To wonder if they are nasty to most teachers ?

[Werkinggirl]

I've been in a new school for 3 weeks. To be fair it's a challenging school in a deprived area, but i've had so many nasty comments.
What annoys me is then when I see the nasty students being nice and showing respect to other teachers !
I follow the behaviour policy and apply C3s for both poor behaviour and work that is not complete or to a poor standard, and extreme issues I have them removed by on-call.
I'm shocked to see just how nasty some students are.
I've had quite a few nasty comments about my appearance, picking apart my face, analysing the way I walk, my voice, anything. Making fun of my mannerisms, things I didn't even realise I did !
Today a girl I have never taught shouted at me that my hair was a mess.
I've been told 'you peck head, you bore me' all sorts of stuff. Sworn at, told to shut up. If you ask them a simple instruction they about, "alright, jesus christ chill !" at you and make comments about how their old teacher is so much better, can actually teach etc.
Fortunately there are some lovely and hardworking students who I have never had issues with.
I've had 2 girls pretend to throw up when I walked past and say out loud "she's horrible".
I've managed to get some students on side and they know I expect the work to be done or it will result in a detention.
I had a class who behaved brilliantly and my last lesson with them I bought some biscuits. One girl whispered "Why the fuck is she handing out biscuits she's fucking weird".
There are of course known troublemakers who play up for every single teacher, but I feel like a failure when I see the other teachers getting so much respect, as I feel I am very fair.
I've only been there 3 weeks and don't know if I can take the constant nastiness and rudeness. If a peer were speaking to me like that I would just shut them down, but in school we have to be the example and be professional. What would you do ?

Don't react.

If you are IMMUNE to whatever they say?

It will eventually get old and they will get used to you.

I know a very sharp science teacher. New in the school, girl was giving him lip to be popular.

Sit down! he said
No I won't your a ....
Well, stand up then!

The whole class laughed at her because now whatever she did she was doing what he wanted and he won them over.

Lovemusic33
The biscuits come later once the basics are sorted.

Usually this is the process:

• basic human respect and meeting entirely reasonable basic expectations
• embedding teacher specific routines and building relationships
• established relationships where you and the class have a strong class culture that's underpinned by firm and fair expectations and boundaries.

It's the final one where the treats and the jokes come in.

Looking at your replies you are becoming defensive. You will not automatically get respect from all pupils, it has not and never will work like that, despite what people think "should" happen. You mention this is a deprived catchment, pupils often have barriers in their own lives, school may not be a priority. You need to factor this in.

Keep following school policy, keep establishing boundaries, keep positive in recognising wanted behaviour. How is their actual work?

You are calling teenage girls nasty on the Internet, arguing against repeated advice. The teachers eho have respect have worked to estsblish that. Despite you thinking you are doing the same, you clearly are not.

Thank you for the replies ! I will keep trying and it would be a shame to give up already, i'm sure it will improve, thanks for the help and support ! It's stressful and I haven't meant to come across that way, but I think some posters do automatically criticise and go a bit far.

Your OP is really sad to read. It’s bullying. It doesn’t matter if you are a teacher or another student. The replies are suggesting this is part and parcel of your job and I’m sorry but that attitude is part of the problem. It’s absolutely disgusting behaviour and wouldn’t be tolerated in any other workplace. It should not be accepted and it’s part of the problem in this society.
It’s really worrying the lack of respect shown by teenagers.

I'm not sure how many on here have taught, but when you are insulted and sworn at on a daily basis and I have followed the behaviour policy, it's very tough. I have taken into account that some have very tough home lives, but I think that most kids should have learned that they need to respect teachers, and that's my opinion.

@sachastark - you sound an inspirational teacher

The resource that fiestar linked upthread is really good advice.

@Werkinggirl - I hope things improve for you quickly. There's some good advice on this thread.

That is your opinion, yes. Good luck with that.

I have been teaching for 10 years, i have been there, but you need to change your approach as they won't. What you think should happen, will not happen. Its not like this is a secret, it is well reported how many are leaving teaching and has been for many years.

You either adapt, or die on your arse.

Thanks a lot, and i'll look at the link !

Yanbu - the personal attacks are completely unacceptable and fortunately quite unusual. They should be punished as either they don’t know they’re being rude and need to be educated or they do now and are nasty. A girl in my class called me ‘4 eyes’ she was punished by my head of dept.
You need support for the personal attacks.
Anything else I agree with the good humoured attitude if you can with firm boundaries. And it does get easier. I have taught for 14 years and the first year at two of my 3 schools was awful and it got better each year from then on.

You may get more consistently relevant advice from fellow teachers if you post in staffroom.

You've got a couple of issues here OP. One is that your cohort is challenging and those students need teachers who care and will be consistent in the face of challenging behaviour. To generalise, I would guess the school has high staff turnover and many students have varying levels of stability with the adults in their lives. If you can crack behaviour you get a wonderful loyalty from those students. The second is whether SLT support staff in following the behaviour policy. If SLT are ineffective then even string teachers are fighting an uphill battle and weaker / newer teachers are left to struggle. In that situation you may as well start looking for a new school because the systemic issues are too vast.

@SpaceDinosaur worst teaching advice ever.

I have been where you are op and I can guarantee it will get easier, it's just whether you have the energy and desire to stick it out. Definitely try to win their respect, unfortunately it doesn't always come automatically with teenagers. In my nqt year I volunteered to run after school and Saturday classes, just things like revision classes, but it helped to build those relationships and show the pupils that I cared about their outcomes. Do you have a tutor group? They are always a way in as you can get to know them really well and be a little less guarded and more yourself with them. I am no longer teaching full time as it fills me with dread so I can totally empathise but I do miss those relationships you form with pupils.

As an ex HOD and NQT mentor, two things I always used to tell teachers starting in some of the most deprived UK schools: students will test boundaries and expect you to give up and leave. For some of these kids, they have had one or even both parents leave; many parents simply don't care - often the ones that side with the kids when you phone home as the parents are trying to save race and pretend they're well behaved at home. Equally, with teacher retention in schools in some areas being appalling, chances are they've seen teacher after teacher give up and leave even through the year.

Follow your behaviour policy, phone home every time and do not try to be their friend. Kids respond to boundaries, but it takes time. Listen to them - school is often not their biggest battle in life. Often, these will be the hardest kids to win - but they'll be the most loyal you will ever teach.

Have you sought advice from the SLT about it? You should be being supported better in a new job, particularly your first post as an NQT.

It's a well known ploy for them to say their last teacher was better - it probably isn't true, but they say it because it's what they were used to. You have to not react or let it appear to bother you - oh dear, well never mind you've got me now.

Once a child told me that her sister (who had left) hated me. Fortunately I was old enough and ugly enough not to give a shiny shit. So I said "Oh dear that's a shame because I like her" and then I moved briskly on and forgot all about it. They are kids, that's all, no matter how big they seem, and you are the adult.

Three weeks - although it probably seems like three years to you - is really no time at all. I am sure you are doing all the right things but it takes time. And there is nothing wrong with a few biscuits (as long as there are no nut allergies in the class).

You have asked for feedback but are very defensive in your responses.

The scenarios you describe sound horrible. It might be a school where these things are sadly normal and tolerated. If it can take 2 years for even a really great teacher to be able to stamp it out, I would leave, because I wouldn't be prepared to put up with it for 2 years.

However, in most schools you would be able to sort this out much faster .....if you are a teacher with good behaviour management. It. Might be that your behaviour management in reality isn't very good....I'm not justifying their behaviour - it isn't acceptable or deserved, but there are better and worse responses. There are also different possible reactions from you....and the way you are responding on here to adult, helpful posters makes me wonder how you respond in the classroom and if you're very defensive in there too. It is clearly upsetting you a lot, but the kids absolutely mustn't know that. And your interest in it being unfair that they behave well for others and not you is a bit odd.

How much support have you got with the behaviour management and from senior management in terms of follow up when you follow the sanctions policy? You need to keep enforcing it and being firm. You do need to be positive too and kindness/interest does often win children round but that's not biscuits or inconsistent kindness and interest.

I sympathise because it sounds grim. Personally I wouldn't work in a school like that. I believe I could get control of the situation, but simply don't want to work in a place with that kind of behaviour and need for the discipline systems required to manage it.

Without sounding unkind or making a judgement (because I can't possibly know the answer to the question) are you suited to this job? Managing this kind of behaviour and teaching in this kind of environment isn't for everyone. How did you do with this stuff last year when training.....were you right up there and succeeding with it or just scraping through on behaviour management and teaching generally? Especially if you are hating it,nit is worth thinking about if it is really for you. It may well be and be the case that you just need a bit of time to establish yourself, or might be that even with lots of time, you won't manage it or manage to to a point you can feel happy with it. Only you can assess that.

a) students will test new teachers, insecure students will do this the most
b) the school you are in sounds shit. You have no back up - does your department head not realise that this disrespect reflects on him/her, and what they are allowing to happen to their staff?
c) teaching is shit but the first year is especially shit.

You are describing some extreme behaviours by a minority of older students. Focus on the majority especially younger years7-9. As advised earlier think about the kind of teacher you want to be. Preserve your energy levels and pick the battles you can win. School populations change rapidly next year will be very different. Regarding the unpleasant behaviour towards you. Report in a neutral fashion and ask for support from a middle leader. Head of year or department. Don’t get dragged into lengthy restorative conversation or phone calls home 😉

Agree where are the senior management in their support of you?
Have you escalated it and they know what is going on? If they do and are doing nothing since you as a supply teacher are not obligated to stay I would be telling them on Monday that you will be leaving at the end of the week?
You should not have to put up with this level of abuse, have you told your agency? Have you thought about Primary supply say Ks2, which is not without its own challenges?
That said I do think you are somewhat naive, those teachers who have the respect you refer will been there for years and know the pupils well. Some teachers will also never admit to having problems.
As an aside I never bought a treat for any pupils apart from chocolate for my form at Christmas.

You’re taking it to personally. I got called fat the other day, I’m I size 8. I just replied with ‘yeah, you really me that time!’

OP, I’m a teacher of more than 20 years experience and I would say you need to be hard but fair with these kids. Don’t get into a debate with them, avoid sarcasm and follow the behaviour policy. I would also contact home as soon as one kid steps out of line. (Obviously check with pastoral heads that this is OK and there isn’t some reason why you can’t). Speaking to parents about rudeness, disrespect and the like often pays dividends later.

Bring kids back for restorative discussions during their lunch breaks (a detention but one with meaning) and use plenty of praise on the good kids.

Make sure you get support form your faculty and lastly remember it is only a job. You can walk away if the kids are really shit.

I think that if parents had to pay for their child’s education they would be much more supportive of the school. When it is free many parents treat it as something they have no involvement with.

It isn’t a popularity contest and your sounding like an adolescent teen yourself OP.

Teach the way your were taught and if your finding it difficult ask your manager for advice.