Ok - another trans thead

[Bambambini]

This is more about logic and free speech than simply Trans issues. A catholic group paid to advertise their message on a bus that Girls have vulvas and boys have penises. Seems it was a reaction to a similar ad promoting that girls have penises and boys have vulvas. Aibu to be concerned that logic and free speech is under attack? Why was one claim allowed and another censored? This seems to be a sign of the times and I'm getting worried. Who is choosing which ideas, agendas are allowed and promoted?

In some people there is a mixture of female and male sexual characteristics.

No: everyone is an egg producer or a sperm producer, even if not all the equipment works - apart from the 2 in a thousand with a sex chromosome abnormality, who are inter-sex and not trans.

There are tiny additional numbers (about 2 in 10,000) people with hormone abnormalities that affect how their genitalia look, but they still have either XX or XY chromosomes.

Arguing that sex is a spectrum is like wearing a post--it on your forehead saying, "I don't understand biology".

I a bit baffled as to what point youre trying to make

They are trying to argue that all/many of us are a little bit female, a little bit male and therefore trans people are just like us, only more so. It is a ridiculous argument that exposes their ignorance and also an unethical one as intersex people have repeatedly asked TAs to using them to "prove" arguments about trans.

But aren't intersex people a mixture of male and female. Male and female. A binary sex system.

Can an intersex person change their chromosomes? Can anyone?

Gender dysphoria is a disgust over your genitals. If ignoring those genitals and adopting the costume of people who have different genitals helps them, then that's great. They shouldn't be discriminated against if they are wearing clothes that helps alleviate a dysphoric problem.

But I have no fucking idea how we have gone from that to stating that you can choose your biology, everyone has to agree or shut the fuck up, and by the way, I am going to determine what my chosen biology means to everybody, and not you, who is born with it. Even though of course, we are exactly the same, except when I want us to be different.

My brain has some male DNA in it because I've been pregnant with sons. (Seriously: this is a thing).

I'm an XX female but there are bits of Y-chromosome DNA incorporated in cells throughout my body, including in my brain. There could well even be some fully XY cells dotted throughout my body. This microchimerism comes about because because pregnancy makes permanent changes to women's bodies at a genetic and cellular level.

Am I special or unique in any way because of it? Nope. Any woman who has been pregnant with a male fetus will be the same.

Does it make me any less female? Nope. Does it make me intersex? Nope. Does it make me trans? Nope.

I do think it undermines transactivists' appropriation of intersex conditions, though.

The link that prawn gave was very interesting.

'Trans' Terms

Intersexuality is not the same as a transsexuality (gender dysphoria) and is not a transgender state. Neither of the latter terms is one that we recognise as belonging in any general discussion of intersex. We are not happy with the recent tendency of some trans groups/people to promote transgender as an umbrella term to encompass, for example, transsexuality, transvestitism and intersex. We object to other organisations/individuals putting us in categories without consulting us, especially categories that imply that interexed people, of necessity, have gender identity issues.

Further in the link under 'announcements' is a page detailing the dubious and persistent tactics of GIRES to co-opt intersex conditions under the umbrella of trans. The organisation understood that GIRES wanted to claim that a trans people had an intersexed 'brain'. They even suggested they collaborate with a BBC Horizon programme. The organisation turned it down quite vehemently, contacted Horizon and said they thought that some of the information they were being given was wrong. Horizon said that they had also been thinking that.

www.aissg.org/15_ANNOUNCE.HTM#14%20May%202000

The 32 known sexes...

Source, please?

Gender isnt the same as sex

Those images don't mention sex, only gender.

So at best its 32 known genders. But actually its just 32 made up words that mean nothing.

Intersex is such a time waster in these discussions that I suggest every time someone tries to derail a thread discussing trans issues by dragging in intersex we just point out that they're COINing and ignore them. Co-opting intersex is a diversionary tactic and works very well, but only if you allow yourself to be side tracked.

Thanks for quoting from my link Datun. I should have done so myself rather than expect people to plough through it, which you bothered to do.

It's boloxology at it's best (that's a technical term )

I have the wrong glasses on, and read 'demiboy' as 'donkey'.

Oops.

This will get deleted I'm sure, but sums it up quite neatly.

Yeah bev

The bottom three especially

Apparently there are 'as many genders as there are people alive today, in fact there are more because some people have more than one gender'
I think that was from everyday feminism but I can't remember. That's the level of bullshit that we're dealing with now 😱

everydayfeminism.com/2017/02/what-it-means-to-be-multigender/

Speaking of Pokémon, I read an interesting piece recently (which of course I now can't find) on the influence of manga on the trans culture.

Don't cave into your DM, OP. She is putting herself before your DC: why should they miss out on a family holiday just so she doesn't have to feel uncomfortable? Anyone who asks you to do that is not acting in your family's best interests. And it's pointless anyway as your relationship with your cousin is already fucked.

Whoops - wrong thread

*Apparently there are 'as many genders as there are people alive today, in fact there are more because some people have more than one gender'
I think that was from everyday feminism but I can't remember. That's the level of bullshit that we're dealing with now *

I believe this is actually true tbh. Because 'gender' (with its current meaning) is nothing more than a personality. So yes, there are as many of them as there are people :)

I believe this is actually true tbh. Because 'gender' (with its current meaning) is nothing more than a personality. So yes, there are as many of them as there are people

Yes, in a way. But the problem is that they haven't just changed the meaning of gender to mean personality, they are also conflating it with sex.

Personality determines whether a child wants to play with dolls or with cars, wear sparkly dresses or play football ... or all of this.

It has nothing at all to do with the locker rooms and loos someone should use, though. But the transwacktivists want us to believe that. And apparently, they don't fully believe this sparkly gender nonsense, either, or those new sparklegenders would fit as well into the men's spaces as in the women's spaces - but no, miraculously, somehow, any time a male identifies as a new shiny sparklegender, he must be admitted into women's spaces.

I have mentioned it before, it is unbelievable how many contradicting beliefs transwacktivists ask us to take as gospel truths all at the same time.