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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

60+ year old man asking to share bed with 4 year old?

225 replies

adviceseeker5002 · 31/12/2017 05:40

NC for this

Would you feel it is very odd that a 60+ year old man (my step-dad, non-biological relative to my DD) openly asks a 4 year old child (my DD) to share a bed with them?

I left DD with DM and step-dad a couple of weeks ago for a few hours in the evening and returned to be told by DM that she had 'gone to bed' with him. I was shocked and it would not have been agreed to had I been there. I knew he had drunk several pints and just found it very odd.

Yesterday went to their house again after a family get-together, no intention to stay over. Step-dad announced he was going to bed, DD was watching a cartoon film and colouring and he openly in front of me and everyone asked her 'do you want to come up and sleep with me'. I was kind of Shock and glad she said 'no' but..?

It made my skin crawl, is it just me?

OP posts:
lastnamefirstfirstnamelast · 02/01/2018 12:39

good luck OP xx

Aeroflotgirl · 02/01/2018 12:40

Really calling the Police is over the top as no crime has been committed, if he has touched her inappropriately or abused her, that is a different matter. Most definitely call NSPCC and get some advice. Never leave her alone with them again. Think of an answer if he asks her to go to bed with him again. Like "no we don't do that" Teach your dd the no pants rule from NSPCC.

Footle · 02/01/2018 12:45

Aeroflotgirl, OP has no way of knowing whether 'anything happened', apart from asking the child, which would be a really bad idea.

Trinity66 · 02/01/2018 12:47

I think you have to trust your instincts around stuff like this, I would definitely make sure not to leave your daughter in their care again

ILookedintheWater · 02/01/2018 12:53

Actually contacting the police and requesting a disclosure might put your mind at rest...this is very odd behaviour.
www.parentsprotect.co.uk/police_disclosure_scheme.htm

adviceseeker5002 · 02/01/2018 13:25

Have spoken with NSPCC and will post what they said in case it is of help to anyone else:

They don't think what I describe has crossed the threshold for any intervention by children's services etc

But they would say it's probably best not to leave DD at DM/SD house again (they said that a few times).

In terms of sleeping in the bed - they said it is not appropriate, SD should not have allowed that to happen, even if it was done without thought and nothing untoward happened.

And adding the fact SD had been drinking - it definitely crossed a boundary of what I as DD's mum had already put in place (as had been very clear previously about her not being looked after by people who had been drinking).

They would recommend light questioning of DD, and possibly DM, about who suggested DD be in their bed, how that came about, and who put DD in pyjamas.

And they suggested the pants campaign, and that I talk about how even though we co sleep, DD should not be sharing a bed with other big people.

OP posts:
Aeroflotgirl · 02/01/2018 13:29

That's fantastic op, they sounded very supportive, now due to having professional advice, you can be more firm towards your DM and SD. It provided support to your feelings towards it.

NormansNipple · 02/01/2018 14:14

I haven't read the whole thread as it's triggering for me. I just want to warn you that some women will go to extraordinary lengths to excuse or ignore their partners behaviour. As bad it sounds please be wary of anything your DM promises. I'm glad your DD has a strong mum to tackle this for her and keep her safe.

TheweewitchRoz · 02/01/2018 18:42

Well done Op!

JohnHunter · 02/01/2018 18:58

The NSPCC advice sounds very sensible and measured.

Mxyzptlk · 02/01/2018 20:18

It's upsetting to think that you can't trust your DM to keep her granddaughter safe, but the fact is that you can't.
I'm glad you've had support from NSPCC.

LoveProsecco · 02/01/2018 21:26

Well done OP. Do you feel better for professional advice?

Findingpeace · 02/01/2018 22:53

I’m glad the NSPCC was able to offer some good support and sensible advice.

Can I also suggest you could ring the police under ‘Sarah’s Law’ which is the child sex offender disclosure scheme in England and Wales and allows anyone to formally ask the police if someone with access to a child has a record for child sexual offences.

Mummyoflittledragon · 03/01/2018 05:21

That sounds like brilliant advice. Thanks for sharing.

My 9 yo dd shares with my mother when she comes. I know she would never do anything sexual or innappropriate having been raised by her. Idk how I would have felt had dd wanted to co sleep it with my stepdad. He was a very caring and loving man, who definitely didn’t have any inappropriate behaviour with dd.

Having been forcibly snogged by my grandmothers 80+ yo boyfriend when she was out one day when I was staying with her, perhaps it is possible you actually can never tell ... I was 16 and shouting very loudly to fuck off as he backed down the stairs of the first floor flat. At the same time he was telling me it should be “our little secret”. Shock. People actually say that to children. Angry. Was he a paedophile, who had abused children? Idk. My mother didn’t call the police. Now I think she should have done. She called him and told him to leave me alone. He feigned ignorance.

Mummyoflittledragon · 03/01/2018 05:23

I then had to pretend all was fine when my grandmother came home. I know a lot worse has happened to many people. It has left an impact on me of not trusting older males. It took me a long time to trust my stepdad, who my mother met when I was 18.

Skittlesss · 03/01/2018 07:58

I'm glad you called but I also think you should be calling your local police - ask for the safeguarding/child protection unit. They will look him up on the systems and make a disclosure to you (Sarah's Law) if they need to.

I know that the NSPCC have said it doesn't require interventions, but I am inclined to think that you do need to speak with the Police just so they can check him out.

I work for the Police and a lot of the child abuse cases do come from something "not quite right" being brought to our attention.

Please don't think I am saying something has happened. Just ask them to look him up.

Cantuccit · 03/01/2018 08:06

@Mummyoflittledragon

What a horrible man Angry

Did you not want to tell your grandma? Did he remain her boyfriend?

hibbledibble · 03/01/2018 08:56

Is the concern here because the adult is unrelated and male?

My mother will take my dd aged 2 for naps with her, as she won't settle in her own in an unfamiliar place. I have never had reason to be concerned about this.

TheSkyAtNight · 03/01/2018 09:16

So glad you are protecting dd. This chilled me when I read it.

In our safeguarding training we were told abusers groom the adults around them first. This is why adults don't believe victims/ ignore really weird behaviour from the abuser - they just can't believe it is happening. As teachers we were told we would be the first to be groomed by any abuser on our staff.

The sd's behaviour sounds like what we were told is a classic grooming pattern of attempting to normalise really odd stuff. Whether people cosleep or not isn't at issue - it's the odd hour, the invitation to dd, the lack of reaction of others...

TheMaddHugger · 03/01/2018 09:30

OP "There is another man I actually had to stop spanking her on the bum, as 'play'. DD was clearly trying to move away from him, clinging to me - I found it astonishing I had to tell a grown man to stop it, and really doubt he would adopt the same behaviour towards a boy of the same age (then 3.5)."
"maddhugger the spanker was a neighbour we were quite friendly with, a childless couple, around age 50. The wife was there and said nothing"

How did he respond to you stopping him ? Did he give a reason?
You said you didnt think he would do the same to a boy
TheMaddHugger · 03/01/2018 09:36

@Mummyoflittledragon

I feel for you 😿💐

Mummyoflittledragon · 03/01/2018 12:48

Canticutt
He was allegedly comforting me as my dad had died a few months before. My mother didn’t comfort me once and I cannot remember anyone else comforting me.

Now I come to think of it, he initiated the conversation about my father to make me vulnerable. Fucker. Then when I was beside myself crying, he came and leaned over me closer and closer repeating “you’re lovely now, ain’t ya”. For several minutes.

I didn’t know what to do, felt uncomfortable but didn’t want to appear rude. I finally, after 5 mins, maybe more, stood up to get away. He did a bear hug, wrapping around my arms so I couldn’t get away and pulled me in for a kiss, I turned a cheek, he did it again and I turned another and the last time, contact was met. I grappled to get away and started screaming at him.

Yes, he was really horrible. And now I’m bloody sure he’d done it before.

My mother made it perfectly clear I wasn’t allowed to tell my grandmother. He remained her bf until she moved in with my mother temporarily maybe 7years later then went in a home. I was relieved when he died a couple of years or so later.

My grandmother was infinitely more important to my mother than me. As is my brother. My feelings were sacrificed. It’s just a very good job I wasn’t younger and he didn’t go further. By 16, girls hopefully don’t put up with that shit from an elderly man. I can imagine my mother’s reaction would have been the same had I been younger.

Mad
Thanks. As I say it was horrible at the time. And women have had a lot worse so it’s not a big thing for me. However, it left me with is issues of trust. I tested my stepdad in ways I wouldn’t have done had my mother protected me better.

I went on holiday with him and my mother when I was 19. I sunbathed topless - this was in an era where it was more normalised. My reaction now is what was I thinking stripping off?

Anyway, I went from the bedroom to the bathroom in just my knickers a few times. It’s an unpleasant thing to do, I know. But I needed to do the tests and evoke a reaction to know if I was safe around him. And far more importantly I wanted to know what my mother’s reaction was if he tried something.

I know the answer now as this was also coming off the back of abuse from my brother - not touching but sexualised abuse.

Sorry that was a bit long. Hopefully there’s some learning in here of how not to handle the situation.

Cantuccit · 03/01/2018 13:27

Mummy I'm so sorry you had to go through that. Targeting a 16yo and using the death of her father as an excuse to broach your boundaries is so evil.

Your mum has a lot to answer for.

And your brother appears to have taken the advantage of your dad not being around to protect you. I hope if he has children that they are safe. I've read some of your other posts about them and I think you're NC with him. Absolutely the right thing to do.

Mummyoflittledragon · 03/01/2018 14:16

Thanks. My father was never around much anyway, working all week including many weekends. The sexualised stuff with my brother went on from when I was maybe 12. Just dealing with it now really. I am NC. His son is safe in that context.

carbuncleonapigsposterior · 03/01/2018 14:50

I think the NSPCC's advice is sound, rushing off to the police, as some have suggested, is possibly a knee jerk over reaction. However, SD's behaviour is extremely inappropriate and I think you have to find a diplomatic way of expressing that to him, you could imply that this behaviour could easily be misconstrued should your daugher relate these experiences to a third party, which could trigger repurcussions he may not have anticipated. As you say, you don't want to normalise something which at best is certainly questionable for your little girl's sake. I have a young granddaughter who sometimes stays overnight, and will wander into our room early morning, my husband, her biological grandfather will give her a hug and a kiss, but would not encourage her to climb into bed with us.

You sound a very good mum adviceseeker but you are right to feel uncomfortable about the situation. Good luck hope you sort things out

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