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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask why aibu is so anti-trans?

712 replies

BinkyBaa · 04/06/2019 02:51

Just that really. I don't mean to be goady I've just noticed that when it comes up here, people seem more against it than other social circles I'm familiar with. I think I'm a bit out of the loop as to what the issue is.

OP posts:
GrumpyCatLives · 04/06/2019 02:54

Which posts are you referring to? I haven't seen any transphobia. If you know of some, point it out and I'll help you report it and get it deleted ASAP.

OkPedro · 04/06/2019 02:57

Of course you don’t mean to be goady Smile

DinkyTie · 04/06/2019 02:58

My thoughts exactly @OkPedro Smile

echt · 04/06/2019 03:13

AIBU isn't thing, you know. Posters start threads, others respond.

echt · 04/06/2019 03:14

Grrrrr a thing.

RubberTreePlant · 04/06/2019 03:22

I don't mean to be goady

Mmm-hmm.

IAmAlwaysLikeThis · 04/06/2019 03:30

The "issue" is that this is one of the few online spaces where people haven't drunk the kool aid.

AgentJohnson · 04/06/2019 03:42

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Nephilim1964 · 04/06/2019 03:43

Not anti-trans but pro-woman. There's a difference.

MaxiPaddy · 04/06/2019 03:50

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MangoSplit · 04/06/2019 04:25

Mumsnet is a feminist place, which is fab as there aren't many of them around on the internet! Unfortunately, some of the aims of the trans activists conflict with women's rights (eg transwomen competing in women's sport, transwomen sharing women's safe spaces such as refuges, transwomen committing crimes and being recorded as women which skews the victim/perpetrator statistics). Many Mumsnetters believe that we need to stand up for women's rights in these areas.

isabellerossignol · 04/06/2019 04:33

Maybe Mumsnetters like facts. And the fact is that putting on a dress and wearing makeup doesn't make you a woman.

Not so much anti-trans as pro-fact.

BertrandRussell · 04/06/2019 04:45

@BinkyBaa- just report any transphobic posts you spot-they’ll be gone in a flash.

DexyMidnight · 04/06/2019 05:18

Did you mean to ask why is AIBU so gender critical?

There's a lot of transphobia online: disgust, revulsion, threats of violence, threats of violence / sexual violence.

That's not generally what I see on MN, I largely see women who don't want to sacrifice women's needs and interests in order to support transmen and transwomen.

I want trans people to be respected, allowed a private sexual life the same as everyone else, I want them to be free from discrimination, I want them to be allowed to live their lives free from harm and in peace. I want them to be as visible or as private as they want to be.

I don't want a biological male to win the women's award at work and I don't want a biological male in my sleeper carriage or in the sauna at the gym

I don't think that makes me transphobic but if you do that's honestly fine with me.

Oblomov19 · 04/06/2019 06:03

Goady? Much? Hmm

Where are you seeing this Anti trans?

And yes you clearly don't know much about it. Have you tried? Reading up on it.

Makes me very sad. That it's all the 'rage'. And actually if your child is genuinely trans, it is also a very difficult journey. My heart goes out to them too.

Puzzled as to what MN threads you've been reading?

bellinisurge · 04/06/2019 06:04

Sorry to derail but WTF is a "Jewish government" @AgentJohnson . If you call the government of Israel a "Jewish Government " of course its anti Semitic. That's like saying the German Government is a "Christian Government " or the Saudi Government is a "Muslim Government ". Bloody hell. Going to report that.

Holdthedamndoor · 04/06/2019 06:15

If someone is being trans phobic, you should report it. That's really not on.

If you are talking about women disagreeing that simply wearing a dress, growing your hair long, wearing heels and make up makes you woman. Then that's not transphobic. Do you believe you are only a woman because of those things? Do you believe women who wear mens clothes are men? What if they have short hair and dont wear make up?

If you are talking about women disagreeing that males should be allowed access to spaces that are for females only, simply because they say they identify as a woman. That's not transphobic. That's being concerned about women.

Or are you talking about comments that disagree that your swx doesnt change just because you said it did. That's a biological fact. Gender is a social construct. Your sex is not and is not dictated simply by how you present yourself. Or do you disagree with scientific fact.

I have never seen anyone on MN care if a men want to wear dresses. The exception being the wives of these men whose lives have been changed forever once they discover this. But generally, mners dont care. They do care they men can say they are a woman and get transferred into a womens prison. Especially when these men are already convicted rapists. Then go on to attack female inmates.

Or are you just being goady?

I suggest you friends actually look into the issues around it.

ImFreeToDoWhatIWant · 04/06/2019 06:29

It's not anti trans. It's anti anti-women. I will not be erased. A trans woman is a trans woman. I am a woman. And while she is not less than me, she is different from me, and I am damn well not less than she is, either. I will not be erased.

NightmareDaemon · 04/06/2019 06:34

What have you seen that is anti-trans? Could you give examples? Have you researched gender critical feminism and examined what you consider anti-trans in that light?

SinjunRivers · 04/06/2019 06:36

@AgentJohnson
If you post shite like 'Jewish government ' yes you will be accused of being anti-semitic and thick.
Not all Jewish people are Israeli and not all Israelis are Jewish.

Supersimpkin · 04/06/2019 06:38

OP, making trouble won't help. If you cared about trans rights, why not highlight the staggering and horrible violence trans people face. That's anti trans for real.

Debate about self-ID is debate, not hate.

BeanBag7 · 04/06/2019 06:41

Because the minute someone mentions the word "trans"on here, lots of people launch into a tirade about womens rights, safe spaces and "man in a dress". It's very intimidating for people who are trans supporters to join in the debates because they'll be shouted down by the very vocal ones (this will probably happen to me now).

People say things online they would never say elsewhere because of the anonymity, which means extremes of opinion seem more common.

Holdthedamndoor · 04/06/2019 06:45

BeanBag7 I am afraid I disagree.

I also believe you claim of being intimated and saying you will be shouted down, is to stop people challenging you and close debate.

It's the internet. How are you intimidated into not sharing your opinion in a debate?

Though I dont really understand the term 'trans-supporter', either.

Iggly · 04/06/2019 06:48

I’m pro woman and pro biological woman especially.

Trans - women are not biological women and should be respected as such.

This sort of thing doesn’t come up in real life much so I can’t make the comparison to AIBU. But I would say it’s not the same - similar to a lot of things online.

WaitedForGodot · 04/06/2019 06:49

Because people who are hostile to both feminists and the trans community have played a very effective game of 'let's you and her fight'.

the two communities have far more common ground with one another than with their common enemies, and yet have been duped into spending all their energy arguing with one another rather than against the people who really oppose them