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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Social services, police or keep my nose out of it

257 replies

hoxtonbabe · 14/09/2019 12:27

Hi, this is more a what should I do?

Back in July, I was getting ready with son for school, about 8.15am we heard lots of howling, crying, etc from somewhere at the back of our flat/garden. We then realised it was from one of the gardens opposite and that the parents of a girl aged around 4 had locked her out on the doorway/steps leading down to their garden. I’ve never really seen this family so thought it may have been an AirBnB???

The lady from the house who’s garden backs on to mine/opposite and is about 3 doors away from this family also heard the girl crying etc, and was asking if she was ok, where her mummy was etc but she just kept crying. I could see there were people in the flat, so realised it was a form of punishment after about 5 minutes of this i was about to call the police but then the mother came out, and although I couldn’t clearly hear what they were saying I could see the girl nodding yes, as the mother was calmly talking to her and then they went inside so I left it at that. I must add that the whole thing went on for about 15 mins in total, but initially I wasn’t focused on it as I was getting ready and thought it was just a child crying in general, but when it didn’t stop and was sounding more distressing that’s when I actually looked to see where it was coming from.

Roll on today, my son comes running into my bedroom saying that girl has been locked out again and she’s crying. Now I’m thinking this not a one off air bnb and this doesn’t seem right. Same as before, mum is in the house, girl is crying please let me in, mum then eventually let’s her back in.

Where I’m wavering is who do I call? My gut instinct is SS, or do I leave this family to discipline their child in the way they want ( even though she cries so loud most of us within a 10house radius can hear her ) whilst I’ve witnessed this twice in the space of 2 months, that’s not to say it hasn’t happened when I’ve been out.

They haven’t physically harmed her to my knowledge, and I supposed it’s an extreme version of a time out. Other than the foxes that are usually sunbathing on people’s deck chairs there is no chance of her getting taken, however if she was to get so distraught and Shuffled around she could fall down the metal stairs ( there is at least 10 steps).

OP posts:
Fizzypoo · 14/09/2019 12:32

I don't like the sound of that. Sounds like the parents are struggling and need a bit of support.

I'd log your concerns with a call. They'll hopefully get assessed and referred to whatever early family help there is and get onto parenting classes.

dollydaydream114 · 14/09/2019 12:42

It does sound like their version of ‘the naughty step’. And I suspect plenty of kids cry and scream and sound distressed on the naughty step or when sent to their room, too - it’s just that as they’re not outdoors, nobody hears them.

As for ‘she could fall down the steps’ - well, yes she could, but a four year old could fall down any steps anywhere at any time, including in the house.

Is she dressed OK for the weather in the 10
or 15 minutes she’s outdoors? Or are they leaving her outside shivering in the rain?

BogglesGoggles · 14/09/2019 12:45

This isn’t any different to sending a child to their room. Would ss care?

MajesticWhine · 14/09/2019 12:48

I will confess - I used to put DD2 out in the garden (completely enclosed small patio) when she was being impossible. It was a bit like a naughty step / timeout punishment. Probably not the most brilliant parenting I admit.
In your case, could you have a friendly word with the neighbour and make her aware that you have seen this going on?

Jeezoh · 14/09/2019 12:50

Give the NSPCC a call and get their advice but I’d be inclined to report it. It might be nothing or it might help build a picture of the child’s home life that needs looking into. Either way, let the professionals decide.

IsobelRae23 · 14/09/2019 12:52

I would never dream of shutting my dc outside, but that’s just me🤷🏻‍♀️

RoomR0613 · 14/09/2019 12:53

I don't think the police or social services would care.

Can you imagine the calling the police to report that the neighbours have made their children go outside for 10-15 mins?

My mum used to do this when she was fed up of us squabbling inside the house or if we were being noisy when she was trying to concentrate on something, or trying to mop the floor or something. We hated it because it was boring and often a bit drizzly, but it didn't do us any harm.

Original poster
hoxtonbabe · 14/09/2019 12:58

She’s dressed ok, not in the rain. The steps are a concern as they are metal, most indoor steps are carpeted and not as steep as these ones.

I think SS would be concerned if they knew the parent Was locking the child in the room. This parent is locking her outside.

OP posts:
NoDontLookAtMeImShy · 14/09/2019 13:00

When my DS was 4 and in the throws tantrums - every single day for hours on end - I had a moment of madness and shut him in the garden. I think my brain was just attempting to put space between him and I before I hurt him.
I realised my error after a mere few seconds and obviously opened the door and got him back in and never did it again.

It's not good parenting. That was not my finest moment by a long shot.

But she's done it twice and prolonged, not a fit of desperation.

I'd report it to SS as it sounds like she's might be at the end of her tether.

Juells · 14/09/2019 13:02

A friend's child bullied her whole family by screaming and screaming and screaming until she'd get her way. I had to look after her one weekend, and I finally put her outside the back door and told her she'd have to stay there for five minutes. No point in saying "until you stop screaming" as she could keep it up for ever. Perhaps the parents are struggling with a child like that?

MinisterforCheekyFuckery · 14/09/2019 13:05

Call the NSPCC for advice.

Mummyoflittledragon · 14/09/2019 13:05

It depends on the child perhaps. My dd would have been distraught if I ever tried this. I can’t send her to her room for example as I have tried it a couple of times and you would think I’m threatening to kill her. She doesn’t deal with time out well.

My cousin otoh used to put her dd at this age in the car for a time out when out and about. Her dd didn’t cry.

By the reaction of the little girl, I’d say this punishment is inappropriate for her. A word with the nspcc would be a good thing imo.

1FineDane · 14/09/2019 13:06

Poor little thing. How old is the little girl? If SS could refer the parents to parenting classes, it might help the little one.

QuestionableMouse · 14/09/2019 13:06

My mother used to put my coat on me and sit me on the step outside to wait for the man from the naughty girls home.

That was 30 odd years ago and I still remember the terror of it.

Not saying that's what this family are doing but for the little girl's sake I'd let SS know.

sheshootssheimplores · 14/09/2019 13:06

We have shut our son out in the garden on two occasions I think in the past. I can’t remember how it came about but he was being totally irrational and I think we said something like garden or bed, he said garden and so I put him out there.

I think in your situation I wouldn’t do anything right now but I would keep an eye on the family generally and see if you can gauge the situation better. It could be nothing or it could be something.

1FineDane · 14/09/2019 13:08

Also agree with a pp that the fact that the child is so distressed, means it's probably not appropriate for her.

ZzzMarchhare · 14/09/2019 13:09

I’ve shut myself in the garden to escape the kids. Sometimes you need space else you loose the plot.

adaline · 14/09/2019 13:11

This isn’t any different to sending a child to their room.

Of course it is. Bedrooms aren't outside and next to roads with cars on, for starters!

JulietTango · 14/09/2019 13:12

If yours is the only report they won't be interested but if school have made a couple of reports and maybe there's someone else who has made a report then it is just a part of a bigger picture.

You have no idea what's already happened. Personally i would report. It can then be filed or acted upon as social services deem most appropriate

1FineDane · 14/09/2019 13:13

I used to shut my dd outside the door to our flat (flat above a shop). Once, my sister, a teacher was with us when I did it and she went mental at me. My rationale was that she was in time out. My sister said that if that was done in a school, she'd be struck off. My sister said, 'what if she falls down the stairs?'. I replied 'she's a tantruming 3 year old, not a suicidal toddler'. In the heel of the hunt, I don't think I ever used that same punishment again.
When I think about it, if we didn't have a private entrance, would I have put her out on the street, in full view of the public? Answer: No. Why? Because somebody would call SS for cruelty and neglect.

So, while some of us have done similar, it's not good parenting really and they need to find a better form of discipline.

JoxerGoesToStuttgart · 14/09/2019 13:13

I’d ring SS and let them do the work of deciding whether it’s a concern or not.

Reallybadidea · 14/09/2019 13:16

I think that if you feel uncomfortable enough about the situation to consider calling social services then you should call them. They have the knowledge and expertise to make a judgement about whether this warrants further enquiries. And I was once told that sometimes it's having different pieces of the jigsaw that can make the difference - maybe someone else has raised other concerns and this is the bit of information that creates a picture.

Good for you for caring

Original poster
hoxtonbabe · 14/09/2019 13:19

Thanks for your replies.

That’s just it, had the mum told her off and said sit on the steps and she was just there staring into space or chatting away to herself or having a whinge, I’d not even start this thread, but it’s the way she is screaming, begging to come back in, knocking on the door.. you know when kids cry so much to the point they are catching their breath (hyperventilating I think), that is how this girl is..

OP posts:
sailingclosetothewind · 14/09/2019 13:20

You are overreacting. It might be that the little girl is being sent outside to cool off, if she is losing it inside maybe she is asked to go outside and calm down. I don't see the problem really as long as she isn't cold and her mother isn't hurting or shouting at her.

If you have a child that is behaving terribly, far better to put them outside for five minutes than lose your cool and smack them. The naughty step inside for a child of that age might be better.

SS will not respond to this. Keep us updated if you call NSPCC

Tonnerre · 14/09/2019 13:22

As for ‘she could fall down the steps’ - well, yes she could, but a four year old could fall down any steps anywhere at any time, including in the house.

Well, no, due to the fact that if they're unsafe on stairs parents will probably have put stairgates up; and they're really not likely to punish them by shutting them somewhere where they are at top of a flight of steps with nowhere else to go. The risk that, in a state of distress the child could well fall is obvious - also she may try to go down the stairs and slip, and/or go out into the road. I think this does merit a call to SS, or at least the NSPCC.