I’m the worst mum ever and don’t know what to do

[Endofwitsend]

My kids are out of control and I can’t do anything about it. I’m at my wits end. I can’t make up my mind if we’re too soft or too strict.
They never follow instructions, can’t reason and don’t respond to removal of privileges or talking about things, family rules, sticker charts, routines. They totally rule the roost.
My partner and I never go out because I’m embarrassed to leave them with a babysitter because their behaviour is so bad. They play up every bedtime and short of locking their bedroom doors I don’t know what I can say or do to get them to go to bed. I get so exasperated sometimes, I cry. And sometimes I’m so tired from a day of having them I just ignore it and let them crack on.
They display behaviours that aren’t in any of the books so I don’t know how to deal with them, and I’ve read many many books!
I’ve had many outbursts at them, manhandled them especially when trying to get them in the car/ off something dangerous and I’m ashamed to admit it but smacked them on occasion. All to no avail.
They are 6/5/3
I wish they could go and live with parents that actually know how to provide stability for them and I feel like a shit mum every day. I can’t believe how disrespectful and badly behaved they are and I know it’s all our fault but can’t find a way to get them to stop.
Please ask me for more info if I’m drip feeding but I don’t want to write an essay (I could)
And please help

I also have 3 with small age gaps and I completely sympathize op. Our bedtimes are sometimes like this when I'm in charge, as they know they can run rings around me. It's not intentional but that's how it is. They can be a complete and utter nightmare.

DH on the other hand has a completely different way of dealing with them. He is incredibly strict and follows through on every threat he ever makes. They listen to him and know it's not worth playing up. I work some evenings so he has them on his own and he always says discipline falls to pieces when I'm there.

So, my advice is to develop super strict personas similar to my DH. Failing that, the things I've found that work/ help when I'm in charge are:

1. Lots of outdoor exercise for several hours during daytime. Park after school on sunny days
2. No screens at all Mon-Fri (they binge at weekends) except small amount for pre-schooler during day when he's on his own.
3. A cd player with lots of stories in my most difficult child's bedroom, which she switches on at bedtime
4. No sugar after 4pm
5. I allow the younger two dcs three stories which I read to them in our bed. They love this. Each time they piss about when they're getting ready I say "I'm counting to 5 then you lose one of your stories". I then count slowly and loudly. Sometimes they end up with no stories, sometimes just one or two, but it's a method that works because it's immediate. I've found threatening to remove something they're doing the following morning has no effect.

Good luck op

I second "how to talk so your kids will listen and listen so your kids will talk". We use that and this would go...
Child- Mummy can I have X?
Mum- No, we haven’t time/ you’ve had enough/ too messy etc
Child- Oh, that’s not fair I WANT X
Mum- Oh no! You REALLY want X but unfortunately you can't because - reason-. I wish I had a time machine so we could invent extra time! Ooh sparkly shiny thing!
Also, try to make them laugh, then they forget what they wanted.

You've had lots of good advice OP. Something to think about:

Secondary behaviour - it's when kids wear us down by ignoring your request and divert / distract you until you give in through exhaustion.
Like the toddler tantrum - they've learnt that if they fall screaming on the floor when Dad says 'no' to sweets in the supermarket, he may give in from embarrassment, exhaustion etc etc. They've learnt that making a fuss works. They need to learn that no matter how much fuss there is, you won't give in.
So - pick your battles carefully - but once you've said no, stick to it. Use broken record - keep repeating 'No more sweets today' and ignore all attempts to divert. Repeat and maybe divert their attention - come on let's go and ....." . But don't engage with their 'ah buts' 'it's not fair'

Be confident and be in charge - it's an 'act' that adults have to learn.
Well done for asking for help.

OP you’re doing a good job- they know you are out numbered & love watching you pop. Agree diet, exercise & expectations. They help you draw up bullet points around bedtime rules, maybe later bedtime, they can read to selves while you do 1-1 with older ones. When one disturbs others after lights out, quietly take by hand into another room, whisper ok you’re not tired, stand here quietly until you are tired & look at that wall while I do my work( reading book or MN with table lamp on only lighting room & where they can’t read over your shoulder) and ignore. They’ll manage about 5 mins standing quietly before they realise they are dog tired & give up. Be collaborative is key, if you can keep quiet for x to sleep you can have x tomorrow. Also on lead up to bed can you split them up in different rooms to change/ teeth etc to try & keep calmer

Also, I think rapid return is needed but it's gonna hurt. Will be sending big string mamma vibes tomorrow eve.

*strong

Also re ....can I have
Mum- yes tomorrow if x
DC - not fair want now
Mum- I said repeat above
DC - continues
Mum- guess you want a different answer as you keep asking- the different answer will have to be no you can’t have if you don’t feel yes tomorrow is ok

Re the mornings the no tv until you're ready is standard in my house. Morning goes like this - I wake the kids and chuck the school uniform on their beds. Breakfast is straight away. Then they must go straight up and brush their teeth, clean their faces and get dressed. Then they must put their shoes on and collect anything they want to put in their school bags as last minute is not allowed. When this is done they can watch tv while I get ready. They are absolutely not allowed back upstairs then 5 minutes before I want to leave I tell them coats on and by the door. I unlock the car and they get in while I sort myself out.

Hello op. I have three as well, 10, 8 and 6. And it is rediculous hard work. Mine are a bit older than yours now and I think jealousy is a big factor and I wouldn’t be surprised if your older ones were feeling that too. Jealous of your youngest for having extra mummy time at home while they are at school. As they see it, they have to behave at school while the youngest get to be free and at home. Your youngest does need help too with lots of things - as does mine at 5 that my middle child gets so annoyed at. My kids defo get more hypo when I’m trying to get stuff done and they are left to it. Structure is key. Advice I often forget to take!
But our bedtimes are ok. My advice would be they go for a wee, get their own ‘small’ drink before getting into bed. Mine have a small light on. Then they have no excuse. Sounds like you do this anyway but I’d try looking at youtube for some supernanny advice on how to handle the messing about part then. Or there was a channel 4 series I think it was called ‘bedtime live’. I don’t know if it’s out there to watch but it basically means take no shit. Be a robot. Put them back in bed go out the door. They get out, put them back in bed, out the door. Repeat as necessary and die of sleep deprivation and shattered nerves the first night but it does seem to work.
Good luck op. They wear you down they really do. And I agree with the other poster, take them out for time apart.
Siblings without rivalry lots of good points too. Xx
Or failing all that what about putting an audio tape on for half an hour in bed?

First of all, don't beat yourself up. You've had some good suggestions on here. I'd say these things are what might help.

1. Be consistent. If you say no to something once, then don't change your mind the next time. It might seem easier at the time, but it teaches them that it's worth playing up.

1. Pick your battles. Don't keep constantly nagging about everything. They will stop listening. Only be strict about things that really matter to you.

1. If you know, for instance, that if you say "Put your coat on" they make a fuss, don't say it, just take the coat and put it on them.

1. Separate bed times. One of you downstairs reading to the others, the other giving the one going to bed lots of loving individual attention. I used to think about behaviour I didn't like, such as fighting, and I'd say "Do you know, I was so pleased with you today, because yesterday you had four fights with your brother, but today you only had three. I think that's because you're more grown up now. I'm really, really pleased with you. In fact, I'm so pleased, I'm going to phone Grandad/Uncle/ Auntie and tell them how good you've been.

1. Children crave attention and will get it in negative ways if necessary, so if you see that something is going to happen, distraction and redirection may help.

I reckon you are putting them to bed too early - I would try and tire them out a bit more and put them down later & as others have suggested stagger it. I know it might sound a nightmare but it is taking 2 hours anyway. So perhaps try littlest one at 6.30 then the next one at 7 and the eldest at 7.30? Tbh if I was made to lie down when I wasn't tired I would be really bored. Could they be in their rooms but playing/reading? What about a story DVD?
Also try reward chart - sorry if you are already doing this. But when ours were younger we used to do marbles in a jar & they decided on rewards for 10/20/30 up to 100. Not big prizes - things like trip to pound shop/trip to museum and so on.
I'm sure there will be some better advice - but perhaps look over some episodes of Superanny?

I think you are doing an amazing job

Some great advice here

I am a new mum so my ideas not so useful
Wishing you the best

We used chocolate chips like dog treats. And only ONE chip was ever handed out at a time.

Lol @ this. I've come to the conclusion that there are a lot of similarities between training a dog and managing children's behaviour: reward the good and ignore the bad, be consistent, be calm but firm, make sure they get plenty of exercise, enough rest and aren't eating crap etc.

The only difficulty is that you can't shut the kids in a cage when you're at the end of your tether and nothing seems to work. Or put them in kennels when you need a break from them.

Ours are 6 (nearly 7), 4 and 2. We do staggered bedtimes, so DH gets the younger two ready for bed first as they're in separate rooms. Pyjamas, then teeth at the same time, then bedtime story for youngest while middle listens, then middle's bedtime story. We then wait about half an hour for those two to be asleep before starting on the eldest's routine. Usually this means all three in bed for 8pm.

DH does bedtimes here. On the nights when he's out things go more smoothly because I get them to bed earlier and because I'm the constant parent as a SAHM.

So I wonder if trying to get at least the younger two settled earlier would help? Can your eldest read? if so, what about leaving him/her with a book while you and your partner get a child into bed each?

I would always give a cuddle. Have to say my kids wouldn't care one jot if thier door was was taken off - I am surprised any young kid would.

Or put them in kennels when you need a break from them.

You misspelt kennel - "grandparents' house".

@Wearywithteens 're your ignore bad/praise good strategy. What if the bad, is the 3 yr old annoying the shit out of the almost 2 yr old? Puling him, pushing him, taking toys away, laying on him, etc? Younger one screaming, older one carries on regardless, or starts screaming because he can't get the toy or whatever. So much screaming.

For the pissing around in the morning I suggest that tv is put on after they are ready for school. If they piss around the whole time and you have to dress them 5 mins before they leave they don’t get to watch any. If they get ready quickly they can watch quite a bit - up to them.
I’d make sure they are well exercised and that they aren’t going up to bed too early. I’d also make sure screens were all off an hour before. I’d send them to bed with a drink of water each and instructions not to come downstairs or shout or bang unless it’s an emergency. If they do I’m afraid there would be harsh consequences for whichever children were messing about. What that will be will depend on what they are most bothered about but ipads removed, special activity removed, favourite toys or whatever. If they whine for them back I would just remind them that they can have them back the next day if they behave at bedtime. Don’t feel sorry for them as it is the choice they’ve chosen.
When they won’t accept a no I’d happily comfort with a cuddle and acknowledge that they’re disappointed. Some kids find it hard to move on from disappointment. I tend to advise my kids that they’ll probably be a lot happier if they try and think about something they can have instead of continuing to think about what they can’t which works most of the time.

My dp is taking them out for the whole day tomorrow so that I can do the last of the Xmas tidying, washing and so on. Hopefully they will be worn out by then and I will be ready to tackle bedtime with them.
I am going to put youngest to bed first whilst dp sits in kitchen with the other two. Hard stools in kitchen as opposed to movies on sofa; the idea behind that being if rr drags on they might even want to go to bed for comfort!) They may read books, pre chosen by them, maybe 3/4 each or draw on plain paper, limited.
I will commence RR with youngest
Once asleep I will bring older two up for a final wee, small drink. Lights off in rooms, door to lit hallway open and play a story cd on CD player placed in hall whilst I sit in hall in position one (thanks Jo Frost)
Eventualities-

1. They stay in bed- Get in
2. Eldest cries for bedroom light on and I have to keep going in and turning light back off and wrestling into cabin bed
3. I get Mummy, Mummy, Mummy- blandly say “We can talk in the morning, it’s bedtime”
4. One child tries to talk to me the other cries because they can’t hear the story- turn up volume?

I used to watch Joe frost when i was younger without kids for a bit of entertainment, judging the hell out of the parents and thinking, that will never be my kids. Now I’m nodding along and weeping because so many of them feel exactly how I do.

I may have missed this bit but what are they like at school? If they can manage there they usually don't have any special neeeds eg adhd and its a matter of finding the right tools to train them. I'm an older mum and a long time teacher and l would say absolutely no TV in the morning. If l had my way all screens would be banned in households before school. Just let them play if they are ready. Or everyone have a quiet story on the couch.
Its possibly the toughest years and things will improve.

Endodwhitsend 😂😂I have tears rolling down my cheeks at the seatbelt story.... on the way home I heard a click!! 😂😂😂

This sounds like it could be my children!!

Before children we were a perfectly normal couple... now I am frazzled, never have enough time of anything and we are always the loudest everywhere we go!!

First child was a nightmare it all began after conception and snowballed from there 😂trouble from day 1!!

Child 2 I believe have been a perfectly calm child if it wasn’t for the influence of child 1!!

Bed time is a nightmare and an average from me taking them up for bath is 2.5 hours... however it’s frequently later and I have been know to be sleeping before them face down in exhaustion!! 7pm -11pm is not an unusual occurrence in his house!! I feel Frustration at times as I feel I have no life in the evening!

My eldest has recently had a SENs or possible ADHD issue raised by the school although we are waiting on an official diagnosis but finally a lot things make sense. Particularly him not listening and not being able to carry out and instruction!

But it also makes sense with the Bed time routine as often he is hyperactive which leads the little one to follow on. Then before you know it they are running about screaming doing laps of the house! 🙄

For me I know it’s the bed routine I need to crack but for the moment I am going with what kind of works and mainly for noise reduction as the screaming is awful... I tried to make them both fall asleep on their own room while I sat at the door... but like you it didn’t work!!

Same thing screaming kicking walls... or one would be more sleepy and want to settle but the other would wake them with naughty behaviour!! So I have reverted back to what kind of works. Which is a staggered betime.

Like you mentioned if one knew the other was up longer there would be moaning and screaming so I give the eldest a little wink after bath and tell him it’s time to go to his room for bed .. he does this quite happily as he knows he can go into his room with his I pad while I settle the other one ( not the best idea I know, I hate doing it and I feel
others would judge me and see this as a failing) but it’s the one way he will stay in his room alone!!

He’s scared of his own shadow in to the bargain so he just spends the time letting me know how scared he is or shouting so it dosent work! I tried getting him to sit and read but he’s usually crying about how scared he is etc and just gets the other one all riled up.

Whoever mentioned Audio books is genius!! I am going to try this tomorrow!!! And wish me luck it could replace the IPad as we are a big house for story’s and reading but he just won’t do it alone in his room!

But I just wanted to let you know there is lots of is at our wits end!! 😂🙄