Do you feel guilty about being well off?

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Inspired by the thread about big houses. Growing inequality within developed societies is becoming a global issue and was arguably a key factor in Brexit and the election of Trump etc

Many of us have more than we need, much more than others. I say I believe in societal inequality - and I sincerely believe that I do - but apart from reasonable donations to charity and votes for the left of centre candidates (Green, in my case) I'm not really doing anything to disrupt the status quo.

I'm well off, partly because I've worked hard, but mostly (if I'm honest) because I'm lucky and I feel guilty about it.

AIBU? Or is greed just a fundamental part of human nature?

Let's be honest, no one who is wealthy is going to give all their money away. But lots of us vote for change, pay our taxes, give to charity, help our families out and volunteer.

I do all these things and, no, as someone whose money comes from their own business, I don't feel guilty.

I live abroad and compared to many people around me, I am very well off. I am incredibly grateful for the opportunities I have had but yes, there is some guilt.

I feel a bit guilty. Only when I think of police, firefighters, nurses and teachers etc...
They work far harder than I do and I'm paid more than them
I fuck about in a bank.. if I wasn't here I doubt many people would notice.
If I take a day off. No really questions it, or knows whether it is authorised. My boss is in a different city so I can always say I'm 'working from home'.
I do feel guilty about that but tbh

I feel very grateful - sure I've worked hard, but plenty of people work hard and earn much less than me. I've benefited from having parents who valued education and taught a good work ethic so I can't pat myself on the back too much

I'm not well off, but I work in community regeneration on deprived housing estates and although I dont drive a new car, havent been on holiday in nine years and thought twice about putting the heating on this winter, I see the struggle some people go through daily. I also see the 500 per cent increase in foodbank use during the summer holidays when children dont get free school meals. I feel lucky - that could have been me.

I have had the same opportunities that most people have had. Secondary modern school and a few O levels. (Showing my age). Did well got to director level by sheer hard work. No guilt at all! Chaired organisations putting on community events and have raised £1,000's for charity. Put something back I think. But then having made the money, realised its not the be all and end all. Stress was unbelievable. Stupid hours. Now in stress free job earning £20k. But mortgage paid and low outgoings and life is bloody good! Anyone can do what I did, but now well off in time, living in beautiful place with wonderful partner. So well off indeed, and not just financially.

I feel grateful that we live comfortably now. I grew up with very little, and it makes me very sad to think of all the children now who are growing up eating out of food banks. I try to help where I can but were not wealthy enough to be able to change things as much as I'd like.

No, I don't. But I am happy to pay high taxes as a result.

Yes, I do.

I come from a very hard working, working class family (and extended family). My family had no ambition and didn't really make the best of themselves IMO. Others aren't bright enough to go into a well paid career but work their backsides off just to live.

I was just really lucky - got a scholarship to private school, got a university education, walked into a job at a law firm and kept getting promoted. Left a good sized inheritance when I was 18. Met a DH who was equally ambitious when we were both in minimum wage jobs and he's built his business up to earn a hell of a lot.

I've owned houses since I was 18. I have family in their 40s who rent because they've never been able to afford to buy. I get stick for being a lawyer. I get stick for having a "mansion" and driving an expensive car and going on expensive holidays. I don't gloat about it but I do feel bad that people are struggling when we have it so easy now.

I'm a socialist and had a very poor upbringing, so maybe I'm just preconditioned to feel guilty about it all.

No guilt at all. I did things most people would not be prepraed to do in terms of work, working hours, moving away from family, long hours and earn a fair bit and I do all I can to encourage others to make particular choices that might make life better for them. Anyway I never feel I have any spare cash.

There probably is a difference between those who worked their way to where they are (I remember no central heating, not buying hair conditioner as only shampoo was affordable and that kind of stuff, sleeping on a mattress as no bed when first married etc etc) compared with people who were given a lot of money by parents.

I also believe in absolute not relative poverty as a measure and that differences of income tend not to determine if people are happy so does it really matter if you have more or less than someone else.

Thou shalt not covet they neighbour's ox remains a pretty good moral principle which has stood the test of time since the days of the Bible.

Janet, huge numbers of people who accord with your description of the things you did which make you feel you've earned your money moving away from family, long hours, doing things 'other people aren't prepared to do' are impoverished economic migrants moving thousands of miles from home, working in care homes or as seasonal fruit-pickers for minimum wage or below it. Im not denigrating your hard work, but sacrifice and hard work don't necessarily get you anywhere.

I'm not well off by mumsnet standards. But I'm better off than a lot of my neighbours.
I'm very aware of my privilege.
Every time I take the kids on holiday (we have 2 per year in the UK usually Haven and camping), or on a day out, or buy them cakes in the cafe without having to think about it, or sign them up for extra curricular activities, or buy beers and snacks for DH and me without having to worry about the food budget...
Every time I do these things I'm aware that they are out of reach for perhaps the majority of the people around me.
And when you get into more fundamental matters:
We were able to get a mortgage (and help with the deposit from DHs parents) so our housing costs are lower than rent for an equivalent place, Our wages are not enormous but I can earn the same in 24 hours as a min wage job brings in for 30.
This allows us to arrange our lives to minimise childcare costs and spend loads of time with the kids.
So- even a lifestyle that might seem modest to some people- its really the result of positive choices that just aren't available to many, many people.
I would say guilty exactly. But I'm aware of it all the time.
Which is right IMO. Wouldn't like to be delusional like those guys on a recent thread who "don't feel rich" on £70,000

would'nt say guilty.

DH and I are among the top earners in the country and are hugely appreciative of what we have worked for. As a black woman I have probably grafted harder to get where I am. We give extremely generously to charitable initiatives and encourage the DC to have a social conscience. Over the years an occasional friend has treated me differently due to our wealth but at this stage in my life we know who our friends are. Guilt is a useless emotion. I'd rather get out there and play my own role in making a difference.

You shouldn't feel guilty when you've worked very hard for it.

@caroldecker

I don't think charity is just the answer. Society needs to show some decent values towards a more equal society. And that comes through political change.

Big Society - that was Cameron's sop. Came from an idealistic middle England do-gooder perspective.

You shouldn't feel guilty when you've worked very hard for it.

Gahhh! I get SO cheesed off when people say they work SO hard so they deserve to have what they have.

Think of the worst, worst job ever. To me, getting up at the crack of dawn doing breakfasts in a hotel on min wage, or piece work, repetitive and mind-numbingly dull. That is HARD work, not sitting at a desk, in meetings, going home to a comfortable home, despite stresses etc.

Feel lucky for what you have and vote and campaign for a more charitable, caring and fairer attitude.

I am such an idealist, sorry.

Shortsaint I don't feel guilty at all because we've worked incredibly hard and sacrificed much in the interests of our family. My husband had three jobs at one point (one of which was a headteacher). We've scrimped and saved to get a deposit together. Every single penny we have earned. We've given plenty back, pay our taxes, will work until we're at least 70, and both do a minimum 60 hours a week. My husband's probably nearer 75 hours a week.
Why should we not enjoy our wealth?

I certainly agree a lot of those who are not well off work hard. My cleaner comes before or after her other job so 7.15am or 7.15pm (although I do work longer hours than she does).

Recent studies showed UK income inequality was about a ration of 1:12 but when you add in very high taxes paid by the better off and housing benefits and tax credits for the less well off it came down to a much more reasonable 1 : 4 which I think is fine and not out of line with differences between people's life choices, luck and all the other factors. The well off have never in British history paid a higher proportion and amount of UK tax revenues ever even in the days when our top rate of income tax in the 1970s reached 99%.

I do feel a lot of what I do helps others. I do a lot of stuff for nothing. I give money away. I pay huge amounts of tax as I've already said on this thread so at least half of all the work I do every day of the year (and yes I work just about 365 days a year - even on holiday I do an hour or two) goes to the state in direct tax. Of the other half a lot goes in other taxes like VAT.

I don't feel guilty. I feel lucky to be able to help others through what I earn and actually a lot of people say I am a role model. Someone who is black above mentions their example - which is great. I feel similarly. I am white but I am a full time working woman who has done fairly well and other women use me as an example, realise you can work full time and be successful whilst also have a nice family and good relationships with your children.

One of the biggest things holding women back in life is guilt. Men never seem to feel this guilt thing other than when they murder someone.

Perhaps we need to consider the psychological issues which push some women perhaps most women into feeling "in the wrong". A woman's place is in the wrong the say. Even look at the Bible - in that garden of Eden they have poor old Eve in the wrong tempting Adam to take that apple. Why shoudl women be the cause of all problems? Why not let men take on some of this guilt?

One of the reasons I have done well and am happy is I don't go around feeling guilty all the time.

I'm just suffused with joy and relief that I never have to live through poverty again

You shouldn't make such rigid statements. You can never predict the future.

Anyone interested in wealth and money in the UK should have a look at this survey the FT mentioned today

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/personalandhouseholdfinances/incomeandwealth/compendium/wealthingreatbritainwave4/2012to2014/chapter2totalwealthwealthingreatbritain2012to2014

It's very long but full of useful facts about who has wealth etc and in an unbiased unpolitical way so interesting to both left and right.

My dh has spent two years working flat out six days a week, missing out on dds, building a buisness to bring £80k a year in.

My Nan basically did the same bringing three lads up with two jobs for pennies

Hardest, tiring job I did was being a waitress in a very busy bar resultant.

Dh dad is a grafter - 59 and lugging furniture around all day and night for M&S and gets paid peanuts for what he does

A lot of wealth is down to circumstances an luck.

I think it is sometimes forgotten that a lot of wealth results from deferring gratification. Giving up years of life to studying while your peers are having a more relaxed life.

I lived with a medic for a while. She spent her nights off studying. She didn't have much spare cash. I was a graduate in a good job and bought clothes and went out. But since we were both about 28 her earnings steadily outpaced mine. She deserved it, she worked harder and gave up a lot.

I don't feel guilty as such, no. I earn £80k as does DH.

What gets me is the lack of empathy and understanding. So you have people on high wages who:

a) fail to appreciate just how much they earn compared to most of the country
b) think that it is the fault of those who are "poor" for earning less
c) think that it was just solely down to them for doing well and therefore feeds (b)

We are all human. We have different personalities and drivers and experiences, but having money doesn't make you better than someone else.

So for me, I give money to charity and am generous. I also teach my dcs that they need to work hard and that they're not "normal", that actually we have a lot of money and we should be damn grateful because it could be different. As they get older, I'll have them volunteer so they can meet first hand people who aren't like them.

I also read widely to understand more about our economy, about social policies and the impact on the majority of the population.

So I don't feel guilty. But I feel angry and ashamed at our country. We have a prime minister who thinks foodbanks are used for "complex" reasons, a welfare system which works from the assumption that the poor are lazy workshy feckers.

We get greedy, lazy workshy people at all sections of society.