To tell my child that Father Christmas is not real?

[Purplelipgloss]

I have a newborn baby so I'm thinking ahead here and it is a conversation that DH and I have briefly touched upon in the past.

He thinks that we should tell DS because it's wrong to lie and parents should certainly not lie to their children - could cause trust issues etc.

I however, am a bit more of the opinion that we should play the Santas real game, he'll get over it. I think that the enjoyment in the belief you have as a child by far outweighs being honest here.

Just wondered what everyone else thought and if there were any stories that would help us make a final decision.

Namechange16, exactly right.

@Namechange16 I felt similar, but I was not an anxious child. It's not anxiety to be shy and not like strangers, why would I want a strange old man coming into my house at night? It really freaked me out and I would find it hard to go to sleep because I was so anxious about this stranger in my room while I was sleeping.

To some children it is not magical and exciting, it's scary and confusing but I do accept I'm in the minority. I don't think my mum has ever realised that I actually hated Father Christmas, just assumed I was being very shy.

got friends who don't 'lie' to their kids for similar reasoning as your DP and they told the kids no Santa. Have to say they're kids are the most cynical sarcastic kids I have ever meet and t's not pleasant in little ones. They have HUGE trust issues because they're not being 'lied' to about the real world they've missed out on any protection that parents are supposed to give young children IMHO, and know what a horrible place the world can be, they assume the worst of everything. They 'know' things without understanding them. Theres' genuinely no magic or imagination in their world and I do feel sorry for them though I'm sure they'll be very successful one day, maybe politics...

I want her to be a part of the importance of giving and receiving presents to/from those you care about. Which she actually finds quite magical

That fits perfectly with also doing Santa.

Which is just another example of why you don’t need to go to great lengths to convince your child of something fictional to have a magical Christmas
What great lengths? It's just out there, they pick it up, you don't have to do a thing.

It’s not a lie though is it?......It’s not a fucking truth, is it?!

But there is so much in the middle!

I think the hardcore "I won't lie to my child I'll tell them from the start its not real" are imagining that the rest if us are telling constant stories and forcing some huge conspiracy. And maybe a few are, but many are like me, they go along with it as far as the children themselves lead, because they want to and they love it. When they ask, we tell.
It's not about telling them lies, its about supporting their own imaginations and their sharing in a cultural, traditional myth.

Aim for some nuance.

For the record I’ve never told DD that santa doesn’t exist. So it’s not a binary choice. We’ve not said it’s true or not, and let her lead on whether it was something she found fun to do (mainly through the obsessive pushing of it by the rest of society). She’s never gone for it.

About to have our 8th Xmas with her showing absolutely no interest. So I don’t think they do “pick it up”. It’s not toddlers taking themselves to sit on Santa’s knee, and I doubt they learn the phrase “he’s been” by osmosis either. It’s parents that set up the belief - in exactly the same way as they would a religious one - and peddle it as truth knowing full well that they are creating an illusion.

If I’d told DD from birth that a magical fairy came into her room every morning to make her bed, and she sees her bed made without having seen it happen, she’s going to believe it. So parents that push the myth seem to be the ones in denial.

Similarly, if on Xmas eve she wants to leave out carrots and mince pies and pretend her few gifts came from santa, that’s fine too. Not labelling gifts gives her the choice.

It’s not about taking credit.

😂

OH and I discussed this. He told me how he was really really angry when he found out Father Christmas wasn’t real - he actually still sounded angry about it as an adult. Very strange. He said (like your H) that it was because the people who he trusted most in the world who had told him not to lie, had lied.

He seemed to feel strongly enough that I gave him the choice of what we did with our DC, but did say I thought his reaction was unusual. He decided we would do the whole Father Christmas thing, so I don’t think it’s scarred him that much.

I agree with you, op. My parents never allowed me to believe in Santa or Father Christmas. I wish I could have had that magical time as a child. Children come to understand and I think are happy to have had that mysterious and joyful experience that symbolizes the real mysteries and joys of life. That’s why so many grow up and give their own children that experience. When my son was ready and asked questions I told him about Saint Nicholas and how Santa is an image of him and explained more in depth the meaning of Christmas and how we can be a Santa to others. I knew a woman who said she didn’t appreciate her parents doing Santa because it was a lie and she just couldn’t countenance that. Well, she was the biggest liar I’d ever met so the irony blew my mind. You and your dh can hopefully come to a compromise. Saint Nicholas was a real person so perhaps you could both agree to work out something.

My parents had me completely convinced of santa's existence. And I love them for that.

I still remember the sense of wonder it evoked in me as a small child that there was a force out there so generous and so ingenious to travel the world in one night dispensing gifts. I can't think of anything that directly compared to that feeling.

At 8/9 I was ready to move on and at that point I was charmed by how much effort my parents put in over the years.

Each to his own, tell your children what you like, but I want to recreate that feeling for my own kids.

1. Santa is a way for children to enjoy gifts without feeling obligation. We didn't have much money when I was young; by the time I was old enough to know Santa didn't exist and presents made me feel bad. I dreaded Xmas. But it was lovely to see my younger siblings happy and able to enjoy their gifts without worrying about whether my mum could afford it.

1. Santa is a role model. He gives selflessly and he gives to everyone (as far as the myth is concerned).

1. Santa is a metaphor anyway so it's not a lie.

I think it's sad that some children miss out on Santa. He left me a note one year and it was one of the most exciting things that ever happened to me. Yes, it was a bit sad to realise he wasn't real, but by that age I was old enough to understand why the myth was a positive thing. I don't know anyone with trust issues as a result of Santa - I think that's a bit melodramatic.

it’s not a binary choice

^this

You don’t have to get hung up on whether you get them to believe or tell them it’s all a lie.

Honestly, the whole thing seems far to overthought on this thread. Maybe therein lies your answer OP - just see how it goes, don’t do either!

I am sure your DS will figure it out him self very soon about father christmas and you will not need to tell him anything. Children are more intelligent than we actually imagine!! So let him enjoy the spirit of christmas while he cannot understand it.Thats my opinion though.

I was one of those children who felt awful when I realized the truth. I felt stupid and ignorant and forever wondered what else my parents had lied about. As I got older I could see that they had just approached things the way most people do - and yes, most children probably don't mind, but I definitely did.
We chose the 'don't spin a lie, but don't actively deny' route with our DC which has worked well for our family.
And as for the poster who wonders whether you would tell a 4 year old about sperm and vaginas, well obviously yes (that's an easy one).

If you’re going down that route then don’t read any fairy stories, watch Disney films or play let’s pretend or dress up as a princess type of games as none of that is real and by your definition not real equals a lie.

Robbing a child of the magic that is believing in Father Christmas is wicked!

So your DH wants to a) remove a fundamental part of your DCs childhood and lose potentially joyful memories of being younger and b) risk that your DC will tell other children and thus ruin their christmases?

Here, OPs DH, have a

Whenever my kids have asked, whether it’s Santa, dragons or the fairies in the hornbeam tree, the gods, I tell them that as long as it doesn’t hurt anyone else they can can believe in whatever they want.

If you’re going down that route then don’t read any fairy stories, watch Disney films or play let’s pretend or dress up as a princess type of games as none of that is real and by your definition not real equals a lie.

What bollocks. Can’t you see the difference in telling and enjoying stories and physically creating a fictitious event every year? Or should i have a bear costume handy to pretend to be Merida’s mother every time we watch Brave?

Robbing a child of the magic that is believing in Father Christmas is wicked!

True story. I spent part of yesterday with 120ish infants practicing their Xmas show. One little boy - age 6 and young in the year, very shy and anxious normally - wasn’t dressed up. I asked him if he had forgotten his costume or needed help to find it. He said no, he wasn’t allowed to be in the show. I was puzzled as he had been in shows in previous years but didn’t say any more to him.

As the rehearsal continued he became more and more distressed, crying etc. He pulled his knees to his chest and just sobbed. He didn’t respond to anyone who sat with him or spoke to him.

I realised why he wasn’t allowed to be in the show. It has wizards and witches in it, and he is from a very religious family. Despite 3.5 years of daily desperation trying to get their son to join in and be part of the class, their beliefs override him being part of a fun and bonding activity with his class mates. He has no choice whether he wants to take part and is very much an outsider (the teacher tried to engage him in helping but he was unwilling).

That’s the definition of wicked to me. Not allowing a child to engage if they want to. I’m not forcing my child to believe in anything but kindness. She’s opted not to believe in santa, tooth fairy or Easter bunny and is not harmed at all by it. There’s lots of fun and imagination in her life - she thinks there may be elves in Iceland and that the seasons might be changed by fairies (although the more scientific questioning has started). I’m not squashing her imagination or enjoyment of life by not pretending that a reindeer has landed on the roof and bitten a carrot left by the fire. She adores Disney despite declaring from the first visit, aged 3, that they were just adults dressed up. It’s still magical to her.

The little boy above has been conditioned to believe in Santa though. So presumably causing him hurt and pain at not being part of a group they’ve tried pushing him into daily for over 3 years because of their beliefs is absolutely fine.

My DD1 was a bit freaked out by the whole Father Christmas thing when she was small. I remember taking her to see him in a fabulous grotto. She loved getting on the train, seeing all the decorations etc. But when she got near the man himself she was bloody terrified. Tears like I'd never seen.

Roll on a few years. She said to me a few months ago "Mummy, I know what Father Christmas's real name is....it's Natalia Osipova". I laughed and said "Do you think so?", but left it like that. But we both know she "knows".

And - do you know what? She's been far more "into" Christmas this year than she ever has been. She loves "playing the game" about FC for her little sister and is far more enthusiastic about the whole thing. So no "magic" (whatever that means) lost there. And I think I would have broken her trust in some small way had I attempted some elaborate ruse to convince get FC was real.

There's lying and then there's an alternative truth. Use your imagination and make up a wonderful story about Santa to tell your children. One that they will go on to tell their children and so on.

No child is going to have trust issues because you tried to keep a myth going to make sure they got the best out of Christmas ffs.

There's lying and then there's an alternative truth.

Donald, is that you?!

Donald, is that you?!

Vladimir???

Eh? What’s an alternative truth then? Do you honestly believe that Santa is real (or whatever ‘truth’ you would tell a child? I don’t happen to feel strongly either way on this one, but you can’t claim that the big man in a red suit is true... Or maybe you can. Genuinely curious!

OK. So I used to tell my DD that Santa is real if you believe in him and once you stop believing then he doesn't come to the house anymore. That kept her going until she asked where Santa went in the summer, I told her Barbados with the reindeer for a long holiday then she saw some reindeer at our local animal park and the secret was out. We still laugh about it now but she certainly doesn't hold any grudges!

It never bothered me that I was 'lied' to but my parents didn't really go to any sort of massive effort. They just said he was real, I believed them, until I got to the sort of age where I realised it wasn't true - 7 or 8 I think.

But now with children of my own I do feel a bit uncomfortable about telling them something that isn't true. I don't feel it's really comparable to stories. I think now we are more open and honest with our children and santa doesn't fit in with that, for me.