To leave the Labour Party?

[guidanceplease]

I'm one of the 40k I voted against corbyn desperate to salvage a party that might at least be decent opposition but he's making sure there is no effective opposition so I'm in arrears on my membership. I no longer feel I can identify with the party or its views.

It's a shame we don't have a woman in line for leadership

I am not a huge fan of Jess Phillips but I think she will be good in some areas of the cabinet but as leader no she is also a little too fond of sound bites but hasn't been in parliament long and certainly improved in her media appearances

well, given her lack of pricipal on TG issues, I can't see her being of much use to the Women's Movement, though it's clearly what she's positioning herself for.

I love the though of Jess Phillips being coached for the media - 'no, Jess, don't tell Dianne Abbott to fuck off in the House of Commons' and 'no, don't say on Question Time that you want to stay in the EU because your brother lives in France' etc etc

Makes you mourn Jo Cox even more.

absolutely. There are great MPs out there, my local one among them, Thangham Debonnaire, but it's the fuckwits who snag in your brain

The point Jeremy is making is that these conflicts are ended through peaceful, political dialogue. We have to sit across tables with those we oppose and reach agreements. That is his stance on MidEast conflicts, not that succour should be given to any malicious group, but that peace is brought through diplomacy.

I am not sure how the Spectator got that turned around so badly.

Think her telling Dianne Abbotts to fuck off is the height of intelligence and good sense.

I know it's hugely depressing. But the only way you can change something is to be in it. Hang on in there. There are still some people left who feel exactly the same as you, and the only way we can stop it being unelectable - is to get it back. But I spend most of my time trying to convince myself why I shouldn't leave a party that just doesn't speak to me any more.

I don't understand, Make - the Massie piece uses plenty of facts to back up his point that JC did not engage in peaceful, political dialogue with all sides. Are you disputing them?

Good God Emily thornbury is a prize prat.

I'm staying put to try to rescue the party from what Corbyn has made it. If everyone who wants Labour to actually get back into power leaves, there will be no viable opposition for a generation at least. None of the other parties can fill the gap from this starting point. So please don't all leave; we have a job to do.

I find myself increasingly angry with those people who joined or became £3 members (now that was a bloody stupid idea) to vote for Corbyn, realised how crap he was and left. If you come in and fuck up my party, I at least expect you to stick around and help clear up the mess.

I don't understand, Make - the Massie piece uses plenty of facts to back up his point that JC did not engage in peaceful, political dialogue with all sides.

"There is no room for doubt about this and no place for after-the-fact reinterpretations of Corbyn’s ‘role’ in the Irish peace process."

It worries me that Massie is doing just what he says we shouldn't do - spinning the past.

I do know this, peace was brought. It was brought through political negotiation. It has lasted, and I don' think anyone wants to go back to the 70s again.

Yes, am staying to help pick up the pieces when this nightmare is finally over. Long term member from left of the Party and really can't see where else I'd go.

Jess Phillips has certainly calmed her performances down since she first became an MP

Yes, Make - but which of Massie's facts are you saying are not true? Or which of his conclusions do not follow if you accept the facts? JC's opposition to the Agreement, the Labour Briefing stuff (the quote about the Iron lady being particularly horrifying) and so on, all quite well substantiated and he has never denied them AFAIK (indeed JM tried to explainin a particularly pitiful QT appearance early on)?

Oh and as for who else is there to lead; I honestly think almost anyone would have a better chance than JC of holding on to a few seats at the next GE. Yes, even the dreaded Blairites like Yvette Cooper. Honestly think we'd still be in the EU if she'd been elected Party leader.

I agree 20nil. She would have appeared with DC, and the sight of all three party leaders saying Remain together...well who knows?

the Labour Briefing stuff

Did Jeremy sign that personally? And the Thatcher stuff too?

Because here Massie writes:

"Corbyn organised the magazine’s mailing-list and was a regular speaker at its events."

Why is attributing these things to Jeremy?

^Dan Jarvis
Keir Starmer^

Hmm. Remind me when they stood for the leadership?

Honestly think we'd still be in the EU if she'd been elected Party leader.

What nonsense.

Because he was on the ed board and a contributor - he has never denied that.

i am done with them (specifically 'him')
he is useless, I am so glad he found time to pay tribute to a murderer yesterday.#priorities

i am only staying in to vote him out.If a GE was called tomorrow, I couldn't vote Labour I don't think- despite never voting anything else for nigh on 30 years and being a member since I was old enough to join. These are not my people.

I'm another to think that, if Labour was led by anybody but JC, we would still be in the EU.

Jeremy only engages with one side of these political dialogues

You can guarantee it will not be the side of the UK or the US governments

And how has he reached out to Israeli parties excatly and how are they expected to sit around a table with his friends when they want to annihilate Israel

And neither Dan Jarvis or Keir Starmer have challenged Corbyn for leadership yet both are far more competent than him and would be far more popular with voters as both are intelligent and articulate but the left infiltration of the party membership would vote for the idiot with dodgy connections to lead the party

It's just a matter of time and that is running out and I do believe it will be sometime this year