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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

....to not invite this girl to my daughter's party because she's a nightmare!!!

783 replies

smokinhotchilli · 25/10/2017 23:27

This is so tricky! And all this is new to me so any advice would be great.
My daughter has been friends with a girl called Rose (made up name) for two years. They are both 4. There's a group of kids who have been close since nursery & they have all started school & are in the same class.
Have never been very close to Rose's mum but the girls occasionally meet up at weekends .... Or used to...
Since starting school, Rose has become a bit of a nightmare. According to my daughter, none of the group want to play with her, she hits, shouts, pushes, doesn't listen and is really naughty (all told to me by my daughter & the other kids) and they often tell the teacher .... I've seen Rose doing all of this before & after school.
My daughter is refusing to have her at her birthday party which is really soon & won't invite her. The mum texted to ask what's happening for my daughters birthday...
What would you do?
AIBU to ask the mum if everything is ok at home & mention Rose's behaviour in a gentle & considerate way? And then explain that my daughter doesn't want her at the party? Arghhhhh! Don't want to upset anyone.

OP posts:
BoomBoomBoomBoooom · 26/10/2017 00:07

Please don't invite a girl who scratches, pushes, hits and name-calls to your daughters birthday party. That's horrible, especially given its probably the first party she will fully remember in years to come.

One of my childhood neighbour's kids was awfully abusive to me in the same way and she had to come to all my parties. She ruined every one and I was always desperate for them to end and everyone said they were bad afterwards Sad

smokinhotchilli · 26/10/2017 00:07

I love Mumsnet
Some of you have helped me see a new perspective here.
I thank you.
I'm gonna sleep on it & speak to my daughter in the morn.

OP posts:
PurpleMinionMummy · 26/10/2017 00:07

Why assume something is wrong at home? I think if this new behaviour since starting school it's obvious she's struggling with school and mean to punish her for that by not inviting her. You don't seem to want her there anyway.

Carouselfish · 26/10/2017 00:09

I'd invite her...
a) so you can observe how they all interact and see the reality. Then you can model ways of dealing with Rose's behaviour directly to your daughter.
b) so that the friendships with Rose are given a chance to repair not made worse by excluding her
c) because four is young to be written off as a troublemaker. Things might be totally different in a party environment as opposed to school.

May09Bump · 26/10/2017 00:09

Rose's mum is probably aware of the behaviour and I guess that she is not getting many invites / playdates. She is probably trying to recover things for her daughter - which can be pretty heartbreaking and futile (been there).

I would be honest - grab her for a coffee and tell her the girls friendship has cooled due to some fallouts (only specify if pushed) and as it's a small party she has chosen a group of friends she is playing with.

I think if you do invite her and the other invites leave her out - not being horrid, just navigate to natural playgroups. Then it could be more damaging for Rose.

Kid's social stuff is hardwork.

WorraLiberty · 26/10/2017 00:09

Good idea OP

Hope you find a compromise Thanks

irishe · 26/10/2017 00:15

I would invite Rose, but I say that as a mother who has a daughter who is also struggling with the transition to school and I feel very worried that at this crucial stage for making friendships she will be judged and excluded in this way because her behaviour is not perfect.

I do understand the arguments about listening to children and giving them a choice, however these are 4 year olds who with the best will in the world are still learning and being socialised.

If I was that mother (Though i would not have asked about the party) and I thought we were in a friendship group that had lasted 2 years or so and I realised that my child was the only one from the friendship group who had not been invited to the birthday, I would have 2 realisations

  • firstly that my daughter had been excluded because of her behaviour which would sadden me on my daughters behalf when she found out.
  • secondly, that the friendship, such as it was, was over.

I have never tolerated or accepted second rate relationships in my own life and I am bringing my daughter up to hopefully have those same values. When these things happen, I tell my daughter, it is better to be friends and hang out with people who love you for who you are, rather than those who moan and judge you.

At the same time as working with my daughter on her own transition difficulties, I am struck how quick to exclude adults can be of young children. Not a lot of compassion and empathy around at times.

Which is a long winded way of saying, if you want the friendship to end, don't invite Rose. That may be best for both sides. Once done, can't be undone.

Good luck with your decision

Queenofthedrivensnow · 26/10/2017 00:21

Hi op. I’m not having this issue but I wouldn’t be surprised if it develops with a friend of my dd. Same age as yours. I’m currently managing it by trying to get to know the kid better and understand their reality a bit more. At this point I wouldn’t allow my dd to suddenly exclude a child who had been a close friend but I would be worried and I would be supervising very closely.

LEMtheoriginal · 26/10/2017 00:22

I would invite her but keep a close eye. If your dd and her friends are excluding her then that is bullying in itself. It may be the reason she is acting out.

Maybe give your dd strategies to cope with rose. "If you are rough it makes me not want to play with you but you are my friend so let's play nicely" from the horses mouth might help rose to modify her behaviour. Although realistically that's slot to expect at 4.

Children can be vile

lalliella · 26/10/2017 00:23

Please don't consider inviting a child who pushes and scratches your DD to her party. What sort of message would that give her? It's rewarding bad behaviour, and punishing your DD, but for what? What sort of birthday would she have if it happened at her party? And be honest to the mum and explain why. She may be wondering why Rose isn't getting invited to things and she needs to know so she can deal with it.

CorbynsBumFlannel · 26/10/2017 00:29

I wouldn't invite Rose. I'd probably say to the mum that money's a bit tight so she'll just be having a few friends over for tea/whatever activity is planned.

Oh2beatsea · 26/10/2017 00:34

Just to present the other side of the story....
My daughter (age 8) has been friends with a group of 5 girls since Reception. All were invited to one of the girls birthday party in the summer. About 2 weeks before the party I got a text to say it was cancelled as something had come up. My daughter has recently been diagnosed with autism. She is high functioning and her issues are not always obvious (No hitting or aggression but lots of anxiety). All the parents in the group know about it. I then come across photos on social media of the party. It went ahead and my daughter "had been replaced" by a different girl from the class. My daughter has no idea that this has happened. I am now planning my daughter's birthday party for December - what a dilemma!? Do i invite this girl or not? Mum has made her feelings clear. My daughter still thinks her and this girl are good friends. I dont feel it is right to leave out 1 girl from the group - like they did with my daughter.

ginplease8383 · 26/10/2017 00:39

Please don't exclude her, shes only little. I'm a bit confused as to why your DD is so vehemently against her coming - surely if she is a kind person she wouldn't want to exclude someone?
How would you feel your DD was excluded when she was potentially having a rough time?

ginplease8383 · 26/10/2017 00:40

Oh2- I'm so sorry to hear that what a completely unforgivable thing for the mum to do

Nanny0gg · 26/10/2017 00:41

Some of these replies make me very sad.

She's 4

No understanding, no thinking she needs a chance?

Nope, let's exclude.

Job done.

milliemolliemou · 26/10/2017 00:42

Watching for comments here - I think OP should talk to the ma frankly and explain why Rose might not be welcome OR would be welcome if ma came with to help and take Rose away immediately if it all got out of hand.

Friend had a DS who couldn't work out why he wasn't appreciated at play group or parties - didnt help he was very tall for his age - turned out he was ADHD. This may not be as serious in Rose's case but who knows with the long range MN diagnostics.

Nanny0gg · 26/10/2017 00:43

Oh2beatsea I hate to say it, but if they can be that spiteful, do you think they'd come?

I am so sad for you DD. Some of these parents really need to look a bit closer at themselves.

KoalaD · 26/10/2017 00:50

What NannyOgg said.

The lack of compassion for a FOUR-year-old is astonishing.

HamSandWitches · 26/10/2017 00:53

How does the mum know about the party, could the kids have been saying Rose your not coming to the party. Are you sure they are not singling her out to leave her out. They are only 4 and at that age can be quite protective over friendships and copy each other

HarrietVane99 · 26/10/2017 01:02

The lack of compassion for a FOUR-year-old is astonishing.

Where is the compassion for the op's dd, who is also FOUR? Who doesn't want someone at her party who pushes, hits and calls her names?

How often do people post on MN about how women are conditioned to put up with crap behaviour, to put their own wishes and best interests last? Well, here we see the conditioning starting. At FOUR years old. And by other women.

When this girl is fourteen or fifteen, and a boy is saying or doing things that make her uncomfortable, will she know that she's allowed to say no and walk away? Or will she think she has to go along with it, for fear of hurting his feelings?

Intomyarms · 26/10/2017 01:03

Don't exclude the little girl. Have a chat with Rose's mum, gently explain what your daughter has told you and ask her if she would stay at the party to help supervise it Rose.

You are the parent and it is up to you to lay down the rules. If your own daughter said she wanted to invite fifty people because she 'liked all of them', I'm sure you wouldn't be slow to advise her that you make the rules.

Bunnyfuller · 26/10/2017 01:06

Rose hasn't been very kind to DD recently, so unless we can get to the bottom of it and they get on like before it probably wouldn't be much fun for either of them.

Beware tho, kids are experts at only presenting themselves as the victim

Amber111 · 26/10/2017 01:12

I think there are some fantastic responses to this thread already with sage advice from parents who have a few years experience of this type of scenario under their belts.

I can remember in my daughter's reception year it was all about having whole class parties in halls, because everyone was making new friendships and getting to know 20 odd other children on top of the 10 they'd been at pre school with and already had friendships with (or not). Parents seemed keen to include everyone and in hindsight it was a good idea, as the year went on children with birthdays over the next 9 months then invited the child to their party, and it all helped with being included with lots of other children in the class and different friendships developing.

I'd say that most of that first year was spent making new friends as well as continuing existing friendships or drifting away from them, social groups were pretty firmly established by the summer term and now in year 2 they are still pretty much exactly the same. It's a really important year for establishing friendships at school, and your daughter inviting some new friends is great, but if they're replacing one little girl from an existing pre school friendship group after 7 weeks at school at the party then its not so great. I know my daughter would be devastated in Rose's position, and I'd be seeing that friendship with the other child as over as well as any friendship I had with her mum. In my experience the mums can also be just as upset over party invitations, if not more so than the children!

I help out in classes at school and at this age there is huge status and excitement that builds when a child has a party. Quite often they will use it as a bargaining tool telling each other they will / won't be invited to their party if they do something they do / don't like, some of them do this even months before their birthday! It really does have a big impact on kids at this age, I've seen the devastation and tears from the children not invited to a party when the whole class parties stopped in year 1 and people started having smaller gatherings. Personally without knowing the details from the teacher, I couldn't do that to a 4 year old that's been part of a friendship group for 2 years til now, not unless I knew from the teacher she was definitely being persistently unkind to and hurting my child, and even then, call me a mug but I'd be trying to employ understanding and kindness as an initial tactic to deal with things.

Things happening at school should always be dealt with first by the school and ours repeatedly tell parents please come to us if you have any concerns. I would have spoken to the teacher to establish the facts before now, not relying on reports from a group of 4 year olds who we all know can misconstrue and exaggerate things. Please speak to the teacher first. I'm also wondering if the reason the mum text you like that is because Rose has mentioned she isn't invited / wanted and she's worried. Or she's just genuinely assuming Rose will be part of your daughter's birthday within their existing friendship group like she has been over the last 2 years, which let's face it is half their little lives and a pretty significant period to us as well as to them at that age. I'd reply saying you're still deciding what to do and then I'd get the facts from the teacher next week.

CorbynsBumFlannel · 26/10/2017 01:12

No-one has any right to be invited to something. I'm sure there are other kids in the class that would be more deserving of an invitation yet no-one seems to be up in arms about them being excluded? Why should the ops dd and her friends have the day ruined by someone pushing and hitting them?

MistressDeeCee · 26/10/2017 01:19

No I wouldn't invite her. You risk your DDs being unhappy and her party possibly being spoilt. For what, really? To save face and please other people? Its your DDs birthday, yes you can explain to her its not nice to leave people out but if she really doesn't want this girl there then don't force her. Your DD matters too. Id text mum back saying its a small event or DD has chosen who she wants to attend. Why do people have whole class parties anyway, its all about adults choosing their own friends yet expecting their child to host a child who's been horrid to them. All to save face with other adults, really. Unecessary hassle

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