to shout/scream at DS(10) that he's a "spoilt, horrible brat" twice in last 24 hours

[Tablelegtiger]

Ok, I know IABU. Its not good parenting and a horrible thing to do and i now feel really awful but just don't know what to do with him. I pulled his hair in anger and frustration yesterday. What do you do when you love a DC very much but you are starting to hate the way they behave? His behaviour is making me feel v angry of late (and DH), too much to go through here but just being a horrible kid really. Lying, being really ungrateful for everything we do for him, being sarcastic and cheeky, doing sweet FA to contribute to household helping etc. I was expecting some of this at 17 but not 10. We've tried rewards for good behaviour, incentives etc. Its really making me feel down and a shit parent and I can't bear the thought that this is the start of a downhill relationship with him and the lovely little boy we had is slipping away. We have another younger DC who is witnessing this too and often suffers consequences (eg being made late for school due to morning 'episodes' with his brother).

Ok he is 10 years old and you are expecting him to contribute to the household?

You are pulling his hair?

seriously? I think you need to have a good long hard think about yourself rather than your child, not all 10 year olds will do stuff around the house, you need to start thinking about things like, if you do the pots you will earn so much pocket money, if you do the polishing you will earn so much, bribery gets you far! pulling hair gets you nowhere!

Oh, also the little boy you had is slipping away :( that is a given, regardless of your or his behavior. You will both need to adjust to the push/pull dynamics that happen as they become teenagers and that means getting a handle on how you communicate now is really important.

I have two boys, 11 going on 15 and 9 going on sometimes 13, sometimes bloody 4. They're ungrateful, take things as given, lie, bicker, moan about helping in the house, can be shockingly disrespectful (shockingly to me, knowing what my mother would have done to me had I spoken like that to her). They infuriate me on a regular basis.* But I have never, ever raised a hand to them, much less pulled their hair I think you do need people reflecting back to you just now abnormal that is.

*They can also be, and regularly are, helpful - immensely so -, polite, mature, kind, truthful and funny. What about your ds? I'm sure he can be those things too.

The PP who says your ds reflects your behaviour back to you is spot on. When I raise my voice, my 9yo raises his higher. It doesn't mean I never shout - goodness me no - but it acts as a useful mirror. Your son is communicating.

Have you tried...being as calm as possible and actually thinking through punishments and following through? I don't mean punishments such as hairpulling (?!) but...if he is particularly attached to a console/ipod/etc, take it away for a day. If he likes playing out with friends, try grounding If the behavior continues, increase it each time.

Though honestly, unless theres more going on than what you have wrote, it doesn't sound like awful behaviour from him tbh, more...normal behaviour for that age. Though frustrating.

Get yourself to relate with your son. They deal very well with situations like this and it's not too expensive (anyway what price on sorting this?)

Yes, we all get angry, but we are adults and cannot ever succumb to physical violence to others let alone a child (and in front of a younger one too). If you were unfortunate enough to be divorcing you could well lose your DC over this behaviour. I know you don't want us all piling in to say how shocking it is but what did you expect? Flowers and a "there, there dear"?

that this is the start of a downhill relationship with him and the lovely little boy we had is slipping away

He's a tween that's why, and soon gonna become a teenager. They do change a hell of a lot. I've got four and three of them are a teenage gang against me and they steamrolled the boundaries down years ago

I won't patronize you by saying you're the adult, deal with it. Sometimes when they don't want to listen it makes no difference who you are

Thank you for the helpful suggestions. I will read through these a few times and certainly do some of them. Yes - there are other stresses in the family at the moment as there is a lot going on and tiredness in all of us.

Op isn't abusive she just lost her shit and came here asking for help. I hate the culture of paying kids to do stuff round the house. Extra bits like washing the car maybe but I expect my 9yo dd to make her bed and empty the dishwasher every weekday and no I don't pay her, we are a family and it's about team work. That said she doesn't go without. I'm not everyone's servant/slave.
Sounds like ds is starting to move from little ds to a more independent one but finding his feet by testing you. Can you give him more freedom in a controlled way so he feels like you're treating him more grown up?

I always feel sorry for kids who need to be "grateful" to their parents for everything.

He is yours, in nature and nurture, and if he is spoiled he has been spoiled by you.

Just leave him be a bit more, do you think you maybe have unrealistic expectations?

Hmm. Your apology to him:

• was about you (you were crying)
• was general ('it's wrong to hurt people')

Not 'I am so sorry to have done this to you. I love you and I want to make it better'.

And we have all made sacrifices for our dc. It's strange that that crops up in this context. Is there resentment there?

I very much doubt you have went from normal loving parenting to hair pulling overnight. If you respond to the behaviour challenges your child gives you with shouting, anger and losing control that's coming right back at you.

If your dh is the same way your ds had no positive role model to follow so he too will get angry and shout.

You need to be calm and consistent. With clear calm consequences, not violent reactions.

A parenting course such as 'family links' will help you to learn how to communicate effectively with your little boy. Either the school or a children's centre should be able to signpost you to these depending on your youngest child's age.
I agree with a previous poster who suggested that you sit down as a family and agree on a set of rules for ALL of you. Alongside a set of consequences for these rules being broken.
I would also think of a way to implement some kind of family reward system that builds towards days out or shared experiences. You need these to rebuild your relationship.
I would imagine that your little ones will be relieved at having these boundaries in place. He must feel quite afraid that his family is spiralling out of control. Children thrive on consistency and it sounds like you don't have much of this at the moment.
It needs to be done quickly. Before the damage is beyond repair and before he is big enough to really start hurting you back. It won't be long before the only bit of control that you have over him is through his choice because he actually respects you, rather that because you can impose anything on him.

Hi OP, ok, so it was a shit thing to do, but reading your messages you realise that.
So, moving on to strategies to help, if you feel yourself getting cross take a time out, it's not just kids that need them! I have often told my kids (11 & 6), I'm too angry to deal with you right now, I need some time to calm down. (I have found myself being rougher with my kids than I like/want at times)
Do seek help with your emotions, even reading stuff online, getting books from the library etc can help, and as a few people have said you are your kids first example. When I calm down generally, they get better too. Realising your own behaviour is out of control is a great first step!
As for your DS, stick to very clear guidelines/ schedules/expectations. Write down a list of daily expected chores for instance, follow through with consequences, and they will realise you are serious. DD still has massive strops, but less about tidying her room for instance as she knows exactly what I expect from her, so it's not a surprise, and she can't get away with saying she doesn't know what I mean - it's been in the schedule on the fridge for a few weeks now!
You WILL get through this, I did.

Apart from the obvious (which has been almost every poster's reaction), can you get some counselling? I think you should move heaven and earth to do so. Abuse is not acceptable. And it must be breaking your heart that you've lost it to such an extent that you've harmed your child.

Meanwhile, sit your boy down and apologize to him. Explain that your reaction was unacceptable.

I am not going to repeat what everyone else has said but do agree. I have a 10 year old DS.

I am not sure exactly how your DS is behaving however. If he is tantruming send him to his room until he has calmed..There is no point talking about his behaviour when he is not listening. But also you need to model how to respond to it.

You say you make sacrifices.. then stop while he is not helping. I needed to make a phone call to help my DS on the weekend ( one he desperately wanted me to make) so I said we will get the jobs done and then I will make the phone call if we get time..He helped with effort.

Go and put the rubbish out before I take you to cubs.

I am not sure though what the issue is that leads to that level of anger from your side. So assuming he is a typical 10 year old. Make things fun. We get ready in a morning, sometimes he gets a list to tick, sometimes we do world records and time him, sometimes. Can you get dressed before i..

I do think you do need to look at parenting course. This will help you come up with strategies that will not ruin your relationship with him and help him grow up with a decent Self esteem..What is your DH response?

Do you and your DH have a volatile relationship? Do your DC witness you or your partner shouting or hitting at other times?

Have you ever hit or pushed your son before? Or was this a one off?

Has you DH ever hit your DC?

I had my hair pulled by a parent when I was a child. I remember it 40 odd years later. I became scared of her, would do anything to avoid being alone near her. I'm not saying I didn't deserve punishing for whatever I'd done, but I think our relationship might have been a bit better if she'd found another method of punishment. And if, between the punishments, she'd spent time with me, given me love and understood me. I was an inconvenience to her, of that I'm sure.
So all I can suggest from my Point of view is spending time with your DS. Not with the rest of the family, Not in front of the tv, but take an interest in him. Your relationship sounds damaged, so this might take time and effort.

Then... if possible change things to be less stressful (although appreciate many things will be out of your control). But if you are dashing around people pleasing, being in the PTA, etc cut those things. Or cut back on non-essential housework or (mumsnet classic) hire a cleaner. Seriously look in detail at if there are any areas of your life you can simplify, and look at what the stress points are and see if there are ways of reducing these stress points. It is hard since most stress points happen at those crunch points where you have external time pressure (you mention getting ready for school) but if it is possible to get extra help - e.g. Your partner sorts 1child whilst you do the other than do that. Otherwise accept that you may get angry and shout, but stick to short, factual shouting "shoes now" "shoes" "shoes" and walk away if it gets too much.

Would also like to know the same as It'sout

I think many are massively overreacting. Assuming you weren't actually dragging him around the field by his hair then whilst not right is probably not uncommon and not a huge deal. Plenty of parents have used physical control of their children in anger or frustration. You don't need to see your GP, to have counselling or anything else. You need to forgive yourself and move on. The child will forgive you without a second thought unless it's made into a big song and dance. A simple apology for hair pull and explanation of how frustrated his behaviour makes you feel should do.

I think your heading in the right direction recognising things are getting out of control and seeking help. Its not too late. Maybe looking at your own childhood may help. Did your parents lose control at times? I say that because my Mum had real anger issues. I was a total cow at times when i was growing up but she would just snap and lose control. Tbh as well as totally losing respect for her i also have struggled with anger issues in my life. I now have DC of my own and boy have they pushed my buttons at times but I've read loads on parenting and sought help such as CBT because i could never face losing their respect and tarnishing our relationship the way my Mum did. It helps that my dh had a great childhood and is very laid back.
Can you talk to your dh and sort out some strategies together if he pushes your buttons again ( just walk out the room and give your self some space if you feel your losing it.)
As already suggested a parenting course may help. My friend did one and it really helped her communicate more effectively with her kids.
Something else i would suggest is find a good time to sit down calmly with you DS and apologise for pulling his hair. Explain adults make mistakes too and you are going to work at controlling your anger as it was totally out of order and you really want to improve your relationship with him ( or something like that!) He's just a child and whether he shows it or not looks to you for guidance.
I hope things improve for you both.

If you can speak to your GP or even the DCs school, you will hopefully be able to access some family support to help you work out strategies to deal with your own issues, reactions, and find better ways to communicate with your DCs.

You need support, and it's out there, I'm sure you want to change and do the best by your DCs; asking for help is just the first step.

Even if it means going to the bathroom, sitting quietly for two minutes and then returning to the fray, cal,ear.

You need to self refer to SS and get some help. That behaviour is abusive and awful. I hope he has somebody at school tomorrow he can trust to confide in so that safeguarding measures are triggered.

I never get why parents expect their children to be grateful that they have looked after them or why they have children if they feel so resentful if how it changes their life etc. Children don't ask to be born.