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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to let DD go topless in the swimming pool

217 replies

Morphene · 17/03/2017 23:27

Going swimming on Sunday and I suspect DD will want to wear just the shorts of her shorts and top swimming outfit....she asked to take the top off last time we went swimming but we were in a place with slides so I could justify keeping it on. This week there won't be slides so I've got to decide what to do.

DD is 5 yo so absolutely no reason she shouldn't go topless (not that there is ever really a sound reason women shouldn't go topless if they want to), and I don't want to send any body shame ideas her way. I am worried that someone else will tell her she should wear a top though. Either a lifeguard or an interfering busy body, and it will be worse coming from them than me.

So should I bury my morals and tell her to wear the top / make some excuse up etc. or let her go without and run the risk someone else body shames her more transparently than I will?

Do you think anyone will say anything?

She has long hair so people will likely pick her as a girl.

OP posts:
Original poster
Morphene · 17/03/2017 23:51

She doesn't have any convictions, other than that she should be allowed to do what other kids are allowed to do and that girls can do the same things as boys.

There is a lot of power behind the message that girls aren't allowed to do what boys are allowed to do, and to be fair not a one of us really has the strength of independence to fight that and we are adults.

NB. Unless you wear no make up, don't shave your pits and do actual go topless in the places that men do, in which case maybe you really have successfully rejected societies 'rules'

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Italiangreyhound · 17/03/2017 23:53

Morphine "Of course telling a child to hide their body is body shaming."

You've clearly made your mind up and would like others to agree with you, which is fine.

There is nothing shameful about our bodies, at all, but we do cover them. I can't be bothered to argue, please let your dd do whatever you want her to do.

Original poster
Morphene · 17/03/2017 23:53

So on balance we think it is unlikely anyone will comment, so I should let her get on with it, if she asks to?

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Original poster
Morphene · 17/03/2017 23:55

My minds not made up on the question at hand.

It is made up on the idea that girls having to make sure they cover their chests and that their knickers are never seen etc. when boys don't have to is both sexist and body shaming.

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brasty · 17/03/2017 23:56

A 5 year old does not need a top.

Italiangreyhound · 17/03/2017 23:57

Mum "Maybe if our culture didn't view women's chests as something shameful" Our culture does not view this at all, it only views this if a baby is attached to a nipple. It vies boobs as public property. I can't see freedom to expose our boobs is really liberty that sticks it to the patriarchy. Quite the opposite. A five year old girl has no boobs, but actually their torsos can be quite different to boys already.

It's totally fine for a five year old to go topless, but the OP was asking for opinions, I'e given mine.

OP do as you see fit. Thanks

Original poster
Morphene · 18/03/2017 00:00

People saying it is okay - have you actually done this?

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brasty · 18/03/2017 00:01

Yes I have let 5 year old girls in my care go topless.

VestalVirgin · 18/03/2017 00:01

I was told by girls my age that I should wear a top when I was maybe 7. I didn't give a shit.
That is, I was utterly shocked that those girls thought it necessary to cover up their perfectly flat chests.

I would suggest telling her to tell interfering adults that she identifies as boy. That should shut them right up.
But I suppose one shouldn't tell an impressionable 5 year old such things, she might actually get confused.

brasty · 18/03/2017 00:03

And some men have bigger boobs than I have.

Italiangreyhound · 18/03/2017 00:04

PS Morphine sorry if I assumed you had made up your mind, it was just coming across that way but I could be wrong! I have been wrong before! Night night. Thanks

Italiangreyhound · 18/03/2017 00:04

Yes, brasty some men do have bigger boobs than me too!!!

VestalVirgin · 18/03/2017 00:04

I can't see freedom to expose our boobs is really liberty that sticks it to the patriarchy.

I don't go topless out of sheer spite. Men in patriarchy don't deserve to see my breasts.

I will, however, go topless when I am old and wrinkly enough that 90% of men will find the sight disgusting. Grin

And would let a 5 year old girl go topless. Yes, some dirty pedophiles could ogle her, but they'd also ogle boys, so ...

coconuttella · 18/03/2017 00:04

so I should let her get on with it, if she asks to?

If she asks to, then I would.... I really can't imagine who would ask a 5 yo girl to cover up her chest at a public pool. If you don't, you're denying your daughter freedom to do something simply on the (very) off-chance some oddball passes a comment.... don't give this imaginary person that power!

ohidoliketobebesidethecoast · 18/03/2017 00:05

....and that their knickers are never seen etc. when boys don't have to is both sexist and body shaming
What? Where I've lived, as a child and now, there's been no difference on this - we don't expect kids of either gender to be out in public in their pants. Do you think otherwise?
By your definition of 'body shaming', anyone should be out naked, anywhere, if they feel like it, but in reality, few societies are comfortable with that. I don't think its a problem for a 5 yo not to wear a top, but I think its a bit over sensitive to see wearing clothing as body shaming - its one of many conventions we learn as kids, male or female, to fit into society.

PurpleTraitor · 18/03/2017 00:06

Yes I have done this. I have DDs and I practically have to hold them down to force clothes on them. Communal shower areas in unisex changing area and they're hanging off things naked as the day they were born if you so much as blink.

I have seen it done by others also, although I am willing to admit I didn't directly ask them the age and sex of their child, more considered on balance of probability that the smallish children with longish hair and pants that look like they came from the bit of the shop marked 'girls' were female. They might not have been. My point is there's no way to know!

It is highly likely no one will even notice.

Italiangreyhound · 18/03/2017 00:09

Go Vestal. Biscuit Biscuit (These are boobs not biscuits!)

Perhaps I should add Morphine that my most recent experience of a paddling pool party is of the kids all getting in the water and one six year in swimming suit bottoms with no top who was covering herself up with her arms. I've no idea if she was going in the super large paddling pool in her knickers or had only been provided with bottoms or what. It did just appear she was embarrassed to be only in bottoms. She was about 6.

Maybe, Morphone this is influencing me. But I do not think women's or men's bodies are at all shameful, and the argument that covering them up means we are ashamed of them suggests maybe we should all be nudists.

Original poster
Morphene · 18/03/2017 00:09

That's great to hear purple thanks!

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Original poster
Morphene · 18/03/2017 00:11

italian or cold....we might cover up for that reason too....but yes fundamentally we've all been trained to hide our bits and feel ashamed if people see them in unusual contexts.

You know I have never seen a naked person and thought 'they should be ashamed of themselves'....but I have many times felt ashamed or embarrassed at being seen naked myself.

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Original poster
Morphene · 18/03/2017 00:14

vestal oh god no....but then apparently if you want to dress like a boy at the swimming pool, then probably you are one! Easier to accept someone with a womb is a boy than to accept someone with a womb would go topless while thinking of themselves as a girl eh?

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coconuttella · 18/03/2017 00:14

What? Where I've lived, as a child and now, there's been no difference on this - we don't expect kids of either gender to be out in public in their pants

Though at 5yo, no one gives a crap.... kids tend to be innocent about what they wear or not wear at that age.... that changes over coming years. An 8yo tends to be a lot more sensitive in my experience.

brasty · 18/03/2017 00:17

It makes me sad to even think this is an issue. When I was a kid, no one expect a tiny minority would think twice about this.

Original poster
Morphene · 18/03/2017 00:17

Again...I've never seen a child in their pants and thought 'oh no! that is so shameful and embarrassing'. But I have seen parents stop their girls playing rambunctiously in case people see their knickers.

Happens less to boys because they usually aren't wearing dresses.

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1horatio · 18/03/2017 00:21

I think a 5 yo girls upper body looks like the one of a boy her age.
Is he expected to cover? Why not?

Shouldn't we treat equal things equally?

people saying it is okay - have you actually done this?

When I was her age? Yes.

But I didn't grow up in the UK, I think I see nudity different than many British people.

She's a child. I see a bikini top as unnecessary.

Original poster
Morphene · 18/03/2017 00:21

Right - it would appear I am classically over thinking this.

I will follow DD's lead and come up with a some sort of defusing reply for anyone commenting in our direction.

Night night all.

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