Man asked for kiss from my four year old daughter

[thickgit]

So, we were at the fair/fireworks this evening and my daughter was having turns on the giant inflatable slide. The man running it was about 75 I would say, and kept asking my daughter for a high five when she reached the bottom. When her goes were finished he bent down and pointed to his cheek, asking for her to give him a kiss. Thankfully, I was close enough to be able to step in and said no, no kissing thank you.
My daughter asked why not. That was tricky. The first thing that came out of my mouth was 'we don't kiss people we don't know' then I said 'only mummy, daddy and brother' . My daughter replied 'but I kiss Pamela' (girl in her class, not real name). I said that was okay.
Gosh, it's so tricky to get this stuff right! I appreciate any advice on what to say to my daughter to help keep her safe, that is age appropriate and that won't scare or confuse her
I'd also like your opinion on the scenario. I'm glad I stopped her kissing him. When the firework display started I went up to the man and said "you are out of order asking little girls for kisses, that's not on, I'm going to report you" He said nothing apart from Okay and he looked sheepish. This may have been one hundred percent innocent. . . Little old man who genuinely adores children.
Did I over react in your opinion? What would you have done in this situation?

What about an unaccompanied chikd then, the will be some at the Firework display.

Anyway, if she's said she will report, she should.

Nothing worse than an empty threat. And maybe there was more to it, that pricked her instincts, than she can convey in a post.

"Until they find a kid they can push them with a little bit more" (boundaries). Yes indeed. You've brought tears to my eyes. You know, when I was there I had a sense, a feeling, that he was paying my daughter a bit too much attention. Please don't crucify me. Again, he was probably innocent. But honestly, my gut was making me watch like a hawk. Whether that's me being paranoid or intuitive, I'll never know. One thing I do know is I'm not willing to take chances or give people the benefit of the doubt. . . Not when it comes to my children. I know that might mean that we live in a sad world, but from my experience, we live in a bad world sadly. Like I've said, I'm just so happy that people are talking out more. It's clear that it's rife. It scares the hell out of me.

I think you did exactly the right thing. Just last night a very "nice" old man in our town, well known and well liked was arrested for grooming more than one child, sending and receiving inappropriate pictures and more, describing a couple of those poor children as decoys. So it really can be as inappropriate as it seems under people's noses

What about an unaccompanied chikd then, the will be some at the Firework display.

Yes, that's who you'd expect to ne targeted.

Or DC with vulnerable mothers.

Give your lassie a hug,and remember most folk are good.you acted rightly on parental hunch

If the OP reports this to the police, and the man is indeed entirely innocent then surely it would still be a good thing? Wouldn't there be a chance the police would have a word with him (assuming no other complaints have been made) which would stop him ever trying to do this again? Which surely would protect him as well (assuming it was innocent)

So what about all the other kids he has access to Battleax what do you suppose should happen then? Because if everyone thought like you (and one time they did, look at Jimmy Saville) then he will never be reported because telling him off seems enough. Er no.

Once is enough. That mother knew to tell him no, she reminded him that he was wrong and that what he has done could land him in trouble. If she chooses not to report then so be it, but it is allowing that man to continue grooming other children asking for kisses until some brave person decides to report, and that’s how you end up with a string of abused kids.

InkandBone has hit the nail on the head.

I’d rather the odd over reaction than the culture of shrugging things off and covering things up like children have had to put up with for decades, resulting in a huge number of people, male and female, being abused.

So what about all the other kids he has access to Battleax what do you suppose should happen then? Because if everyone thought like you (and one time they did, look at Jimmy Saville) then he will never be reported because telling him off seems enough. Er no.

I think you've misunderstood what I'm saying.

But never mind. It was dealt with well at the time and OP thinks it warrants a report, so it's covered.

I don't know if this man is from a generation where that sort of thing was normal or whether he's a raging perv.

I think what really matters is that it's not ok NOW and you did an excellent job of protecting her.

With regards to what you tell her, I would go down the route of 'We only kiss people we know and whom we choose to kiss'. Never strangers and never people who ask for kisses when we weren't thinking about giving them a kiss. That she can choose to kiss people she knows really well and feels safe with but that her body belongs to her - every bit of it - and that no adult either known or unknown has any right to do anything to her body or ask for anything that involves her body.

It's a very important message, and people going down the 'poor old man, I'm sure he's harmless' route and feeling sad for him that he couldn't get a kiss from an unknown 4 year old, you are part of the problem.

No I really haven’t. You have an archaic way of thinking.

To those who're saying no need to report because the OP dealt with it appropriately - nothing happened this time, to this particular child.

But what of all the other children this man comes into contact with? In an environment in which to a small child he is in a position of authority and trust as the man who works the ride, and maybe seen also as a friend if his parents did allow them to kiss him. Children can and do get lost at fairgrounds, separated from family, and there's the man they kissed ... why not go and tell him that they're lost ...?

See the potential for much greater harm?

Once is enough. That mother knew to tell him no, she reminded him that he was wrong and that what he has done could land him in trouble. If she chooses not to report then so be it, but it is allowing that man to continue grooming other children asking for kisses until some brave person decides to report, and that’s how you end up with a string of abused kids.

You really haven't read my posts, have you? Just latched onto one of them.

BattleAx I read your posts and your thinking is wrong. Very very wrong. The decision you would make compared to the majority of the people on this post with regards to reporting is wrong.

Police? Dear god. Maybe he was an innocent guy who's gone home to his wife tonight and told her that times have changed and that you can't even get a kiss from a wee child, maybe he is a grooming type, but I think it was a bit much to tell him you were going to report him.

Agoodcupoftea I’m a child protection social worker who has worked on a high-profile CSE investigation. I’m pretty informed.

What because I wouldn't make empty threats (which feed a sense of invincibility if someone is an offender) and I unfortunately have a bit of insight into how these things go? Fine.

But I do think OP should focus on the fact that she was THERE and alert and hence she was the protective factor, whoever was around. Which hopefully should be a reassuring thought.

That's a really good point about dc with vulnerable mothers.

And asking for a kiss, once, in the presence of the mother is not grooming.

I used to live near Oxford Street when I was little. My mum dragged me up there every Saturday. Without fail in the kids clothing department there would be a man asking my mum if I could try on something he had picked out, on the basis that I was the same age as his daughter that he was buying for. My daft innocent mum always said yes, and even though I felt discomfited, did the modelling. It has only been a recent realisation that these men were there in a place where kids would be to fulfill some unfathomable fantasy. These opportunists are everywhere unfortunately.

If you are a child protection social worker you should know a huge, paramount, more important than anything else, factor in protecting children is that concerns are reported and passed on.

Don't waste your time Ska, Tea's tabloid expertise trumps the real thing 🙄

Battleax you’re so right. Giving up now.

Skarosssinkplunger then I would say that a detective working with historic child sexual abuse investigations is more informed than you.