Financial Abuse?

[emma6776]

Hi all, not sure if this is FA or not. Grateful for advice. DP and I have been together for 9 years, with one DD (5). He works full time earning over £80k and I went part time when I had DD. I took home £500 p/m when I went back after mat leave (2 days) but studied part time and now make £1000 p/m working 3 days. I've always paid all the childcare bar £124 per month from
CCVs that DP gets. Until August when DD started school at least 59% of my salary went on childcare & then I paid other activities on top - swimming, days out etc. Often had to walk (1 hr) to work and back because I couldn't afford bus fare at the end of the month, had to make my monthly lenses last 4 months as couldn't afford the direct debit. No saving. The house is in partners name. AIBU? He pays all the mortgage and utilities and most of the shopping (I do top up shops). I have no access to 'family' money. Savings are in his of DDs name. Sometime he will transfer me money for DD's swimming lessons or the vet if I have literally nothing left. He's otherwise lovely, but I do feel the situation is unfair. He just bought himself a £2k watch but I've needed new prescription glasses for over a year. I don't know how to discuss this with him as he makes me feel so unreasonable every time I raise finances.

I really think you've helped create this situation. Why would you just grumble on with shitty contacts or not having glasses ? Why would you not ask for money for bus fare? Or sort the situation out. It just sounds a bit martyrish to me.

If you says he's clueless just bloody tell him

The issue is really that he's aware that the OP struggles sometimes and is difficult to talk to about money. I was subjected to financial abuse for years and this seems horribly familiar. Financial turned to emotional as well, and I was always going to leave but with 4 dc there was always someone sitting exams etc. We had to the outside world a great life, he indulged in expensive hobbies, we lived in a lovely house and owned lots of properties (worth well into 7 figures).

At 55 I was able to take some of my pension, paid off my debts, but kept this from him. I'd always earmarked my pension as my "running away" fund, but I think my demeanour must have changed as the EA ramped up (usually there would be a few good days a week) culminating in him raping me. For me that was the end and I couldn't continue with the marriage. This was just before the youngest dc sat their GCSEs and A levels, so was not well timed (but they both still got good results).

Abuse starts very slowly. I thought he was good with the children etc, but in retrospect he did buggar all. It takes ages to get out of an abusive situation and I now wish I'd recognised the multiple red flags. My STBX certainly knew what he was doing - mainly a desperate need to stop my imagined extravagant lifestyle.

Why the fuck would anyone consider it "grabby" to want to be on the deeds (and mortgage) of your family home? The home in which you are both live and raise your joint child.

You have paid childcare for years, amongst other things. You have worked, cooked and cleaned. You have contributed financially and in other ways just as much as he has.

Even if minimal you paid a small amount into his former mortgage. Therefore helping pay in part for this one

Increasinglymiddleaged I HAVE read the thread and I AM aware that there is now less of a financial burden on OP - but that's not the point.

And yes, you've made your point twice that some people go on quite well without a joint account - and I've said that that's fine but in a lot of cases especially nowadays when women aren't supposed to have to ask for their 'housekeeping' once a week from their husbands, that's often the way that people do it so it's fair and no one person has the control and holds all the decision-making ability.

It's not just the security issue for OP though is it (although I agree it is very important), it's the whole attitude and bias of the OPs other half and her having to ask for all that she needs financially. That, is bullshit. That is going to continue unless she changes it (eg the washing machine breaks down - the day she can just go online and order a new one and have the debit card to do it and not have to ask permission first, is what OP needs to be demanding). This is key to everything and it defines exactly what is wrong.

I guess we shouldn't forget that this is a type of abuse. Why hasn't OP done anything yet? That's the same question women who are regularly beaten are asked - and it's just as unfair for OP really. Maybe she's only just getting the realisation that it's not a fair situation and is Victorian in nature. Maybe she's been financially 'beaten down' - it's still abuse.

I think OP is reporting accurately when she says her other half is 'clueless'. In a normal situation of equality of opinion, actions and finances, this happening if it happened to me would result in "Oi, I've had to walk to bloody work today you shit because I've not got enough money for the friggin' bus - sort it out!!!" or "Oi, how am I supposed to not damage my eyes when I can't even afford a pair of glasses!!", or "By the way I'm selling the deep fat fryer because I have no money for x y or z - hope you're happy!!!". Sounds like OPs been ground down and either hasn't mentioned it because she feels vulnerable (possibly doesn't even realise she is vulnerable maybe) but to be honest I cannot see how he doesn't know any of this (is he too ignoring stuff or does his £80k a year job with £80k a year hours attached mean he genuinely doesn't know?

He won't know unless OP stands up for herself and I genuinely hope that she will - go for it OP. And at the same time the deeds and daughter's accounts need sorting. But that should be a natural extension of sorting out the arse about situation that exists currently.

OP, when I read your comment, "I don't need access to family money", I despair.

It's the principle of it - not whether you actually need to spend it!!!

As a PP said, you are supposed to be a family, but you don't live like one. Not at all.

I agree with you 90% keeponworking, MN is just bizarre that people latch onto tiny details of posts.

Ultimately his reaction when it is raised will tell us whether it is just security/ lack of thought that is the issue or whether it is abusive. But a lot of what is written on this thread is double guessing.

In one way if as a married women with joint finances I posted in aibu ... that DH paid all the bills and I had £1k a month to spend and I thought I should have more I'd be called all the spoilt cahs under the sun. So it isn't that unreasonable that he thinks she's okay for money and happy with the situation.

But of course if he is abusive and trying to control getting married is to be avoided at all costs...

Earlier this year when I got new prescription glasses, two pairs, one for watching TV and another with intermediate addition for computer work, they costs 2 x £15 + £5.96 for postage, so £35.96 in total. That was from SelectSpecs. But not everyone is aware they can buy glasses online, and how much cheaper it is.

If he was happy to hand over £150 when asked, presumably he would have been happy to hand over money for glasses or bus fare. Though neither of those sound like very big expenses, so the fact that OP was short of money for them is an indicator of a bigger problem.

I think you should insist being on the morgage. If his response is not of course my love this is your house too we are a partnership then he sees you nothing more than a maid. Sorry to sound harsh but married or not you should be treated like an equal loving partner. What is he spending all his money on?

I'm not sure if this was an issue in this case, but sometimes it can appear that putting a low-earning partner on the mortgage reduces the amount you can borrow. For example, at one time banks lent 3 time higher earner income or 2.5 times joint. A straight-forward interpretation of this, if the higher earned earns 80K and the lower earner 10K, is that you can borrow 240K in the higher earner name or 225K in joint names. This may or may not actually be true, but taking the banks lend criteria at face value may lead people to think it is, and base their plans on that.

Get married to protect yourself or name on the deeds. You have no idea what lays ahead 20 or 30 years down the line. Your contribution to the family is just as important as his.

Dear God, have we got to go back to being married in order to achieve financial stability - what the hell does this do for OPs situation?! Absolutely barmy.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are other controlling or abusive behaviours coming at OP from this man - he seems to have quite the cavalier attitude. Marrying him would be just about the worst thing OP could do under current circumstances.

If things get fully sorted out, yes, it's an option if he has an epiphany and realises how wrong things are. But not at the moment. It's an appallingly bad reason to get married, surely.

The second part of my sentence said 'or name on the deeds'

have we got to go back to being married in order to achieve financial stability - what the hell does this do for OPs situation?!

If you give up working and become financially reliant on a partner, then yes, marriage provides a huge raft of protections that her partner seems unwilling to give her.

If he's abusive, then no, it wouldn't be a good idea to be married, but no one goes into a relationship with someone they believe to be abusive from the outset. Now several years down the line, OP's situation is worse now than if she had married.

FUCKING hell molecule!

You've let things go to far OP, why has there never been a discussion about money before.

I've always worked full time but after maternity leave I will be going back part time as logistically I cant do full time (shift work, long commute). When me & DH discussed this he actually thought our childcare cost was going to come out of my much less wage than his so I would practically be going to work for free.

Errrr absolutely no way was I having that. He definitely needed a big talking to in terms of what is 'fair in finances when you're a family.

We decided to pool all the money, pay everything out (bills, childcare, savings) then split what is left.

There is nothing wrong with looking out for yourself & your DC after all you never know what could happen. Don't put yourself in a vulnerable position, which at the moment you are.

He's an arse. My dh earns far more than me but he won't spend a penny on himself... it all goes on me and the kids. I have to force him to get new shoes or clothes or glasses when he needs them. That's a truly lovely guy.

This set up is just not fair! Please just speak to him but before you do perhaps write down a rough break down of your spending, how you stuggle with this amount. And you must ask him for some more money.

You have a child togather, for goodness sake. You can't go on like this. Be clear but factual. Hope it works out.

The cluelessness is entirely contrived. Of course he's clueless if every time she tries to talk to him about it he manipulates the discussion so that she feels unreasonable and shuts up.

He doesn't want to know.

OP - why do you not need access to family money? Why should your DP have more free cash than one? Why do you have to ask for money?

Molecule

No @Calmanglass, that isn't a "truly lovely guy". That's bizarre. He should be saving for the future and making sensible investments rather than spending every penny 🙄. Love is not measured in how much someone spends on you.

Just thinking figures for a moment. If he earns 80k that works out at around £4,500 per month. He'll pay the mortgage - maybe £1k or £2k out of that. Fares to work, food, (£500 pm?) , bills - bills on a three bed house would be at least £2 - 300pm if you include phones , internet, insurance, a car just with tax and insurance will be costing at least £50 per month - if you include petrol and any loan costs nearer £150 a month or more. And the OP says there is private medical and life insurance. That does not leave very much over - less that the £k that the OP takes home.

Everyone is quick to say financial abuse but all it seems to me is a lack of communication. He clearly doesn't realise how she feels and maybe he thinks that he is doing his absolute best for her and his child.

If after a conversation or two the OP still felt that he was being unfair then she could leave.

OP, your arrangements seem very strange to me. It's almost as if you are merely a lodger in your DP's house. This is not an equal partnership, by any analysis.

Oh Dear op. You are in a very vulnerable position here. Why are you not on the mortgage? Did he already own the house before you got together? Do you have plans to marry? A loving partner, especially when those partners share a child would not allow their partner to struggle and go without.

You need a discussion I feel about where your relationship is going and most definitely he should be paying childcare. If he won't put you on the mortgage then that says to me he sees the house as his as is not committed to you long term. He is protecting his assets should you split. Lovely partner I'm afraid you don't have.