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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

I'm appalled that parents ask their child to lie about term time holidays.

223 replies

Soontobe60 · 09/08/2019 10:00

I've seen many threads on MN where parents ask about taking their children on holiday during term time. Will it be authorised? Will they be fined? Does it count as exceptional circumstances? Should I just phone in sick? My big concern is that by phoning in sick, the parents are then expecting their child to lie about the holiday before they go away, and then again on their return to school. I can't say how these parents coach their dcs in the lying but I can imagine it's something along the lines of 'The headteacher is really mean and won't let you come on holiday so we need to keep it a secret. Mummy might get fined and that wouldn't be fair. Remember, don't tell anyone.'

The pressure that child is then put under is huge, from the moment the lie is concocted until well after the holiday is over. I just can't see why a parent would do that to their child. It's tantamount to abuse. So many times I've seen children try to lie to staff or other children about their holiday and it's awful. I know they're lying, I know their parents are lying.

What then happens when that same child tells their parent a lie about something they may have done, and their parent tells them lying is wrong? What they actually mean is it's ok to lie if it stops mummy or daddy getting into trouble.

If you want to save money by going on holiday in term time then own it! Budget for getting the fine whilst you're budgeting for the actual holiday. Tell the school well in advance, and accept that it will most probably be unauthorised and may incur a fine.

Please, just don't make your child lie for you.

OP posts:
shrunkenhead · 09/08/2019 18:48

I agree attendance certificates are unfair on those kids with serious health issues as they can't help having time off. However I think the original idea behind them is to stop kids/parents thinking a sneeze = a day off and to ensure that kids and parents aspire to get to school. It sets them up for life. You can't take time off work for minor illnesses etc so it instils a good work ethic in them.

Passthecherrycoke · 09/08/2019 18:49

“sitting on a hot beach getting fat”

Why would sitting on a beach Make them fat? 😭😭😭

ElleDubloo · 09/08/2019 18:49

@Passthecherrycoke My answer to the barn scenario would simply be to not go. Those 1-2 weeks as a family could easily (and cheaply) be spent at home. Being physically in a different location shouldn’t be necessary!

shrunkenhead · 09/08/2019 18:51

Because sitting isn't the most energetic activity.....???Hmm

SinisterBumFacedCat · 09/08/2019 18:52

sitting on a hot beach getting fat

Grin you have never been on a beach with a child.

Passthecherrycoke · 09/08/2019 18:52

It is to us @ElleDubloo- a family holiday is far more important than 7 hours at school
On the last day of summer term. In fact, the last 7 hours at school before summer term aren’t important at all

ElleDubloo · 09/08/2019 18:57

@Passthecherrycoke Well this is where we differ. I actually think school for kids is just the same as work for adults. Reasons for missing school need to be as good as reasons for missing work: illness, bereavement... other really good reasons... lol. It just sets up a good habit from an early age. Even if I know my day at work is going to be a bit of a waste, I still bloody well turn up! If my boss says I can’t take AL on a certain day, then I simply don’t!

@Passthecherrycoke Are you really saying that quality time can only happen when you’re physically distant from your home? That’s sad!

Passthecherrycoke · 09/08/2019 19:01

I can take annual leave from work whenever I like though so it’s in no way comparable.

“Are you really saying that quality time can only happen when you’re physically distant from your home? That’s sad!”

I know I didn’t say that, you know I didn’t say that. I know you’re trying for some easy point scoring on an Internet forum, but you’ve made yourself look very rigid and emotionally immature. I’m sure you’re not.

ElleDubloo · 09/08/2019 19:08

@passthecherrycoke You’re very lucky that you can take AL whenever you want, but can you acknowledge that other working people often have to make compromises and it’s no way “disgusting” it’s just a part of grown up life?

Also you said you had to go on this barn holiday which cost £1500 more in school holidays and was crucial to your family’s quality time, and I said that you can probably still have quality time without going to this barn.

cunningartificer · 09/08/2019 19:12

It used to be much more straightforward for schools; you could authorise up to ten days absence per child per year.

Now that attendance is one of the things most closely monitored (to be fair, research shows it has a measurable impact on attainment, authorised or not), schools are simply not allowed to authorise absence for holidays—they’re not being mean, there genuinely isn’t a code for it.

So please don’t assume teachers are out to get you or disapprove—they’re just record keeping. As a head, you can authorise a family emergency etc but you’ll be quizzed by ofsted about it, and it doesn’t matter how genuine illnesses are (one school I know once had a notifiable infectious disease that meant it had to close and get disinfected) you’re still accountable for low attendance figures. One of the many annoying changes to school management!

Secretmeerjng · 09/08/2019 19:13

I’m appalled that the state has such a say over family life that it can restrict when families go on holiday

Passthecherrycoke · 09/08/2019 19:17

“Also you said you had to go on this barn holiday which cost £1500 more in school holidays and was crucial to your family’s quality time, and I said that you can probably still have quality time without going to this barn.”

@ElleDubloo I didn’t say anything of the sort.

Few people aren’t so restricted by their employers they don’t get any choice in their annual leave. Besides, your mum phoning in sick to school to take you on holiday has absolutely no bearing on whether you would phone in sick for 2 weeks of work so you can go away. In fact, you’d have to be a bloody idiot to do that, since you’d need a doctors note etc. Schools and work places aren’t the same

Lind57 · 09/08/2019 19:23

Wondering if the posters who encourage their children to lie about term time holidays are the same ones who come on Mumsnet fuming because their child has complained about the teacher and it must be true because their child never tells lies?

Fragalino · 09/08/2019 19:25

Arf elle.

You actually tagged me in to directly message me about sitting on a beach getting fat. 😂

In a morally divisive post to me, lecturing me 😂.

Elle as a family we adore beaches but we don't go on expensive package beach holidays. Sitting on a beach is a small part of our holidays. Grin
And we don't sun bathe.
Charities who represent poor dc. Have highlighted the importance of quality family time and holidays. The fines and the worries simply do not affect richer parents so it's poorer kids who will suffer. And who do suffer.

Fragalino · 09/08/2019 19:27

Elle, all travel is hugely beneficial for dc.. My dc grow as people even after a night away somewhere new.

It broadens everything, sometimes the waist line.

Fragalino · 09/08/2019 19:30

Elle, BTW we live in area of designated outstanding beauty and high tourist spot. We live near some of the best museums in the entire world. We do all of that, going away is special and different .

People feel like they are getting away. It's emotional. It's very good to go somewhere different.

herculepoirot2 · 09/08/2019 19:45

Also, it’s ok to peg holidays as Unnecessary but when the parents work full time, weekends are full of activities and long drives to visit grandparents, Christmas is a whirlwind of organising things and so on, a week or 2 away as a family is very precious. Non negotiable for us

None of those things are work other than Christmas. 🙄

pucelleauxblanchesmains · 09/08/2019 20:01

" sitting on a hot beach getting fat" charming

bluebluezoo · 09/08/2019 20:03

Charities who represent poor dc. Have highlighted the importance of quality family time and holidays. The fines and the worries simply do not affect richer parents so it's poorer kids who will suffer. And who do suffer

My poor suffering kids. So if I cannot afford holidays every year then I am causing my kids suffering? Thanks.

Maybe term time leave should be means tested then so us poor folks can get our two weeks abroad?

Does a week in spain reduce suffering more than Brighton in a tent? Is their a scale of suffering corresponding with holiday value?

HorridHenrysNits · 09/08/2019 20:12

Yabu.

FishCanFly · 09/08/2019 20:18

Patiently waiting for some climate warriors to tell us off for going on holidays at all 😁

Passthecherrycoke · 09/08/2019 20:21

@herculepoirot2 did you misread the post? Your response makes no sense whatsoever

Teddy275 · 09/08/2019 20:21

Felt sad the other day- a boy in my class had missed one day of school due to a term time holiday (which technically wasn't as they'd been away mostly for half term Monday-Monday) and mum had phoned in sick.

Boy had come to school and was practically falling asleep within an hour so I phoned mum to come and collect him as (as far as I knew) he'd been ill the day before and I was concerned he still wasn't well.

As we were waiting for mum to arrive, his big brother walked by and, in panic, had a right go at him ending with them both being distraught and thinking they were going to be in trouble.... turns out they'd arrived home at 3am that morning and been sent to school for 9am in fear of 'the fine'. So I think yanbu to some extent.

I think if parents knew the full facts about the fine they would worry less about being caught and would be more honest about it. I spend more time worrying about the children who regularly miss 1 or 2 days a week for no apparent reason and those are the children I am referring for further investigation. I'm not saying that the fines don't happen, just that we really do have bigger fish to fry and won't judge you for taking your children on a lovely holiday! I wish I could do the same (and I did when on maternity leave last year!)

We also had one parent phone and tell us her mother had died to cover up holiday absence which was just awful. 😔 x

Puzzledandpissedoff · 09/08/2019 20:27

I think if parents knew the full facts about the fine they would worry less about being caught and would be more honest about it

I very much doubt it TBH. It took me precisely 25 seconds to find the "fine guidelines" for my own LA, and if parents can sort out holiday bookings online I wouldn't this to be beyond more than a very few

FishCanFly · 09/08/2019 20:40

Maybe term time leave should be means tested then so us poor folks can get our two weeks abroad?
How about NOBODY to be tested or have to go cap in hand asking for permission.
Actually plenty of parents work in industries where school holidays are not an option.