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Original poster

Remainer 'moral superiority'

856 replies

coffeeaddict · 17/07/2018 07:26

I voted Remain but I dithered and I can see both sides of the argument. (Am I the only one?! Everyone else seems to be so polarised.)

What gets me, especially when I've read discussions on here, is all the very vociferous Remainers who talk as though they have a claim to the moral high ground.

I find the accusation that Brexiteers are 'racist' particularly weird. Europe is mostly white like us. How does race play a card? If anything, letting our borders open to all and every European (majority white) means necessarily less room for other people from different countries and therefore different races.

In fact, what is the EU? A band of rich, predominantly white countries banding together to be more powerful. Fine, this might be best for our trade and prosperity. It might be pragmatic. We might like feeling we could go and live in Spain one day. But that's not the same as being morally 'better'.

But a lot of Remainers behave as though they are inherently 'virtuous' and Brexit is inherently 'evil.'

I don't get it.

OP posts:
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Original poster
coffeeaddict · 17/07/2018 08:25

Really interesting responses. Everyone has such different angles.

Reading them, I realise I'm uncomfortable not just with the 'moral high ground' aspect but the 'we're more educated' stance as JustanotherLurker says.

OP posts:
Hoppinggreen · 17/07/2018 08:27

I am a strong remainer and the reason I hold most people who voted leave in such contempt is that none of them I have discussed it with can give me fact based genuine answers for why they voted that way
IF they could rather than quote made up figures on buses or keeping out Muslims then maybe I could respect their point of view.
Also, I look at the mess we are in now and how we are becoming an international laughing stock I start to feel genuine hate for some of them

LittleLionMansMummy · 17/07/2018 08:28

It's hard not to feel morally superior when you read some of the rabid comments on social media sites like leave.eu. Have you actually read them? If you lie down with dogs and all that.

Personally, I'm fed up with being told I'm a traitorous Britain-hater. I'm a patriot, like many Remainers. I just think that not much good comes from rampant nationalism, as history testifies. And like it or not, that's what the Leave campaign centred on (remember those lovely posters of Farage standing in front of migrants and refugees?) Leave has perpetually referred to 'invasion' and 'swarms' etc in an attempt to dehumanize. Honestly, of course I know that not everyone voted Leave because they're racist, any more than all Remainers voted to protect their privileged offspring's gap year. But there is no denying that underlying tone of Leave was one of barely contained racism and xenophobia. It's hard not to feel superior tbh.

bellinisurge · 17/07/2018 08:29

I know a couple of "educated people " who voted Leave. It's all about what can seduce you. Even smart alecs get seduced.

Iamtryingtobenicehere · 17/07/2018 08:33

I have never admired this anywhere, ever, but....... i didn’t vote I didn’t really understand the pros and cons of either. I knew it was a big deal and in all honesty I don’t think I understood enough to make that decision.

Worse still.....if there was another leave or remain vote today, I still don’t think I know what we (as a country) should really do for the best.

Pause3FuhFuh · 17/07/2018 08:33

Vote Leave fully expected to lose and David Cameron was overconfident that we would stay, so them when Nigel Farage and his clan of racists did win they didn't know their arse from their elbow and now 2 years later we're no closer to achieving what was promised. I would absolutely love another vote, but I respect democracy too much to start hoping for one.

YellowStripeyChair · 17/07/2018 08:34

The bile and vitriol levelled at leave voters on MN has been utterly disgusting. I think a lot of remainers are going to wake up one day, look back at their words and feel utterly ashamed of themselves..and worse than that they will see that they, in their rage, have embodied the very qualities they have been so vociferously apoplectic about.

Summersup · 17/07/2018 08:37

Interesting thinking.

Just to say though, saying everyone in Europe is 'white' and so immigration for racist grounds doesn't exist is palpably false- people have always claimed one can distinguish ethnic minority groups such as Jewish people and Roma (who are originally from Northern India I think) and killed them and persecuted them in their millions. It's a little naive to imagine white people can't discriminate against other white groups on a 'racial' (often cultural as well) basis. In Eastern Europe discrimination against Roma people is endemic and really blatant.

bellinisurge · 17/07/2018 08:37

I think it's Leave voters that will wake up one morning and ask "what have I done?".

Pause3FuhFuh · 17/07/2018 08:39

I won't ever regret anything I've said about leave voters.

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 17/07/2018 08:40

Personally, I'm fed up with being told I'm a traitorous Britain-hater

Oh god yeah, this was on loads of threads

ShatnersWig · 17/07/2018 08:40

The bile and vitriol levelled at leave voters on MN has been utterly disgusting

Why do you think that is? Although I have to say I haven't seen much that I would classify as strongly as that. I remember when it was very fresh a lot of people were very upset because they themselves were left in limbo as they weren't a British citizen but had been living here for some years and didn't know what would happen for them. I remember some who said this would absolutely destroy their own business or whose company would now look to relocate and entail people uprooting their whole lives to go when they don't really want to. I can't blame them if they were very upset and spouted forth at people who, in effect, did that to them.

ObjectionSir · 17/07/2018 08:41

"White" isn't a race, a white person can be racist against another white person. Most racists I've come across seem to have an issue with the Polish.

GhostofFrankGrimes · 17/07/2018 08:42

The bile and vitriol levelled at leave voters on MN has been utterly disgusting

This seems to be the defence mechanism of leavers on MN. To claim victimisation. I've been on the EU referendum board for over 2 years and all I've seen is remainers asking leavers to articulate their views beyond soundbites. When this hasn't happened it has led to frustration not bile or vitriol.

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 17/07/2018 08:42

Oh god and all the bollocks about the elites

Anyone who voted remain apparently was one of them

Still, loads of people talked shit whether they voted remain or leave

placemats · 17/07/2018 08:43

I think Anna Soubry sums it up for me. I honestly believe that those who voted to leave thought the consequences would be so catastrophic for their livelihoods. They certainly don't have gold plated pensions and inherited wealth and they certainly lack intelligence.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-44853389/tory-mp-anna-soubry-attacks-wealthy-brexiteers

placemats · 17/07/2018 08:44

that should be: never thought

maxthemartian · 17/07/2018 08:45

Leave voters are sharing a bed with the likes of Farage, Trump, Johnson and Rees Mogg.
Forgive me if I think that the Remain claim of moral superiority is not entirely unjustified.

drearydeardre · 17/07/2018 08:46

I just knew this thread - which was opened by the OP with a genuine opinion would go the way of all the other threads on this subject that 17.4 million voters were uninformed. racist, old, ignorant, stupid - take your pick of the insult. Oh - and they know people who voted leave who are racist so QED all leave voters are racist Angry
sometimes mumsnet depresses me greatly
the thing is remain voters were not voting for the status quo they were voting for the EU and its future trajectory for ever - until the individual countries came to their senses (which is already happening in some other European countries )

Theimpossiblegirl · 17/07/2018 08:46

It's not actually nice to be proven right, especially in this context, but let's be honest, Brexit is hardly the success it was made out to be, is it? I'm not sure we've gained anything, the NHS certainly hasn't, businesses are struggling/going bust, food prices are rising and we could be stuck with Trump as our only real trade ally.

So yes, to partly compensate for the huge hit to the economy and the debacle that seems to reflect upon us all, I allow myself to feel a little morally superior glad it wasn't my doing.

placemats · 17/07/2018 08:46

Arrgh need more coffee.

It's those gold plated pensions and inherited wealth politicians who lack intelligence.

Bluelady · 17/07/2018 08:47

Believeitornot has voiced my thoughts better than I ever could. I would add that I really believe many Leave votes were cast to give the Cameron government a bloody nose without any expectation of being on the winning side.

Another referendum? It's no longer being dismissed out of hand and, the greater the chaos and turmoil get, the more likely I think it becomes. The fact is that politicians pontificate about giving people what they voted for but nobody actually knows what that is because all they voted for was leaving. The whole exercise is a farce.

LittleLionMansMummy · 17/07/2018 08:47

The bile and vitriol levelled at leave voters on MN has been utterly disgusting. I think a lot of remainers are going to wake up one day, look back at their words and feel utterly ashamed of themselves.

And yet it's apparently Remainers who think themselves morally superior! I've seen plenty of bile and vitriol on both sides.

Pause3FuhFuh · 17/07/2018 08:47

Prior to the vote I had asked many Leavers for their reasoning and nobody could explain it. It was all about immigration and very clear they didn't understand the wider implications, or anything about politics. They get very defensive because they know they don't know what they're talking about.

WindDoesNotBreakTheBendyTree · 17/07/2018 08:52

I don't feel any moral superiority over the general person in the street leave voter.

I reserve my contempt for those in politics who decided to engineer the whole scenario for personal short-term political ambition, knowing that with their wealth and power the outcome would make fuck all different to them either way.

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