TTC friend ignores my DC

[Likepebblesonthebeach]

I am feeling very conflicted at the moment and would like some insight from people that have struggled to conceive.

BF has had almost 3 years of fertility issues. It has been very hard on her and I’ve been there for her as much as I can. I’ve arranged spa days, dinners, drinks, hotel breaks and surprise days out with her other friends to try to cheer her up and feel loved.

Last year I fell pregnant and now have a 6 month old DC that this friend completely ignores. If I mention DC in texts or send photos she doesn’t reply or ignores what I’ve said and responds to other parts. When I was pregnant I didn’t send scan pics or discuss it too much to try protect BF feelings. But now I feel like DC is a person and it really hurts that I can’t bring her up in conversation.

I’m a stay at home mam and carer so I don’t have much else outside my kids. Besides it hurting me it’s leaving me a bit lost on our friendship - we chat about BF TTC and her job but I can’t chat about my DC.

Last week I asked her to try to get to know DC but was shut down.

What can I do? This is a life long friendship that I shouldn’t want to lose but it’s such hard work always walking on egg shells.

CheeseIsEverything All of that is what one would expect someone to feel like and go through, but that’s all very different to ignoring the pregnancy and child of a dear friend, is it not?

I lost my mum really suddenly to cancer, I didn’t however... take that out on my friends or my husband and start ignoring the fact that they have living mums who they loved and spent time with

And yet, I would completely understand if you'd said you felt unable to discuss your friends mother's with them after going through this with your own. I'd be completely sympathetic to the fact you found it a trigger and wouldn't proceed to call you selfish despite not having been through your situation myself.

Give her some more time OP. I think time will help her get used to the fact you have had a baby and she hasn’t. Right now she’s in pain. She could grit her teeth and ask about about your child but it would be painful for her. Give her some more time to make peace with the situation.

Think of it not as being a doormat for a shot friend but as another gift your generous self is giving.

@LisaSimpsonsbff the op is talking about her best friend, not just acquaintances or general friends.

CheeseIsEverything All of that is what one would expect someone to feel like and go through, but that’s all very different to ignoring the pregnancy and child of a dear friend, is it not?

I'm saying this is how OPs friend is protecting herself and I completely get it because I did things people might think are petty/stupid/immature etc.. as well. Because that's what I needed to do to get by.

My closest female friend doesn't have children; she gave DS some nice presents and a cuddle when first born and came to his christening. She doesn't really ask after him, though I sometimes mention him as a part of my answer to a general 'how's things?'. I think that's fine, and quite normal - why would she want to spend hours talking about my child? What would she even say? Surely it would just be me talking and her nodding?

I don’t think those things are stupid at all, I just think it’s rude and selfish to ignore the news of our nearest and dearest when we are struggling with something ourselves. Were supposed to care, if we can’t bring ourselves to then we need to be honest,
Otherwise people get hurt, and that isn’t fair.

As a friend I’d be a lot more understanding if someone was honest with me- I’m sorry but I feel x/y/z and I’m really struggling, can you give me time? Instead of it being pushed to the side and being awkward like what op has written about.

As a friend I’d be a lot more understanding if someone was honest with me- I’m sorry but I feel x/y/z and I’m really struggling, can you give me time?

That is exactly what OP's friend has done. Have you not read the thread? OP has talked to the friend who said she is jealous and finding it hard.

"Why should we have to pretend our children don’t exist when someone is struggling to TTC?"

Why should someone struggling to have a child have to pretend it isn't anywhere near as painful as it is? Why should they be expected (rather than welcome) to put on the same brave face time and time and time again, so everyone except them can feel comfortable?

I can't think of any other scenario where it would be kind or good manners to rub someone's nose in it in such a way.

As far as OP's friend is concerned, the OP and everyone with a child has received the best gift in the world, every second of every minute of every hour of every day for the rest of their lives.

Were supposed to care, if we can’t bring ourselves to then we need to be honest,
Otherwise people get hurt, and that isn’t fair

But you're failing to understand that people can't always think so reasonably in these situations. It's easy for you and I to sit here and think rationally about what the friend could and should do because we're not her. We're not living what she is right now.

As a friend I’d be a lot more understanding if someone was honest with me- I’m sorry but I feel x/y/z and I’m really struggling, can you give me time?

She has been honest. She's told OP she doesn't want to talk about her DD because she feels jealous.

That's probably hard to admit. No one wants to admit they are jealous!

I don't think you can really 'get to know' a 6 month old baby. What you're effectively asking her to 'get to know' is your experience of being a mother - and that's precisely what she can't bear right now.

Neither of you are being unreasonable, in your own worlds, but if you want to maintain the friendship maybe you have to renegotiate things now life's changed - either all baby talk, including her TTC, is off the agenda, or it's all on. Or perhaps you just have to accept that this friendship will be on hiatus for a while?

Would it be acceptable for someone who has moved to a gorgeous 4 bedroom detached house meet with her friend showing her picture, talking decoration, asking her what colour she think she should paint the bathroom walls, when said friend has just been evicted from their rented property and they have no idea where they'll be residing in a couple of weeks time?

Yes they are entitled to be joyous of their new house and e pe t to be happy for them, but do they really need to discuss it with someone who are overwhelmed by not having a place of their own?

When I was pregnant with DC, I had a colleague at work who had been TTC for many years. It was affecting her very badly and she was suffering severely with stress. We did all try to be very sympathetic and kind to her but she was actually incredibly rude to me and another colleague who was pregnant at the same time as she just stopped speaking to both of us or acknowledging our presence at all! It was very awkward as it was a small-ish team and made it hard to get things done; and it wasn't a case of her avoiding when we were discussing our pregnancies, it was all the time. She even dropped a door on me when I was 6 months pregnant! I wonder if people in this difficult situation can struggle to remember what is acceptable behaviour as clearly in a professional context you have to deal with whoever you come across.
Personally I thought that individual wasn't fit to come into work if she couldn't cope with working with a pregnant colleague. If a friend isn't capable of offering you support in your life because of her own issues then it's probably worth stepping back for a time, not because YABU but because you aren't going to be much help to each other right now. But your friendship might be salvageable at a later date if your circumstances change.

I find this insistence some people have that if someone's your friend they should talk a lot about your child very strange. Most of my friends don't have children and we don't talk much about DS because what would they say? We also don't talk that much about work or houses - some of you need new, more interesting friendships!

Incidentally, I don't think any of my male friends without children have asked anything about DS (and the dads only manage the odd 'how's little one?'), and I think they'd be a bit nonplussed if I sent them unsolicited photos of him - does that mean they're all terrible friends who I should ditch? Or is it ok, because it's just women who are supposed to be invested in their friend's children?

My closest female friend doesn't have children; she gave DS some nice presents and a cuddle when first born and came to his christening. She doesn't really ask after him, though I sometimes mention him as a part of my answer to a general 'how's things?'. I think that's fine, and quite normal - why would she want to spend hours talking about my child? What would she even say? Surely it would just be me talking and her nodding?

I agree with LisaSimpsonsbff on all these points. It even extends to family. Neither of my sisters have children, by choice -- one is a very involved aunt, who adores my seven year old, makes time to see him, has particular games/stories/traditions with him, the other sees him maybe twice a year, and has never asked after him that I can remember. I don't resent her for it in the least, and our relationship is based on other things.

Children are not everyone's bag, and just because they're central to your world, that doesn't make them central to other people's, even friends and family -- they may be entirely uninterested in children, or only interested in their own, actual or potential.

@hippermiddleton Finally, some sense.

Chances are that OP's friend is doing everything she can bear, and she's stopped short of things that are just too painful to bear. Do you want to force an interaction on her that will mean she goes home and cries? If she's not able to cope, she's not able to cope.

No one is being a jerk, but it may be time to let the friendship cool until circumstances change. If the OP wants to be the bigger person and keep the friendship going on the current terms, that's generous but I understand why it would be too much, and why the OP doesn't want a friendship that feels like a one way street.

Incidentally, I'd have a lot more sympathy if the issue was a logistical one - if OP had no one else to look after the baby, or was breastfeeding so couldn't be away for long, and the friend was objecting to this. But that doesn't seem to be the case.

FannyWork is everything okay? Your comment makes no sense at all and jumps to ridiculous conclusions.

I haven’t been ‘pushing photos’ of my DD. I would have sent regular photos of DS to BF and when DD arrived I just assumed it was the same. It wasn’t, and I soon noticed BF was ignoring the photos - I haven’t sent her one since Christmas. BF sends photos of her dogs, what she’s eating, clothes - we exchange pics almost daily. DD is not included so it’s obvious to me.

For those saying that spa days and lunches are not helping - how can I help? I feel helpless seeing someone I love so sad and there is nothing that I can do. We talk endlessly about TTC and IVF - I am honestly interested and I know she needs someone to talk honestly to.

Her personality has changed dramatically in the last 2 years. I’m hoping that she will get pregnant soon and be happy but I am worried that it may not happen. IVF is the only option and it keeps failing.

I had a similar situation although my friend just made excuses to not meet up .. eg work suddenly busy. I knew what she was doing and felt for her but also at the time felt quite hurt - I really missed my friend. It was hard but I let her have the time she needed - she’s still one of my closest friends. Maybe you need to say that you understand how hard it is and if she wants some time not seeing you then you’re happy to give her that space. You’ll be there when she’s ready.

I think all you can do is what you are, OP - listen and be there. It's also fine for you to feel that this means the friendship is becoming too one-sided (it sounds like you have an awful lot going on, and you don't have to give and give if you feel that you're getting nothing back), but if that's the case then you need to step back, rather than expecting her to reciprocate by talking about your baby. She's made it clear that that's too hard for her at the moment.

She appears to be hurting very badly about her fertility issues. It sounds like you are doing all that you can to help her, but it may be that you are not the friend she needs right now. It isn't you, it's just that any mention or reminder of a baby is just too painful.

I am currently going through IVF. For the OP there are a couple of things to note here

1. The responses are clearly divided into no sympathy - never struggled to conceive - sympathy - understand what it’s like and have empathy for your friend

1. Your friend doesn’t exist in a vacuum. I talk away about kids to work colleagues/acquaintances/general people I meet and it is a struggle. The mental load is horrendous.

1. Going through fertility treatment means putting on a brave face and keeping it together 98% of the time - you shouldn’t have to do that with your friends. My friends don’t push their kids on me at all. If I am up to it I ask after them if not I don’t and they don’t push me or judge me or expect me to fawn over their kids.

1. I fully admit at times I’ve behaved badly and handled situations badly. I am trying my best.

1. Your friend is feeling how the people who have struggled are describing. You now have an insight into how she is feeling and can decide whether you want to continue the friendship or not. It’s totally your decision and I would say it’s quite common for friendship to be lost over something as hard as infertility. It’s all consuming for the person going through it. I am lucky that I have amazing friends and family who understand.

Its all very well posters saying "give her space", and "let her be"....but the reality is this friend may never conceive and OPs DD isnt going anywhere. There is no guarantee things will get better so when is the friendship over?

You're clearly a really supportive friend. It's generous of you to give so much while feeling such a wonderful and central element of your life isn't being recognised.

But maybe that's part of the problem? In an ideal world, you discussing TTC with her would give her hope that it can all work and a gorgeous baby is the result. Unfortunately, discussing IVF with someone who wants to show you the gorgeous baby you still don't have makes the unfairness feel even more unfair.

Infertility can make you a stranger to yourself. If your friendship can become your 'break from the house' friendship, as you described it upthread, where family talk is limited, then maybe it can survive this unhappy phase? I sympathise very much with your friend but also very much with you too - it isn't fair to have to pretend your DD doesn't exist.

OP the reality is, this friendship may fizzle out. She may not be handling this the best way but I empathise greatly with her despite not having been in that situation. It's not for anyone who has children to say what it must be like not being able to have one when that's what you want. I couldn't even imagine it personally.

It struck me from your posts that you could do with maybe establishing new friendships, getting into some different things, expanding your horizons a bit? Friendships change over time. It's always best not to be reliant on one or two people.

Just accept the way things are with your friend. If that means you need to see her a bit less, so be it.

YADNBU. I couldn't have children and there was no IVF back then. Whenever any of my family and friends had children I couldn't be more thrilled and excited for them and loved spending time with them.

Grieving for my own situation was definitely done at a different time and place and never impacted on those who had children.