To be sick of neighbours shopping

[TriangleBingoBongo]

Just that really. Neighbour is early 80’s and extremely nimble, me and my DH really feel for him. He has no family but plenty of friends and a usually active social life. Problem being all his friends are a similar age. He is shielding himself.

At the beginning of this whole thing we asked if he needed any help. He readily accepted and asked us to nip to the post office (for stuff that needed to go to the counter), post letters. I did some shopping. DH was going to ask a few more neighbours if they needed help but decided against it as we soon realised how time consuming it is.

He’s totally computer literate and fortunately I introduced him to a milk delivery service which he seems to be using.

Now we’re a bit further into this crisis, DH is still working, I’m at home with a one year old and trying to work in a job which requires a lot of attention to detail. My boss is fantastic and I’m picking my hours up in the evening. Also have a DSS who is here on DH’s days off and has extra needs so quite full on. So there’s no spare time.

I keep letting the neighbour know when we’re picking things up and including him in our shop. He added some items to our online shop but of course I can’t get anymore slots now.

We had a shop delivered Tuesday, I let him know I was going to the local supermarket Friday, he said he didn’t need anything but he would give me a list.

He’s now given me a list. I don’t want to go shopping again. He seemed disappointed I don’t have any online slot. There aren’t any online slots! I’ll have to take DS, DH is at work and I only went the day before last. I have underlying health conditions, as does DSS and we’re trying to avoid going out more than we need to.

I think the elderly don’t appreciate the gravity of the situation and think we’re immune rather than less at risk.

Sounds more like a lack of communication than anything. If you're shopping this week on thurs tell him on Tues if he needs anything to get a list to you by Wed. I'm sure he appreciates your help. It just seems theres been a mix up this week

@Rubberoftheband just under four weeks.

I'm beginning to wonder how many people that have offered help in all this, are now wishing they hadn't because it's turning into one huge pain in the arse.

@PhilCornwall1

Well yes. I don’t really think we realised what we were signing up for. With DS is nursery and business as usual at work and in the shops it was fine. I’ve always done an online shop and offered to include him.

I didn’t realise I wouldn’t be able to get a slot and would have to go in person.

Just say you aren't going shopping again for a bit, presumably you will have to do some more at somepoint so you could offer then (if you wanted). If he is computer literate there are Facebook groups of people who can help, or most councils have numbers to call; please direct him to one of those, it's not unreasonable to not be happy to go out seperately, but as you offered before he might have missed a lot of the messages about where to get support if you can't get out.

My own attitude has shifted from feeling pretty comfortable shopping to now finding it quite stressful.

Me too. It’s horrible. I broke my own rules and took my adult son the other evening so we could get through it faster. Used the self-checkout so we didn’t encounter anyone. Sorry you’re having to do this with a young child. It must be desperately difficult.

If it was a job you’d be pissed off your working conditions had changed so quickly and without warning. So when I initially agreed to add a few bits to my online shop, that was fine.

• @Otherrooms I let him know by phone (in real time) that I was visiting the shop that day. So whatever day it was (which I’ve since corrected as being Thursday) the confusion is only here on MN and not IRL.*

Did he bring the list over that evening?
I think you have to be time specific with him. It's a shame he missed you going.

'I'm going to X at 1pm today. If you want anything, let me know by 12.30. After that, I won't be going out again for a few days.'

Thanks @Marieo that would also be prudent as it has crossed my mind that if DH and I need to self isolate he doesn’t have a plan B as far as I know.

I made it clear to my elderly neighbour we were shopping once a week only but could pick up her stuff as well that one time. I also gave her the Sainsbury's priority number and made sure she knew about the gov.uk list.

She said it took some perseverance but is now on the Sainsbury's priority list. She had a delivery on Thursday and was told she can book one a week so she is sorted now. We will still offer the one time a week we go shopping too but nothing else. We are minimising exposure too.

@TriangleBingoBongo if you search whatever your area is and covid mutual aid group, I'm sure plenty of info will pop up! Just be honest, local councils as well as volunteers are doing a lot here and hopefully it is the same around the country. If he can get something sorted then maybe just offer when you are going anyway, but don't feel bad. We are all doing what we can, and when you are juggling work with your family and being apprehensive about going out it's too much.

“ I don't why people are being difficult on this thread. It's ok to want to help someone but be a bit peeved when it becomes more of a burden than originally anticipated.“

I agree there have been some snipey responses on here. “Just tell him you can’t be bothered with him any more.” for example.
It’s Very easy to be haughty about someone else not wanting to put in the time or effort, when it’s not their time or effort being compromised. Pay no attention to that sort of reply. It’s not helpful and nor is it meant to be.

You’re not obliged to this neighbour beyond what you are prepared to do, which is to pick up a few items for him when you’re going anyway. That is good enough. X

@Otherrooms

When I asked I was expecting he might ask for a bit of milk etc as our online shop had only come two days before. So I wasn’t anticipating he might respond with a list but didn’t want him to miss out if he needed anything essential, or have to do an extra trip if he did need something essential but have missed the opportunity.

He emails me the list anyway.

I’m sure it probably can wait and I’ve gotten into a bit of a flap.

I’m probably not alone in this whole thing taking a toll on my mental health and thus not responding as rationally as I usually would.

Agree about trying to get him on the Sainsbury's vulnerable list if he is, plenty of slots here for those and pass holders.

@TriangleBingoBongo it’s ok to have your boundaries. You absolutely should prioritize your health and your family’s safety. I understand why your perception of risk has changed. Just be clear about what you’re willing to do (maybe shop every ten days) and communicate that clearly to him.

Tbf he might need a bit more notice to get a list together. For people who were used to nipping our every day, planning ahead doesn’t always come easily.

I don’t think you should be taking unnecessary risks for him. But it’s manageable to include him in your family shopping. The fact that you’ve got him a milk delivery is excellent because it extends the time you can go between shops.

To be a bit blunt- you can help an elderly person without becoming a martyr and you’ll be far more useful to him if you don’t catch the virus.

Thanks @Blueblackrose I’ll let him know about the list.

I hear you Op.

As your neighbour hasn’t been out he hasn’t been able to appreciate the rapid change in supermarket shopping. It’s both easier but takes longer. There are still gaps.

Tell him you went first thing and they aren’t allowing children now.

Put him in touch with the group set up in your area for shopping.

Goodness me. It is ok for the op to be stressed out! People offer to help because of a sense of duty and realising people may be alone. You don't have to be happy about what you are volunteering to do. In fact, OP is unhappy but doing it anyway because she knows she needs to! If everyone volunteered because it filled them with joy there would be scant volunteers.

OP my nan is used to everyone picking bits up for her every couple of days. Frivolous items as well (who desperately needs tinned peaches). She has been told that at this time she needs to write a list and it will be got once a week. Those were the boundaries put in place. Your neighbour is probably very grateful but also probably doesn't appreciate the position you are in with wfh and small child. This is not a failing of either of you so just tell him He will be fine with it!

You just need much stronger boundaries.
Tell him the day that you will be shopping and give home at least 24 hrs notice. Tell him when you need the list by and.let him know if he misses that, roughly when you plan to go shopping again.

Do not go to the post office for him unless you are going yourself. Again let him know in advance

If possible get him set up with other local deliveries. Yes this is a lot of organising work on top of what you are doing but it is better than feeling resentful and overwhelmed

The alternative is to refuse to help any more but you will need to live with that decision, which may be harder than you think.

Thanks everyone.

I have said to DH I’m not going to the post office again, it will have to wait. I will let him know about all the help and when we’re next doing our shop. Which I said would be 7-10 days after this last online shop. So I’ll stick with that. The milk delivery service delivers alsorts of other groceries too. It’s expensive but that’s just how it is atm!

As with most things it’s down to communication- these are difficult times and things changing quickly don’t think anyone is at fault.

Also some people sorry to say it’s mostly women - aren’t clear in their communication want to be “nice” so don’t speak up for themselves properly then end up fuming and resentful.

Does your area have a buddy scheme? My village set one up and there are 40 buddies that are all on a WhatsApp group. We are all paired to a vulnerable person in the village to do shopping etc. If my buddy needs something and I’m not shopping that day I just ask on the group if any of the other buddies are going and they will get it instead. It saves me going out as much.

I can’t see how he has really done anything wrong or asked for anything you didn’t offer. He doesn’t deserve to be spoken about in this way on here. Poor bloke.

TriangleBingo I understand completely why this business with the neighbour now feels too much.

There is no rush for a moment, and no stress. Let's just break this down.

This virus business started as a distant thing in China. Like SARS, or like Ebola in Africa and we all were scared but hoped it would stay away. Then it sort of tumblingly landed in Italy and Europe, and then clumsily and with an awful neatness ended up here, seemingly mostly thanks to ski trips at half term. We couldn't quite believe it. But it was still just in a GP practice in Brighton, soon closed up and hoses down.

It has all taken all of us by surprise, including governments.

But the big picture we were getting didn't seem too bad for anyone 'under 70'. 84% of people apparently had no significant symptoms at all, and of the 16% that did, they were all over 70, and the really seriously affected seemed to be over 90. I remember seeing a chart how there was 0.2% chance of fatality if you were 30-40, and sort of 14% if you were over 90.

So you, in your 30s, thought your risk was pretty much zero, and you wanted to do the decent thing, and help in a manageable way a neighbour in his 80s, who was unlucky enough to be very much at risk, by offering to pick up a few bits for him as you (hopefully) did the online shop for yourself. Or popped out, risk-free, to shops operating normally, your baby at nursery, all the under-70s getting on with their lives.

But the situation is nothing like that. And this is the point. And this is why you are (rightly) struggling and scared, and can't help your neighbour, and will have to change the deal.

A few weeks' ago (probably when you agreed to help the neighbour), Boris was jocular and jolly, hand washing would keep us all safe, and you were fine. Now it won't. Now we are all at risk. Now Boris has it and is looking rough. Now we can all get it, and struggle, and die. Now having asthma and being 30 is worse than being fit as a flea at 80. Now, to be honest, your neighbour should be helping you.

This has been such a weird drip-feed of the actual facts for all of us. Please, please don't feel bad or obliged. Your neighbour sounds fine. You sound very upset. It's all changed so much and so quickly, and it's been hard for us even to grasp what our 'new normal' is.

You are high risk. You have a baby. You have to stay at home. You shouldn't be going out and queuing and going in supermarkets and post offices. You should only be going out for a walk with the baby, and not touching anything or going near anyone.

Write the neighbour a note or call him. Explain how your situation has changed and you shouldn't go out and how difficult it is. Tell him about how he has shopping slots. He even will get an online slot eg with Ocado because of his age.

Find out if you yourself get slots due to your asthma and baby. If not, ask a friend to help you with some shopping. Stay at home. Your partner can possibly also once a week when out get essentials.

Now you know where you are, regroup and make a new daily and weekly framework for yourself.

Plan your day. What time up. When eating. When going for your walk. When preparing food. When working (when baby asleep?). Mostly: accept that this is now your holiday at home. This is your home time. Accept it and own it. Make it work for you and your baby. Make the most of it.

Plan Monday to Friday. And weekends. The days aren't the same. Each one is as usual - different, with its own character. Each morning look at a calendar, clock the day and date. Tick off each day as it goes. Get some purchase.

You aren't trapped - you can go for a walk, to Boots for some nappies (quickly in and out), maybe to a small independent shop with no queue for some bread and tomatoes or whatever.
But not to supermarkets and post offices. Avoid people like the plague ... and establish your protocol. When you come home, have a decontamination zone. Learn your routine. Shoes off and by the door. Pram or buggy left perhaps in a porch or hallway. Coat hat gloves left with pram. Hands washed. Phone sprayed and wiped. Then you're home.

Home is your haven, and it will keep you safe. This is a special time and you can make it work for you. Just do some simple planning and build a new framework for your day and week.

Apologise and explain to the neighbour. Anyhow now they're even doing an essential weekly food drop for older people. Get him finding out on the internet. There's lots of help for him. Ask another neighbour to help him.

And maybe they can help you too. But disinfect anything that comes in from outside. If you have a dining room, put any bags in there and don't bring into your main living space like the kitchen.

Simple protocol to keep you safe. Because it turns out you would only be sensible to do this.

Just concentrate on your home and enjoy the time with your baby and take this situation by the scruff of the neck and make it work for you.

It's the only way 💪🏻

It’s Very easy to be haughty about someone else not wanting to put in the time or effort, when it’s not their time or effort being compromised

Or that some of us have years of interacting with volunteers who offer because they like to feel helpful and virtuous and ‘good people’ but then balk when they find the reality less satisfying and more demanding than they imagined.
Which is their right, but gets wearing.
Especially when they blame the recipient rather than their own inability to set boundaries and judge what they are capable of managing, or go into martyr mode rather than using words.