To feel under attack about sanpro

[Ibleedibreedibreaatfeed]

Mainly the brand changing its packaging to be trans friendly. Are we slowly eradicating womenhood? Along with " pregnant person". It feels such a slippery slope.

under attack

Really? Because a symbol has been taken off a wrapper?

Wow, call the police at this erosion of you rights. 🙄

No, it’s not because a female symbol was taken off a wrapper, it’s because an activist said it offended them and the company removed it.

An activist who has periods. Call yourself what you want but periods don’t lie...

Okay, how about this:

The venus symbol is actually a symbol of opression. Its been used to reinforce gender stereotypes that allow society to treat women as lesser. It references back to bloody Roman times with the male symbol chosen as mars because it denotes war, while the female symbol was chosen as venus as it denotes love. I mean its really not something we would actually ever want to hang on to.

Deciding we want to keep the venus symbol just because it was (allegedly) a trans gender individual who complained is like black people wanting to keep a 'whites only' sign up over a water fountain just because its removal was requested by Rachel Dolezal!

My identity as 'woman' is not erased by the removal of sexist symbology that has contributed to holding back my rights as a human being.

Its annoying that this message may have had more power coming from the trans voice, but given the shite spouted on this thread, maybe we are all to busy feeling attacked to challenge gender stereotypes anymore....

YANBU

Women have been telling Always we don't want their shitty scented pads for years. We've been ignored. But one trans person complains and they jump to attention? Talk about privilege.

Why is are the trans lobby so powerful?

It is a predominantly upper and upper middle class movement backed by American billionaires like J Pritzker.

Having the design upsets some people. Not having the design doesn't upset anyone. So don't have the design? Seems like an obvious solution rather than an attack.

By all means have concerns about valid issues but I think you need to really think about whether an issue genuinely affects you/women before getting worked up about it.

That's the part that might be considered transphobic - you're letting your worries about valid issues make you irrational about non-valid issues. Do you really want to hurt a lot of trans people to get one up on them because of something else? You need to separate the two in your head.

The Venus symbol was co-opted by second wave feminism to mean 'feminist', 'woman', 'womyn' and women-power.

And the trans lobby have so much power because of the phallus (or because they were born with or want dicks).

This is just getting stupid yes we are of an era where we need to respect other people for being who they are but to remove the female symbol from the towels because someone said it's not just women who bleed is a joke.
I'm sick of this behaviour now. I will be looking for another sanitary provider

By all means have concerns about valid issues but I think you need to really think about whether an issue genuinely affects you/women before getting worked up about it. That's the part that might be considered transphobic - you're letting your worries about valid issues make you irrational about non-valid issues. Do you really want to hurt a lot of trans people to get one up on them because of something else?

Well there's 135 messages on this thread alone (and a number of other threads, and a lot on Twitter) including many comments from women who are saying this issue does affect them and explaining how. Your point is interesting that you feel women are irrational when they are angered, or concerned for their choice of identity and recognition, and this is not valid, but that it's very important women should prioritise and concern themselves with the feelings of trans people.

Why do you wish to police whether or not what women express concerns about is valid?

What is ‘transphobia’ here? Saying that biologically if you menstruate your are a woman. Inside you are a woman. ‘You want the truth? You can’t handle the truth’ so to say.

It’s like a letter in an envelope - doesn’t matter why the envelope looks like - what size, shape or colour it is - it’s what’s inside that it what meat and veg of the matter. The envelope is actually irrelevant.

It’s fucking ridiculous and they won’t be getting a penny from me

Why do you wish to police whether or not what women express concerns about is valid?

I don't. I have a friend that tried committing suicide over seemingly minor things like this. I don't know any women that have tried to kill themselves over disposable packaging.

I don't think women specifically should fall over themselves to concern themselves with the feelings of trans people. What I think is that all people should try a little harder to show a modicum of compassion.

Also I wasn't calling the op transphobic, I was explaining why it might be perceived as transphobic because she asked.

because someone said it's not just women who bleed

Now I've got Alice Cooper in my head

It matters because we are seeing a slow and steady change of language and frames of reference.

• Remove the venus symbol because it's traditionally associated with females - misses the point that you can identify as a transman or non-binary, but you cannot identify out of being female.

• Use of the term 'cis' which reverses the norms of how women are framed in conversation. Transwomen are women and women now become cis-women or non-trans. The use of woman to mean an adult human female is considered offensive in some circles.

• Changes to female-specific experiences such as periods, pregnancy and breastfeeding - increasing use of 'period havers', gestators or 'pregnant people' and chestfeeding.

This goes right to the heart of advertising, campaigns and media. Look at the recent smear test campaign; instead of talking about women it referred to people with cervixes.

To label concerns and resistance against the steady removal of women-centred language and experiences as transphonic is lazy and unfair. I've posted before that there are many people like me who have spent years campaigning for trans people to be recognised, supported, protected and their voices amplified. The current tension arises from the fact that me, and others like me, believe strongly that this should not come at the expense of women and girls' hard-won and sex-based rights.

It may well be 'just' a symbol on a plastic cover - but it is illustrative of a far wider and deeper issue.

I don't. I have a friend that tried committing suicide over seemingly minor things like this. I don't know any women that have tried to kill themselves over disposable packaging.

That's awful and I sincerely hope that your friend managed to get the help and support they needed.

But - and I say this gently; if an image of a symbol of 'females' is enough to tip someone into attempting suicide then the answer is not to remove all visible references to women.

I’m soooooooo glad I don’t care about stuff like this.

If I'm flogging panty liners I want them to appeal to the people who use them, and some of them don't like it.

They don't show as much concern for the women who don't like the scented sanpro. It's lovely standing in boots sniffing packets and checking through the small print ingredients list trying to find the unscented ones. They could at least put 'SCENTED' in large letters across the front of the packs that are scented so they are easier to disregard.

Look at the recent smear test campaign; instead of talking about women it referred to people with cervixes.

Indeed, and in doing so excluded the most vulnerable women, those with learning disabilities, poor educational levels, English as a second language.

Failure to use plain English is actively harmful. It is an indication of how privileged the trans ideologists are that they either don't see this or don't care.

Yes think the posters have shown perfectly the reason why this is important. I try and use csp when i can. But the seeming power of this minority movement is overshadowing womens life in every way. Im shocked about the cervix cancer post!! I know their was a major shift in campaign for lesbians about HPV about 6yrs ago. I can't see that happening now as it might offend this group.

I stopped using Always years ago due to the perfume.
The other reporting about the sub standard product being sent to developing countries is fucking atrocious and needs dealing with.

I can boycott P&G as long as someone gives me an alternative to head and shoulders for a house plagued by dandruff which can be bought in BIG packaging as there's 5 of us.

Still no reply from P&G Always - email sent via their website contact page last Friday. I did get a follow up ‘how did we do?’ Survey though.

Someone hiding/binning emails then?

What did you ask them?

"Please put the misogynistic stereotype reinforcing symbology back on your pad wrappers because we are violently opposed to any change proposed by transgender individuals regardless of what that change is" ?

I hope they DID bin your email.

I merely asked if they were changing the packaging and if they had plans to review their products that had scents added.

It's their job to answer emails. And I am not 'violently opposed' to any change or individual (even if they are 'violently opposed' to having their periods).