To think the school counsellor should be giving us information re dd15

[W1nt3rb3rr13s]

Dd has been self harming and has been seeing the school counsellor. We weren’t informed sessions had started. We know nothing about why she is doing it or what is being discussed at said sessions and thus how we can help her. She doesn’t talk to us at all.She spends every available time in her room on her lap top. Today it was until 2 when I came back and removed it. She then said the counsellor said she should have as much screen time as she wants as it distracts her. I disagree. I think she needs to get out of her room, off screens, to get some exercise and a hobby. As there is no dialogue I can’t discuss this with said counsellor or ask why she would advise her in such a way or even how we could help her. She’s 15 and still a child and it seems ridiculous. We’ve been to GP who has referred us to CAMHS. We got a crappy postcard through the post and that was it.

I am sorry you are in this situation.

My DD had a year of counselling from the young person’s worker at Women’s Aid. The agreement was that I would only be told things with my DD’s consent and particularly things which would be helpful for me to know to support my DD. The counsellor saw her outside school as well (DD’s choice; she saw my other child in school time) and often took her for walks - this had to be with my consent, though.

That might not be helpful for your situation but I did find that the counselling helped DD and I did respect her privacy in terms of what was discussed and made sure to act on what support was requested. I think the possible way forward is to ask if the counsellor and DD have any ways in which you can help support DD, if you have not already done so.

I think you have to let go of the WHY she is self-harming at the moment. She probably doesn't even have a rationale answer that she can make sense of to herself just yet.

She is talking to someone... That means at some point she's realised she needs help. It may get worse before it gets better as the frustrations, guilt and coping strategies are all still in play while continuing to talk it through could trigger.

All you can deal with as her parent is how she is in the home. Read up as much as you can... It'll give you a sense of what she needs (the big one never to ask why). This research will provide a much generic advice as the counsellor can give.

I can understand your own frustration and anger. But right now you need to provide a safe environment for your daughter to mess up from time to time while she is battling with her demons every single day.

It’s a shame you’re responding to all posts, regardless of them being helpful or unhelpful, in the same way.

I’m out.

Just had to reply to this, though:

Where are you getting this information? School counsellors absolutely can and do give all sorts of advice and strategies around the management of self-harm.

From the BACP guidelines our school counsellor has shared with our school.

Properly out now!

Family Same. Its too painful to watch. So many posters suggesting very good ideas. I do so hope DD finds what'll help her best and recovers.

OP, you really need to let go of the idea that you have a right to know all your daughters thoughts, feelings and medical information. Medical letters, such as camhs, will come addressed to her as she is old enough to make her own medical decisions. In going to the gp and accessing counselling through school it seems she is making some good ones.

Of course it is frustrating to feel shut out, but if your DD feels like you aren't respecting her boundaries (ones to which she is legally entitled) it wouldn't improve your relationship.

Self-harming in itself might not be a reason for them to break confidentiality, unless it was quite severe.

From the BACP guidelines our school counsellor has shared with our school.

So your school has been told by the school counselor that they are forbidden by the BACP to give children who self-harm any coping strategies for helping them to manage/reduce their self-harm? That's utterly bizarre and there must be some miscommunication here.

I was going to comment and help but then I RTFT and am struck by the OP’s sheer aggressiveness and combativeness - not one “thank you for your time/advice” that I can see and just barking at posters. I’m not getting in now, as don’t wish to have head snapped off. I really really hope DD feels better very soon.

I wonder if you could speak to the pastoral lead at DD's school OP? They may give advance and support on how to beat support your DD and they should coordinate the support.
They may consider a referral to their school Educational psychologist perhaps? Not for direct working with your child but to review the situation and give school and home coordinated advice. This will be in addition to the counsellor whose role is to work with clients confidentially (apart from in suicidal situations) and help the client work through why they might be feeling this way and seeking alternative ways of thinking and coping.
Mind and Young Minds give great advice on self harm and the young minds parent helpline is really helpful

I don't want to sound harsh but tone is hard to convey in text so please don't think I'm being horrible but the counsellor isn't there for your benefit, OP. I get it's hard to not know anything but just imagine if they did feed everything back to you. Do you think your DD would ever open up again? It's better that she talk to SOMEONE. It isnt going to be you, shes said that and I don't talk to my parents about my mental health either and have gone to great lengths to hide the fact that I'm even in therapy. If I had someone to talk to in confidence at her age then I likely wouldn't be in my current situation.

She wont talk to you. Period. Theres no point fighting her on it, teenagers are stubborn and she'll only dig her heels in the more you try to force it.

Isnt it better that someone knows what's going on in her head? The counsellor will break confidentiality in an instant if he/she thinks that DD is in danger or if she is any kind of major risk to herself.

Counselling works because you can say anything, any shameful, awful thought and the other person is bound by law never to repeat a word of it except in very specific circumstances. Otherwise it would just be like rentafriend and no one would open up for fear of it getting back.

OP, I just wanted to clarify something as a couple of posters have recommended you access help privately for your DD. I'm not disagreeing with this advice at all, but it's important you understand that if you go down this route any private practitioner will be bound by the same rules regarding confidentiality as the person your DD is already seeing.

Advice (not advance)

She prow doesn't know why she self harms, mental health is rarely so straight forward. And with any therapy sometimes things get worse to start with, before they get better. Because you are talking about the stuff that is wrong, instead of trying to forget about it.

You will need to do your own research. My dd has ASD and as a 6 yr old was suicidal. That didn't warrant any support from Camhs, we have had to learn as we go along. It is shit, and it makes you angry. But channel that into researching yourself.

The best thing you can do is to just be there. Show her you love her no matter what. That she has nothing to be ashamed of. Make mental health a normal topic of conversation in the household- ie share when you are fragile, upset, angry etc.

It's incredibly hard to watch your child suffering, but as many posters have said before, your DD has a right to privacy and confidentiality. It is often easier for a teenager to talk someone who is an outsider rather than a member of their family. Both my DDs have had counselling; it has benefited them enormously and I have never asked them or their counsellor to disclose the contents of their session because doing so would undermine the trust they needed to do the therapeutic work.

Self harm is difficult to treat; it is not particularly unusual for it to get worse initially with the start of counselling, because your DD will be confronting difficult feelings without having developed better coping strategies yet.

Instead of demanding full disclosure, you should seek support for yourself as suggested above, persevering with CAMHs to get your DD a full assessment and most of all you should find the strength to back off and let your DD find her own way to deal with her problems.

You say she does not have anxiety - how do you know that? It sounds to me as if you do not want her to have anxiety and as if you see her self harming as some kind of unhealthy self-indulgence. You need to let go of judgement.

I’ve only read to this comment ‘ Maybe your overbearing, intrusive and judgemental attitude is a huge part of the problem.’

But I agree.

OP, especially when you say about getting out and getting exercise.

Like that helps when you’re depressed enough to harm yourself physically 🤨

TBF OP your daughter has the right to speak privately with someone who she will hopefully be building trust with, as others have stated she's talking, that is good right?
Many children and adults can't talk to their parents because of the fear of hurting/upsetting/getting into trouble, as previously previously stated mental health is not straight forward and she may fear her thoughts would be too much for you OR she may just not want you to know!If you had any understanding of how the therapeutic relationship works you would understand that she's not going to be 'cured' over night and it is very normal for things to get worse at the beginning.
As a Mum I understand your frustration but as a therapist I urge you to support the relationship she is building with the therapist (but not in telling her to go or asking what she is talking about)and look at other ways of suporting her, look at your boundries with her, look at how and what you say to her and also look at ways of supporting yourself.
As hard as it is be gentle... that doesn't meanletting her get away with things though.
Also I doubt very much that the therapist advised her in that way, but it may be the way she's interpreted it/ or she's pushing her luck BUT again approuch that gently being mindful of the words you use.

If your daughter wants you to know everything she's talking to her counsellor about, she could tell you. But since she doesn't tell you, you don't have a right to know.

I do think it's reasonable to ask the counsellor for advice on how to support your daughter, because it sounds as though 'because the counsellor said so' is being used as an excuse to do whatever she wants. But don't expect details. And if the counsellor did break a confidence, I can assure you that would do serious damage to your daughter's long-term relationship with you. Why would you want that?

i think you dont need to know what the counsellor is saying to her or vice versa. I know it would be helpful for you to be less in the dark about it, and I know this is hard for you, but one of the main benefits of a counsellor IS that it is confidential.
2 of my kids had counselling and I never asked them what was said. I told them that the counsellor was there for them to talk to privately and to help them process what was going on in their life.

I think stop focusing on the counsellor. It doesnt sound like she is processing stuff with the counsellor if its all becoming worse, and im always unsure as to whether the standard 6 sessions is any use anyway, especially if as you say, its fortnightly. Id honestly try and forget that shes even having it, as theres no way youll get anything out of them and it would totally defeat the point.

I think with the screen time though, Id make sure your internet child settings are up to scratch for the wifi, and make sure her phone is contract so youve got some control as to adult content on there too.
She needs to know youre on her side more than anything

There is no judgement as regards her self harming. Conjecture.

Re anxiety. I’m aware what anxiety is and she doesn’t have it. She’s depressed, according to the counsellor so dd says.. Obviously if the counsellor has uncovered something that indicates anxiety we’re not privy to it( ridiculous situation)so can only handle her with the info we’ve got. Depression, not anxiety.

Also why are waiting for correspondence/ saying you haven’t heard off anyone?

Why haven’t you taken the steps to contact these people yourself?
If my DD was doing this I’d be doing my upmost to get us BOTH help. Not writing a thread on MN and getting passive aggressive about the responses.

We assumed the counsellor was handling it and that we’d have more info than we’re getting.So was sitting out our wait for CAMHs. Have been told by umpteen people that cahms is crap anyway and you can stamp your foot all you like but self harming is pretty common and you’re very unlikely to be fast tracked. Hence my view that the system is shit. Parents are left to deal with it with zero info or support.

Your inability understand the complexities and nuances that connect depression and anxiety, your aggression, your entitlement to be privy to your daughters thoughts from a protected counselling space, and your conviction that she needs to get out and about and exercise and sort of brush this all off - shows how stifled your daughter must be feeling.

Do you get on with your daughter op?

I understand you are worried but if school counsellors reported back to parents after every session you might as well cancel the service as many teens won’t use it and that would be far more damaging to their mental health.

I self harmed as a teenager. I was struggling with my sexuality and growing up in a religious household where I was repeatedly told that gay people go to hell etc. I was very depressed, scared of going to hell, scared of being disowned etc. When I went to counselling my self- harm initially got worse as she got me to face up to the realities and my fears and this made my mental health worse initially but then it got much much better once I had worked through that.

I was almost constantly suicidal and had numerous attempts. I honestly think if I hadn’t accessed the counselling I may have kept going until I was successful and if I thought my parents would be told I wouldn’t have accessed it. Sometimes teens can’t speak to their parents for whatever reason and forcing the issue will make her mental health much worse.

Let go of the why and focus on supporting her.