To think you can’t have it both ways regarding sex?

[GinDaddy]

(Before anyone starts with the obvious gag, I don’t mean sexual practices...)

A few friends of mine (M and F) were this weekend chatting about loss of sexual interest in a long term partner, and what causes this to happen.

It made me think of numerous convos and threads both on MN and elsewhere where people have said “I can’t stand the idea of sex anymore, I’d much rather watch a box set and have a biscuit” etc, or “Who wants all that huffing and puffing, I won’t let DH anyway near me” etc

Yet there are also plenty of threads and common discussions out there bemoaning and slating people (often men) for moving on from a long term relationship due to a lack of physical love or sex.

AIBU to think the two are connected?

Am I being unreasonable to wonder whether the people who prefer to have a biscuit, cuppa and soap, are also unrealistic to that their partner may want exactly the same? And therefore don’t really have the right to sound off in a blinkered fashion if the inevitable happens?

Relationship betrayal and cheating is wrong. 100%. However if someone basically says “I’m done with physical love, and I’m not going to ask you whether you feel the same”, AIBU to think this places some relationships into potential risk?

**Disclaimer:

1. This clearly does not apply to couples where one partner has suffered serious mental or physical illness. Or where both have tacitly or otherwise agreed to a non-physical relationship

2. I understand raising children can be a huge contributing factor to loss of desire for some, but that’s not for everyone

3. this is not my situation, so I’m not going to either add personal anecdote or take personal abuse

If your sexual desire has gone into steep decline, you have to talk about it and agree a solution between the two of you. It could be that there is a middle ground to relations, or some form of compromise (or not and everyone is happy with that)

A complete withdrawal is going to have a serious impact on any marriage, without the conversation and the decision and the solution, any marriage would suffer severely.

If not compromise can be comfortably found, then counselling is the next step, and if that fails then both parties have to decide how they feel long term and whether they wish to stay together.

The problem with withdrawing from sex is that it feels like a wholesale rejection to the other person, not just physically but emotionally too.

I have not seen threads on here where people say they can't do with the huffing and puffing etc. I have seen plenty - PLENTY of threads where women feel bad for not wanting sex, but they just don't. And threads by men who seem to think that access to their wife's body is a right they were granted when they married them.

It's pretty soul destroying to give up control of your own body because you don't want someone to leave you. That said, I'm sure it's pretty rubbish if you want sex and your partner doesn't.

I think if the partner who wants sex can cast off the idea that they are entitled to it and the partner who doesn't can agree to working towards wanting it (I dunno.. sex therapy or something) then maybe things will work out but I don't think this is a moral issue - I think it's something each couple has to work on individually.

If DP suddenly went off sex and declared that he no longer had any interest in it, I would leave him and I would expect him to do the same to me.

There is obviously a lot more to any relationship than just sex but sex is an incredibly important part of our relationship and it would devastate me to lose it especially for no real reason.

I sometimes do it when I don’t really fancy it because I love DP and want to ensure that we keep that physical intimacy and I also want him to be happy. I always find I get into it. So (Assuming no illness or abuse etc), I do think the person who’s not into it should at least try.

Yep, I've done the same thing because I know DH is in the mood and it'll make him happy. I still enjoy the intimacy, even if I'm abit knackered! If I really don't feel like it, though, he would never insist.

No-one everhasto have sex when they dont want it, and a partner trying to manipulate and coerce it is wrong.
Noone everhasto stay in a relationship where its fundamentally not making them happy and meeting their basic needs. "I'm not happy" is a valid reason for ending a relationship.
I agree.

Nobody has to have sex if they don't want it.
It would be wrong to change the terms of the relationship part way through unilaterally and expect the other person to say 'sure thing I'll lump it and go along'.

If someone announces they only want BDSM sex or want to get into swinging then that may be a deal breaker. Equally, someone wanting to take sex off the table has to be aware that may also be a deal breaker.

''slating people (often men) for moving on from a long term relationship due to a lack of physical love or sex.''

Hmm, i don't see much slating for ''moving on'' though.

How many threads do we see saying ''My husband has told me that he can't go on like this not having sex for years on end and he'd like to leave to be free to move on. AIBU to think he's being a cunt?'' Not many.

The slating threads occur when the husband is off having an affair OR is on here himself saying he's staying put but wants more sex. Now the later is a red rag to a bull on here.

Sex is a really important part of my relationship. I ended my marriage because we hadn’t had sex in six years and I was so unhappy. For both my DP and I now, sex is part of the deal - it’s the default, and it’s brilliant going through the day knowing you’re going to go home to a nice dinner, a glass of wine, and a big shag. It is perfectly ok to not want sex but if your partner does then their life can feel much harder, and they may leave. I would probably leave mine if he didn’t put out frequently and enthusiastically. If you don’t want to have sex, see your GP or a counsellor to explore why - very often there’s a simple explanation - and think about the benefits of sex - more relaxed, better mood, better sleep, bit of exercise, etc. etc. It might be easy to fix - if not then you need to decide on your next steps as a couple.

If you're interested in this sort of thing, google Ted Talk "The Secret to Desire in a Long Term Relationship" by Esther Perel. She also has a book, Mating in Captivity. So interesting.

I used to not want sex with my ex as it was boring and crap. The sex with my DP is incredible! It’s a shame if people end up with someone shit in bed and they never get to experience how amazing it can be

My husband’s friend was in a marriage where sex was infrequent and perfunctory, as the wife had “gone off” sex after her children were born.

He had an affair, and the sex was amazing. The OW was v keen, and athletic with it! So he left his wife for the OW, and after a few years married the OW, who was about 40 at the time.

Fast forward 10 years, and the new wife enters menopause. She goes off sex. Completely. Nothing. Nada. You can imagine how the husband felt. He was still very much up for it, and horrified at what had happened (twice). Maybe he was useless at sex, maybe he was just unlucky, I’ve no idea.

He is a veteran sportsman of some repute, and a few times a year travels abroad to tournaments. When he’s abroad, he has sex with “party girls” (pretty high class ones, I’m told, who hang about on the periphery of these tournaments). He doesn’t do it in the UK, as his wife would be horrified if she found out and he doesn’t want to hurt her. He says it’s always safe sex.

I honestly don’t blame him. Obviously he’s cheating, but I don’t think he’s hurting anyone (apart from depleting his bank account somewhat during his trips abroad).

Being angry, resentful and put upon are huge passion killers. So many men don't understand you can't be horrible and expect good sex.
Men seem to like sex when angry, v worrying

Ive never heard a man say he would rather have a cup of tea.

I think a lot of that is down to cultural expectations around masculinity. A lot of men would be ashamed to admit they just fancy a cup of tea.

In most of my friendships it's the women who find the man can't quite keep up. I think it's probably pretty common when you think women peek later in life and most relationships the man is older to start off with.

figlessfig The sort of man who repeatedly cheats on his partners, tells his friends about the new woman's sexual appetite then cheats on her, especially with women who he doesn't have to try very hard to please, is probably not th sort of man who spends much time worrying about his partner's sexual gratification.

You can't demand celibacy from another person, in the same way you can't force another person to consent to sex.

In terms of marriage, sex withdrawal is often the first marker the marriage is over. Whether or not either party likes it, they're not compatible as a couple and they deserve another chance.

Fair point, FriedTurtle.

I do agree. I think it's worth exploring WHY you've gone off sex. Sex is very integral to being an adult human being, look at Maslows Hierarchy of Needs.
It might be a valuable enquiry... Are you eating lots which numbs your sexual desires, are you frightened of intimacy, have you lost confidence in your body? Do you feel like you've assumed the mother role in your relationship which has affected the dynamics of your sexual relationship for the worse.
It's not right to neglect to continue personal growth/ enquiry and expect your partner to stay in a sexless relationship out of duty.
I think when the above questions are explored there a chance of getting your sex life back on track.

This clearly does not apply to couples where one partner has suffered serious mental or physical illness

This puzzles me because the sex-starved partner is still sex-starved, are you saying in this case the frustrated one shouldn't even mind? This sounds like there is a heirarchy of reasons to go off sex whereas I think consent can be withdrawn for any reason.

At what age is it acceptable to think that's it I would rather have a cup of tea? Sex with the same person no matter how inventive surely cannot be fireworks forever? When you throw in the twinges of pain or even a lot of pain, the dryness, the fact that he needs you to excite him before he can get it up when you would rather not bother, that you have had good sex for 30 years , mediocre sex for 5 or 6 years are you really all saying its time to walk away from the entire relationship if you don't want sex anymore? You can still love someone very much even if you can't be bothered with sex surely?

^^ @debfronut this is very fair and you put this so well. I completely agree that if after 30 years of amazing times together, our bodies start to change and all changes with it, then it would be grossly unfair (and callous!!) to leave someone on that basis!

I suppose I was musing about much shorter time frames, where I’ve heard and seen folk say “forget that for a laugh” and yet ignore the potential effect.

Thank you to everyone who has replied; I am learning a lot, and will check out that TED talk.

I suppose part of this as well is that I am projecting into the future, and wanting to be very self aware in understanding another partner’s viewpoint, desires, changing needs etc

Interesting thread. Did anyone read The Children Act? The couple had had 7 weeks since having sex and this seemed to predict the end of a 20 something long relationship! We're in a very very dry spell but am hopeful my libido can recover..

It really is difficult. It isn't uncommon for men to have a few ED episodes and lose interest in having sex while absolutely refusing to see anyone about it. Clearly ED strikes at the heart of a man's self concept, or can do. And yet there is little real understanding of the deep blows to a woman's self concept that seem to happen all the fucking time - lack of orgasm, lack even of pleasure, contraception, sexual harassment and/or assault, pregnancy, piles, childbirth, feeding, contraception again, medication, incontinence, childcare. It is amazing to me that sex is as good as it is for so many women and that so many couples' sex lives survive and triumph.

I totally concur. My the has avoided sex for years and I've discussed moving on. It's heart breaking but the connection and intimacy should be there and isn't. I want children too, he is not bothered in the slightest. I try to imagine if it was the other way round. I genuinely think I'd try to get close, even if I was too exhausted to care.......

Dh not the!

To walk away from an otherwise happy marriage and to possibly destroy your own child's childhood (for some children, their parents splitting up is massive and affects them long term), because you aren't getting the quantity of sex you want, seems pretty pathetic.

Oh goodness, that was badly timed. I wasn't responding to you @Icantbelieveitsnotnutter
I didn't mean years, I was more talking about when one party wants sex weekly and the other monthly.