Financial Abuse?

[emma6776]

Hi all, not sure if this is FA or not. Grateful for advice. DP and I have been together for 9 years, with one DD (5). He works full time earning over £80k and I went part time when I had DD. I took home £500 p/m when I went back after mat leave (2 days) but studied part time and now make £1000 p/m working 3 days. I've always paid all the childcare bar £124 per month from
CCVs that DP gets. Until August when DD started school at least 59% of my salary went on childcare & then I paid other activities on top - swimming, days out etc. Often had to walk (1 hr) to work and back because I couldn't afford bus fare at the end of the month, had to make my monthly lenses last 4 months as couldn't afford the direct debit. No saving. The house is in partners name. AIBU? He pays all the mortgage and utilities and most of the shopping (I do top up shops). I have no access to 'family' money. Savings are in his of DDs name. Sometime he will transfer me money for DD's swimming lessons or the vet if I have literally nothing left. He's otherwise lovely, but I do feel the situation is unfair. He just bought himself a £2k watch but I've needed new prescription glasses for over a year. I don't know how to discuss this with him as he makes me feel so unreasonable every time I raise finances.

I think you need to sit dp down for a serious chat op. Whether it is abuse or not is largely irrelevant, it is unfair and leaving you in a precarious position as you aren't married and this needs to be rectified. Whether this is deliberate on his part or not is purely double guessing from posters.

In one way though £1k a month without childcare to pay for anymore and him paying food bills, mortgage, bills etc sounds like quite a lot to me unless I'm missing something. My credit card averages £1k a month but I pay for family food on that.

Brittbugs - I'm sorry to hear what you went through but no, the OP should absolutely not have to spell out her financial situation to the 'D'P. It should be bloody obvious! She is the mother of his child fgs, not his flat mate!
This kind of set-up is ridiculous and I can't believe it

But he either needs it spelling out or she needs to have that awkward discussion. Money discussions are always difficult and he may not be making her feel awkward on purpose but it could be her own feelings contributing towards that.

When I had to have money discussions with my DH, I felt upset, sick and incredibly awkward because he earns more than me. As soon as the conversation started, he was mortified to hear how I was feeling and thought everything was ok, as I asked for small amounts when needed.

I was scared, because of the past, that's why I felt the way I did but my DH wasn't to blame for my feelings about it, those feelings were maintained and enabled by my ex.

What I'm trying to say is the conversation needs to happen between them and the response will tell her everything she needs to know.

I just can't paint everyone (male) as an abuser. Yes there are different levels and the level I encountered doesn't trump anyone elses, least of all the OP's.

It sounds like from her other posts that they need a discussion regardless of how awkward it is, not a half attempt at discussion then wound up by 4 pages of responses telling her to leave, it's abuse, he's controlling and her being told she is wrong when she says he is nice.

He is either one of two things, a twat or utterly clueless.

I say this because when I first had to quit work to look after our kids, we didn't have a joint account, and I was really struggling. I remember asking my husband for money to pay for tampons. It then struck me that I shouldn't have to ask for money for tampons! I spoke to him about it and he was flabbergasted. He just hadn't thought about it. He apologised and said that I was right I shouldn't have to ask for anything. He opened a joint account and his salary was in that. In the meantime he gave me his bank card.

It is possible to do all this and basically not realise that you are being abusive. It is possible. However unless you have that discussion, you'll never know. If you have that discussion and nothing changes or you feel worse after the chat, then you need to sort things out so you can leave. Because nothing will change. You are basically his live-in childcare. You will get support for your daughter, but it sounds like even that will be better than what is happening now.

I think it's really sad that despite being in 2017, women are still beholden to men for money.

That he is being abusive (sorry that was ambiguous)

I don't know whether to laugh or cry that you think he has taken out life insurance "for you."

Who exactly do you think benefits from that? You know, what with you being dead and all? He does

OK,Brittbugs, it's all the OP's fault. I must have misread the bits where she HAS spoken to him about money in the past and been made to feel unreasonable every time. But no, definitely her problem for 'not communicating' properly. What if someone said that to you about your ex? That you just didn't communicate properly with him. Hopefully you would tell them to piss off.

Good luck OP, you seem to have changed your tune.

Well. I'm not sure if I am understanding this right but..OP paid all the childcare stuff out of her 1k a month. At its worst that was 600 a month. However, ALL the mortgage ( and we don't know how much that is) bills and food are paid by him.
Now childcare costs are much less so she has more like 6-700 a month for spending/saving? She also has private medical care covered.
I'm not sure that she would be better off single.
It's a crap set up in that she is almost living like a child-everything other than childcare is taken care of, and she had to ask if she needs more, but when I was a lone parent earning 1k a month and paying for everything I certainly didn't have anything left over.
She needs to be on the deeds to the house-that's obvious, and they should have a joint account for mortgage/bills/food/childcare into which they should each pay a percentage according to income.
Depending on the mortgage she may be better off this way ( or not) but it would be a more grown up solution.
If he won't discuss doing this, or refuses to do this (including putting her on the house) Then yes, that's abuse. Right now though I can't see her as being destitute.

Increasinglymiddleaged- I agree £1000 is more than enough for me to live on now I pay less childcare - however this has only been the situation since the end of August. Prior to that I paid around £400 per month for childcare.

For what it's worth I think DP falls into the 'clueless' rather than 'abusive' category. I will, again, try to discuss it all with him and maybe let him read this thread as I'm not able to put over my pov so eloquently.

There is the potential for me to pick up more hours at work from April next year when we get our new departmental budget. I'm in a profession I love but that isn't particularly well paid.

I don't know what he'd say if I asked him to put me on the house deeds. I don't foresee us seperating so I've never thought to raise it with him. I've never paid towards the mortgage except in the small flat he owned before we moved here - I paid a minimal rent (this was before we had DD). He bought this house himself and I didn't contribute financially at all. We are hoping to make improvements to the house soon, although he already has saved the money for this. I'd feel a bit grabby asking to be put on the deeds tbh.

I wouldn't expect him to support me financially if we split. I know he's continue to support DD and I would find full time work and rent somewhere smaller in the same area.

I'll speak to him tonight when DD is in bed and report back tomorrow.

Def go woth a spreadsheet and lay out all finances. If he has x amount spending money you should have the same too.

I'd feel a bit grabby asking to be put on the deeds tbh

And I would feel a bit grabby if I my partner sacrificed her career to care for our child and paid for all of the childcare and lived off benefits while she was on maternity leave. All while I was earning a very high salary and building up the equity in my house, which has increased in value since I bought it and to which she would not be entitled to a penny if we split. Swings and roundabouts I guess.

If he knowingly let her walk for an hour because she couldn't afford bus fare then there would need to be some extraordinary extenuating circumstances for that single fact not to convict him of being very, very mean.

I think he thinks he pays for "everything" (housing, bills, food) and she has no real expenses. (Childcare doesn't count because it's an expense only incurred if the lower earner's salary covers it, and this is unfortunately quite logical.)

If she didn't have bus fair at the end of the month, she's disorganised with money, because paying for that and childcare should have come before everything else. She was unreasonably short of money, he's still wrong, but it's something less fundamental than bus fair she should have been doing without.

bus fare.

If your DD has started school, I think the boat has sailed on the childcare costs discussion. Instead, you should focus on making yourself financially secure as an independent entity.

Given you're not married and you don't have a joint account or (really) joint finances, and your OH has demonstrated he doesn't consider it his job to help you out financially even though you sacrificed your career for child-rearing, you need to concentrate on you for a bit. No-one ever expects their relationship to break up, but you should make sure that you'll be in a reasonable position if it does.

Find yourself a full-time position, and work out how to climb the ladder a bit to increase your salary. Your OH will have to adapt his work to ensure he can do either the drop-offs or pick-ups. And make sure he does half of the unexpected pick-ups from school due to illness. In fact, I'd suggest he does all of the above - you've sacrificed your career for long enough. It's his turn now.

Have a discussion about the deeds. If he won't add you to them, you should consider getting on the property ladder yourself as soon as you're financially able. Perhaps a small flat somewhere that you can rent out?

Also sort out a pension.

Brittbugs - the point is, whether he's consciously abusive or just plain stupid, it's the OP who suffers.

In normal life, as I know it, having a baby is something something TWO people do together. One partner will always be the higher earner, one person (usually the woman) will probably take the hit to her salary, but this should be OBVIOUS because you are a partnership with mutual interest in supporting each other in the raising of your child. I don't get how people can be bothered with maintaining separate finances tbh, unless they don't trust each other's spending habits (or maybe it's a second marriage and one person has other dependents).
It must be obvious to this DP that the OP only works part-time since their child. Even if you don't do shared finances, any reasonable partner would enquire as to whether she has enough money in comparison to him and sort this out. I haven't worked at all since having DC (13 years) and I never asked for a penny for anything. We are parents and we are a family - it's all one and the same.

I mean "childcare doesn't count" in the sense that he know there's enough money to take care of it, not that it's not part of joint finances when looking at a wider picture.

Emma, I think you should get married. Don't feel 'grabby', you say you are in the relationship for the long-term and you have a child together. I know someone like you, she had three children with her partner. He now has a house worth over a million and a new girlfriend. Had she been married she would have received a share of the value of the house.Don't hide the financial situation from friends and family. If he is buying an expensive watch and you can't afford to take the bus, talk about this; public shame can be an effective motivator for change.

It is not 'grabby' to be put on the deeds, it is necessary. Relationships break down very frequently, you need to protect yourself. Oh and if your discussion goes well with your dp there are some lovely designer specs that £2,000 could cover 😉

I think the problem is you both seem to be skirting around making a proper commitment to each other yet you don't foresee separating

The worst worst thing of it all is you paid all the childcare. That other stuff i think is covered by the keeping things separate that though is appalling it should have been shared 50/50

You know what he should pay you back for that or at least accept he was wrong to put it on you

Larnieduck - I've never not worked other than mat leave and have studied, found better paid work and been promoted in the last few years so I do have an income, albeit a small one. I'll be looking at increasing my hours (currently 3 days) from next year.

I'd feel a bit grabby asking to be put on the deeds tbh

He's got you right where he wants you. Bravo that man.

He's done an absolute number on you OP. He's got an £80k job, so he can't be that fucking stupid.

- he's provided very well for me in the event of his death - house, shares and finances all come to me

But not in the event of you splitting up. A Will can be revoked very rapidly. Have you even seen these documents?

You have no protection here, no security, massively reduced pension and no savings. I don't buy a 'good' partner who doesn't even notice that you can't afford a bus fare or spectacles.

You need to be on the house deeds at the very least and have some proper arrangement about shared income.

I hate these financial abuse posts. It's 2017 not the 1950's!

Today you should ensure (not just discuss) that you have equal access to all family money or if not, an equal amount of 'free' money to spend as you wish - this does not include any costs relating to the house, your DD or joint living costs.

Get your name on the deeds of the house. You are in a relationship with this man, not his lodger.

Your lifestyle is fundamental wrong.

Yes, I saw that you'd maintained your career throughout (which I fully, fully support btw), but it sounds as if it still took quite a hit when you went part-time. Which would have been a reasonable (joint) decision to ensure you could raise your children... if he had stepped up to support you financially while you did it.

(I know he covered the bills/mortgage, but he would have been doing that anyway to build a financial future for himself. Those payments have all gone towards increasing his assets, whilst you've been left behind. His behaviour didn't really have to change at all after you had children, whilst the impact on you was much larger.)

Best of luck increasing your hours next year :)