag! It’s men only and going by the previous stags in the group, it will be physically quite intense. They’re a sporty, competitive group who aren’t afraid of getting hurt or hurting one another (think rugby boys, but not!). So e.g. they’ll do some sort of activity that involves hunting each other in teams and (play)fighting each other. And they’re also very heavy drinkers, mainly beer and shots. She’s not a particularly heavy drinker and only likes wine/G&t. She’s not physical at all and would get very upset if someone physically hurt her (fair enough!). So basically she wouldn’t just fit in to the stag like “one of the lads” - she’d stick out like a sore thumb.

Anyway, things have kicked off as she’s messaged the group (both men and women) WhatsApp complaining that DFriend and his best man are being sexist by not inviting her. She says she’s a close friend of his and the only reason she’s not invited is because she’s a woman. DFriend rang me really upset as it’s not true at all. He says to be honest he’s not particularly close to her, never spends one on one time with her or anything and just doesn’t want her there. Nothing to do with her being a woman, just (a) he doesn’t like her enough to want her there and (b) knows she wouldn’t want to do any of the stuff they’ll be doing and will just be a pain.

I really feel for him. I’m a feminist and would be the first to call out sexism if I thought it was there. But in this case I think she’s just being a pain and upsetting DFriend without a real reason. Personally I think she should make more effort with the women and then maybe she wouldn’t feel left out as she would probably be invited on the hen. Don’t really know what to advise DFriend to reply as he can’t really say “I just don’t like you that much” without causing a lot of upset!

AIBU?

[user1471565182]

ohhh shes not like other girls

[user1471565182]

Has anybody randomly diagnosed autism yet?

[Browzingss]

No matter how much of a “lad” she thinks she is, her presence will change the dynamic of the stag for the worse. It’s understandable that she wasn’t invited.

[notacooldad]

BTW I had a mixed-sex group of friends at my 'slag' do, about 30 years ago. A pub meal without any silly games or anyone ending up tied to a lamppost. Great night out. (even if there is someone on the photo now who I don't recognise at all!)
Just sounds like a regular night out.

[KentuckyBlueberry]

@user1471565182

[AlpineSnow]

Oh she's one of those. "Oh i don't like women. Men are much better, but I'm of course different from all other women. I'm nice like a man so i shouldn't have to bother with women but should be invited to be with "my boys" 🤮

[Ihatemyseleffordoingthis]

She sounds like the sexist one to me.

[xmummy2princesx]

She sounds like a muppet she’s BU. I bet she thinks women are beneath her bcuz she’s one of the ‘lads’.

[PyongyangKipperbang]

Oh I hate these.....I used to know one and she was excrutiating. She would insist that she knew all the boys better than their wives did, that she was one of the lads, hated all the women....it was all about attention.

In the end she got quietly phased out by everyone as the guys especially were sick of her. There was a kick off about a stag night with her too. I'm embarrassed on her behalf.

If I was him I would be uninviting her from the wedding too.

[StealthPolarBear]

Surely she just needs to tell him she's now a man. To paraphrase Daniel radcliffe
Transgender men are men. Any statement to the contrary erases the identity and dignity of transgender people and goes against all advice given by professional health care associations, who have far more expertise on this subject matter than either Jo, stealth or me.

[Notredamn]

My 'slag' do

That's a new one on me.

[Ohtherewearethen]

But I really hope eventually single sex stags and hens are consigned to history, where they belong...

Who are you to say that people can't have single sex, traditional-style stag and hen dos if they want one? People can choose whichever type of party they want and invite whoever they wish. I'm really surprised that you think it's ok to make a statement to the contrary. It's not up to you.
In your ideal scenario then, would all hen dos have to include a certain ratio of men too? Should all stag dos have to consist of 50% women and only do activities that both sexes would enjoy? Your comment has really annoyed me.

As for your friend, OP, I imagine she is feeling stung because she genuinely thought of herself as a Queen Bee among the men in the group. Her perception has obviously been questioned and she might well be looking back and cringing at previous behaviours as she starts to realise that she isn't seen as 'one of the lads' as much as she believed she was. She's no doubt embarrassed and sore but she is making things so much worse by complaining about it in a group WhatsApp and basically begging for an invitation. If her presence there before wouldn't have changed the dynamic it certainly would now. PP's saying it's sexist and the stag shouldn't proclaim to know what she likes of doesn't like doing - he knows her and knows that she wouldn't enjoy or fit in with the activities he had planned. They're not planning a joint party the week before the wedding, it is obviously more of a traditional style stag do and that is up to them. They should not have to alter what they want to do because one of their (not even very close) friends is whinging about feeling left out

[Gwenhwyfar]

"Who are you to say that people can't have single sex, traditional-style stag and hen dos if they want one? "

She's not saying they can't, she's saying she's hoping it will end. Quite a few of us have been to mixed ones and I also hope that will be the norm in future.

[Zhampagne]

A mixed party wouldn’t solve the problem here. The groom just doesn’t like her much.

[Northernparent68]

Any update op ?

[Ohtherewearethen]

@Gwenhwyfar

"Who are you to say that people can't have single sex, traditional-style stag and hen dos if they want one? "

She's not saying they can't, she's saying she's hoping it will end. Quite a few of us have been to mixed ones and I also hope that will be the norm in future

Why though? Why on earth do you give even a tiny shit what people you don't know choose to do on their hen/stag dos? Seriously, why do you even think about it?

[tttigress]

My person take is stag and hen do's (unless just a few drinks down the pub) are a bad idea

[ConkerGame]

A couple of PP have definitely called out her “type”. She also used to take new girlfriends aside for a “chat”, where she’d say things like “if you ever need any advice about him, just come to me as I know him better than anyone”. Then she’d try to make them insecure by telling them half-truths where she’d twist things the guy had said to make it sound like they fancied someone else or they weren’t sure about the future with their GF.

I think the guys used to quite like her and go to her for advice, mainly because she set herself up in this sort of confidante role. But this was in our late teens/early twenties when everyone was still having various relationship dramas. Now that everyone’s settled down (most are actually married now) there’s no need for that role anymore and tbh the guys often meet up on their own or it’s a completely mixed event. She is never invited to boys only events. Not sure if she doesn’t know about them or if she has always been annoyed about not being included and has finally snapped.

[KentuckyBlueberry]

She sounds really irritating.

I find this sex-segregated socialising v odd as well! Mates are mates ime, have never known a group of friends to split off into men and women for nights out. It sounds like Grease.

[Euclid]

What a very immature girl, trying to be one of the lads. In the circumstances of a stag event, she is obviously not a lad and should not expect to be treated as one. She will ruin all friendships if she continues in this pathetic manner. I feel sorry for her. Can you tell her what an idiot she is being?

[Pelleas]

most are actually married now

Does this friend have a history of going to their stag dos?

[HavelockVetinari]

I'm cringing for her, how embarrassing!

[NameChangeNugget]

I’m embarrassed for her

[ConkerGame]

@Pelleas no she’s never been invited to one. She has complained privately about it before but has never messaged the whole group, making it into a “thing”.

[CruellaDeSmile]

That update kind of makes more sense.

The trouble with that domineering/matriarch/queen bee/organiser role is it ages badly.

Unless they’re loaded or incredibly well-connected and successful, others just find them annoying and controlling and attention-seeking after a certain age.

Emotionally normal guys want to date and partner up and socialise with women of their choice.

Either way she doesn’t seem that nice so I’d personally stay well clear of this car crash - grey rock her a bit, make up excuses (Coronavirussy ones etc )

If she’s got form for dishonesty she may see things like your conversation with your friend as “you telling him what to do”.

Either someone needs to tell her to fuck off (let’s face it the blokes probably aren’t going to do) or she’s not going to let this go.