Need advice and a handhold. My child called ' simple'.

[wildbhoysmama]

More of a WWYD. I'm really upset right now as my poor little boy is vulnerable and I can't bear for him to be bullied.

I've never, ever had words in my whole life with any neighbour but there's been heated words and I'm not sure what to do.

My DS is 7 and has ADHD and autistic traits ( as well as being severely epileptic, so he copes with a lot) but is a fun, funny, kind and positive little guy. He is emotionally and socially around age 5, but in mainstream and we've been told he's very sharp and performing excellently at school ( he loves school, it is a very caring environment for him.). Life is not always easy but we're a v close family ( 2 older DS and close wider family) and me and DH work hard to make sure he's understood and we have a v happy home life.

We live in a lovely neighbourhood with a mix of families and older people, most of whom have been here many years and whilst noone lives in each other's pockets we're all supportive and everyone is pleasant. All the kids play out, including our DS and he has some lovely, wee friends. Unfortunately one child is problematic: they moved in about 3 years ago ( their house backs onto ours) and whilst I don't know them we pass the time of day. Their DD is 10 and just horrible to our DS. She belittles him, manipulates him and, I think, uses him to make herself look good in front of others. She constantly calls in for him and despite being told politely he's not available she continues to call for him sometimes 2/3 times a day (it maybe to do with our trampoline/ climbing wall etc).

We had a horrendous summer last year trying to get DS to understand that they shouldn't speak as they just don't get on. He was the butt of her jokes and she manipulated the others to run away from him etc. It ended up she threw stones at him and smashed our car window the parents were apologetic and paid for the repair.

The last, few weeks with the weather being better she has started calling again. We say not to call again but she keeps doing so. Tonight things came to a head. Pur DS was on his swing and she was whispering insults to him through our high hedge. Our NDN heard it all as she called him 'simple'. Our DS then asked my DH what it meant.

I went round to her door (.never had to before) to Express my upset. Her mother said ' I'll have a word' but very casually as if it was no big deal. When I said it was quite a big deal she got very angry, saying that we had to keep our son away from her DD too. I pointed out that he is not the issue and with his ASN her dd needs to know that he's vulnerable. She exploded- walking up to my face and asking me to leave her garden.
I said it was very ' adult ' and left.

Her dd was adopted 4 years ago and I don't know whether this makes her mother very over-protective, but she must know how awful her dds behaviour is. Both my NDNs call the dd 'vile'- not nice for a child but I hate to say I agree.

I don't know what to do? I can't keep him from playing out. What do I do if this victimisation continues? Do I have grounds to have a chat with social services or is that just way OTT.

Sorry it's long, thanks for listening in advance.

Social care would, quite rightly, not engage with you over this.

A lot of adopted children have neurodevelopmental difficulties themselves, sometimes originating from the care they received as infants. It may be that this mother is struggling with her DD's behaviour in more ways than this and tonight tipped her over the edge.

Try to build some bridges so you can manage this situation together. It will make it a lot easier in the long run.

Do I have grounds to have a chat with social services or is that just way OTT.

What do you think SS will do ?

Her dd was adopted 4 years ago

Her mother is undoing years of damage being placed in foster care &/or the damage a previously abusive/dysfunctional home life ahs caused.

Her mother said ' I'll have a word' but very casually as if it was no big deal

Remaining clam is how people deal with things, having a screaming match on the doorstep really isn't in anyones interests.

I pointed out that he is not the issue and with his ASN her dd needs to know that he's vulnerable.

As is her daughter, sadly.

She exploded- walking up to my face and asking me to leave her garden. …… she's already told you calmly she will deal with and you keep on, your on her land, her property, her territory slagging off her child.

All you can do is tell the girl not to knock, to leave your property, and keep on reinforcing this.

You lad sounds really sweet - but if hes emotionally only the age of a 5yo should he be out with 10yo's ? It's a world of difference. Where are his older siblings? Are they in earshot when this is happening ?

Adopted children/those in care can be horrible. After all, the odds are that they've grown up in horrendous conditions/abuse/neglect/rejection and have been moved around a lot. She could well have been in a situation where those sort of things were said regularly - I've dealt with children who were absolutely awful to others more vulnerable and I think, 99% of the time it was purely because it was the first time they've not been the one receiving it/they had learned this was how you should behave to someone more vulnerable than you.

Of course, others were lovely. But most have been damaged in some way by their early years.

It's sad, but it sounds as though the best course of action for your DS is for you to always be within earshot if you want him to still play out - and be aware that not only is her Mum going to be naturally protective of her, she might not have been told all that happened to her - or experienced/seen the behaviour herself.

I think that he is vulnerable by playing out without supervision given his needs, sorry. The girl clearly has her own issues and I think it would have been quite easy for him to avoid her if you had stepped in to manage his play dates more. You are expecting him to be able to relate to much older children when he is as you say immature because of his SEN.

Look up attachment disorder. Can account for all the things her dd has been doing.

Thanks for replies. I certainly wasn't slagging off her dd- I was the calm one stating facts and asking her to try and keep her dd from coming to our door or throwing cruel insults at my ds. Surely she should have been apologising to me not facing up to me.

I am very aware of what a shitty start she may have had , ACEs are so in focus right now, so have tried to make allowances, but tonight she crossed a line calling him simple. I need to look out for my DS.

He's out playing with all different ages 5-10, he gets on particularly well with our NDNs dd who is also 10 and his wee friend who is 8. His older siblings are 14 and 12 so not really about all the time but are with him when we ask him to.

Ah, that’s so difficult as both the children are vulnerable. Are they at the same school? Maybe that could be a way to mediate a discussion. What do you say to the girl? Have you tried actually saying that she can’t play on the trampoline because she is mean to your DS, but that if she can be kind she would be welcome?

Thanks, I'm teacher so am aware of attachment disorder and it does make sense and I've always tried to keep that in mind, but tonight hit a nerve.

It will be very difficult to keep him in earshot as he's out on his bike/ playing like he should be able to do, but I will have his brothers/ NDN dd/ me or DH on watch more.

Thanks for all replies.

Hello. I feel for you. I understand how protective you feel of your son and I would have been cut to the core by the ‘simple’ comment too. Yes the other mother is protective of her daughter but that doesn’t meant you’re wrong to be protective of your son too. As I understand it he was in your own garden when the ‘simple’ comments occurred so it’s not that he’s ‘playing out’ unsupervised.

Of course I can also see that adopted children face significant challenges of their own. It’s likely that her birth situation was very very tough otherwise she wouldn’t have been in the care system at all.

Perhaps a calmer conversation with the mum at another time to acknowledge that there’s two vulnerable children at the heart of this?

But I think you will need to supervise your son more closely so this other girl doesn’t have the opportunity to be mean to him. No matter the source of her behaviour it’s not fair for your son to be exposed to it.

Agree with others that what you’ve described is not a matter doe social services.

Good luck.

It sounds like she may have been in case for a little while before adoption (given her age and the timeline you have mentioned), and you don't know her background. She might have had a difficult start and also be vulnerable.

I'm not sure what else you can do other than speak to her parents as you have. Stop answering the door when she calls for him, and if you see her in her garden while he is playing outside, could one of you out with him? Can you put anything up so she can't see through or over the fence?

Sorry your DS has had to be subjected to such unkind words.

Not at the same school ( she is at a religious school). I merely say he's not available when she calls. I've asked her mother to keep her away from now on as I just don't trust her not to manipulate him again as she has a tendency to whisper in his ear so I/ OH/ his brothers don't hear.

*in care

Must have been a bloody big stone to 'smash' a car window ..... misses the point

I think the natural response for you is to protect your son, but maybe the better way is to teach your son how to deal with hateful words. Teach him a word is only as powerful as he allows it to be. Unfortunately as parents we can fight their battles and protect them from the arses of the world but eventually they have to deal with them themselves and may not have learnt the tools to do so.
Teach him how to brush off comments like this- if he sees it upset you, he will learn to be upset himself. If you brush it off, he will do so too. Hope it helps

I’d just tell her to keep her daughter away from your door. I’d also just stop engaging with the daughter altogether, if she comes to the door ignore it or just close the door on her without engaging. She’ll hopefully find someone else to annoy next. I can’t imagine SS will be interested. The girl may well have her own issues but they’re her mum’s responsibility not yours.

She's 10? Over the age of criminal responsibility? Report her to the police via 101. Ask an officer to go round and have a word. Also worth letting them know the mum was abusive to you when you highlighted this. They are highly unlikely to arrest her, but a friendly word from a copper might nip the nastiness to your son in the bud. Likely the neighbours will not like you much, but you need to put your DS first and they need to sort out their Dad's bullying.

DD's even, ergh autocorrect

I really don't think the police would get involved in this. Police services are stretched and to them this will just be playground nastiness for parents and schools to handle.

The neighbour's DD, if adopted 4 years ago, is likely also very vulnerable and may also have a warped view of the world.

@ASauvignonADay

Not an excuse though. If she has been in care, might be worth contacting social services as she likely has a key worker contact there.

I find that police are happy to nip stuff in the bud with a quick chat. It requires very little paperwork and usually stops nasty situations escalating. Especially if the victim is a vulnerable child.

I think the natural response for you is to protect your son, but maybe the better way is to teach your son how to deal with hateful words. Teach him a word is only as powerful as he allows it to be. Unfortunately as parents we can fight their battles and protect them from the arses of the world but eventually they have to deal with them themselves and may not have learnt the tools to do so .Teach him how to brush off comments like this- if he sees it upset you, he will learn to be upset himself. If you brush it off, he will do so too.
I think this is really good advice.

I don't think social services or police are appropriate to involve for this.

Kids pick on each other and name call, it's called growing up. As much as I can see your upset, you need to teach your DC to adapt to life and what it brings. You cannot screen his friends, sometimes he needs to go through obstacles in life so he understands how to deal with it.

I would never fall out with neighbours over kids falling out. Let your son grow up and let him make his own friends. Everyone goes through personal stuff behind closed doors, just like the other girl being adopted.

I wasn'T excusing it but the OP was focusing on how vulnerable her DS is and how 'vile' the other girl was, just trying to keep it in perspective.

It would take ages and ages for police around here to even pick it up. Usually by the time they've made any contact things have blown over!

@Bibijayne oh behave, the Police have enough to do.

Sometimes there is not a solution. You appear to be in similar situations adopting similar stances. There isn’t really a right and wrong. You are both trying your best to do the right thing. The other person appears to be under more stress. Standing outside looking in what would you suggest.