To think you shouldn't ask parents to deal with school issues

[Wonderingwoe]

My little girl hasn't been invited to a few parties recently and whilst she was upset we just distracted her and got on with our weekends
I did wonder if it was because of her being a lot more boisterous than the other girls but maybe not quite fitting in with the boys either so not finding a group as yet ( only reception ) but I've had a few messages these evening from two mums who I've known a while as both their children went to the school pre school like my daughter, one I'm closer too than the other but on friendly terms with both although I don't do any of the school runs so tend to see them at the parties she is invited to, church and in the parks etc.
Anyhoo, messages both read that last week my daughter hurt both their children in the playground 😳
One she pushed over apparently for no reason at all ( mum I'm not that close too ) and the other she tagged hard playing tag causing her to fall over.
They've asked me to speak to her before they speak to the teacher.
Husband thinks they are a pair of bitches and whatever I say to her tomorrow morning will be forgotten by lunchtime so don't even bother and let them go to the teacher.
I'm really embarrassed, I haven't replied as yet

So yes, you're right... the only person using the "b" word is me, but these are posts about a 4 year old, and I don't think they're very nice.

You don't think it's very nice for a parent to talk to their 4-year-old about her behaviour? Okay then.

Actually the third on was me too. If a child is playing in a way that hurts others, is it right to just say "oh, they're boisterous, it's their personality" and forget about it? I don't think it's doing the child any favours to not deal with it.

Both these women have known you for a while. They are approaching you because they know you and think you will stop your DD from doing whatever she is doing at school without getting the teacher involved. I think they consider you a friend so are trying to get this taken care of without involving the school.

Text them back that you will talk to the teacher yourself and ask her to keep an eye open at playtime, and that you will talk to your DD about not knowing her own strength and pushing children over as a result. Your DH is right, a 5 year old will forget about the talk by lunchtime, that is why the teacher needs to know.

If these women are always talking about other people behind their backs then I would start pulling away from them anyway. You don't want to be associated with that. At least this will give you an excuse as they will just put it down to you feeling awkward about the whole situation.

You are not unreasonable to tell the other parents you will speak to the school about what happened. That's all you need to say at this point.

This whole 'what happens at school' crap is deeply unreasonable, though. She is your child. If she doesn't know how to behave at school that is definitely your problem.

Most posters haven't suggested clipping any wings. The op has said there have been issues with rough play before. This isn't coming totally out of the blue. Reinforcing that you need to be considerate with other children can't seriously be a bad thing?

Exactly.

Granny, you're the only one who's using emotive language like 'throwing a child under the bus'. In the politest way, calm down!

IMiss I know. I've read the thread.

How on earth is this sort of comment not very nice?

Can I suggest that if you're "always talking to her about playing roughly" that this strategy isn't working?

I think where I'm REALLY at is that I think the OP is trying to be honest and not drip feed, so she's saying the situation but admitting her kid is boisterous. Because if she'd done this thread saying "these 2 mums have texted my about my 4 yr old" and then later said "oh, and my kid boisterous" she'd have got kicked. But everyone's focussing on "boisterous" and saying "well then, it's your kid". It might be her kid.

I have a big, big thing in RL where I try to be honest and say "i'm to blame here too, because I did this [xxx] "and people around me are saying "well then, it's both of you, isn't it" and (to me) it isn't. I'm trying to be honest and state things how they really are, and the other person in my situation is just playing a victim and saying 'poor me'. Sorry for derailing. This thread isn't about my crap!

For those saying about the time of the text being iffy. Can I just suggest we're all talking on Mumsnet at 1am whilst the sensible ones have gone to bed already?

I agree it's a bit off to text the child's parents.

Is impulse control still an issue reception age?

Not being goady I just remember DD1 getting a few knocks and putting it down to the children still being quite little.

I do agree with Pixie to some extent about not texting back, I only suggested that somewhat "breezy" response because, school is a marathon and not a sprint, you all have to se each other every day in th playground and I thought that it may be easier for the OP to try and keep things amicable - with the msg saying the OP is sure the teacher will sort it, I thought it could subtly point out that they should go through the teacher.

Although Christ the police being called and arguments and notices to parents would be a nightmare. This is why parents should leave it to the teachers. But there's a chance, seeing as though they're all in reception that they could be the best of friends by Y2 ... Hmm not sure now, maybe don't text back then?

@Imiss I think I'm the only one that's brought up my own previous experience with my ds so far, and I stand by that as a good example of 2 otherwise lovely children not dealing with a specific situation very well. Which is what I'm almost sure is happening with op's child. I don't think that's redirected the thread and I think the majority of PP have given very practical advice. There have been a couple of harsher ones but one PP (@purple) rescinded hers when she realised she hadn't noted that the child was in reception.

Absolutely trifle but if the child was having lots of issues at school I would expect the teacher to be speaking to the op about it rather than her having to rely on third hand info via some 4yos and their parents.
General chats about being gentle are always good with boisterous kids (or at least chats about finding friends who enjoy the same kind of play she does - and rightly or wrongly she will probably have more joy with the boys ime) but I wouldn't punish a child of any age on the say so of another child without at least getting my own child and the schools version of events first.
Just because she has been boisterous in the past that doesn't mean that these events have happened exactly as described.

That's why I got my DCs out of that school as fast as I could Rocking . It turned into a full on Jeremy Kyle showdown every morning watching some of the parents kick off over the most stupidest of things. That's why I told OP not to text back. Dont give it chance to escalate. My poor DD is now in counselling because of what happened to her but I don't want to hijack the thread with our story anyway.

The OP has pre school relationships with both parents. If you know someone why wouldn't you approach them? The OP said that the other mums had just asked her to talk to her dd which doesn't seem terribly unreasonable really. Perhaps the other children said things to their parents at some point over the weekend, the mums happened to talk to each other and were concerned because there were two incidents.

I do agree that children are unreliable narrators, but school playgrounds are not supervised that closely so you could have incidents occurring which aren't picked up, especially one which sound pretty innocent really - misjudging physical play can't be that unusual in this age group.

I don't think that rough play is generally a good idea especially in a busy playground so I don't see why it's a big deal to ask the dd to be a little more careful. It's not asking her to suddenly be demure, just to be aware that not everyone likes to play in a boisterous way and to be a little more aware of her surroundings.

Oops, have just seen that there are a couple of pp telling us their experiences. I really don't think any of them have derailed the thread though, in fact I think sharing their experiences maybe gives a bigger picture to the op?

Last year DD was in the equivalent of reception (we live in the US so it's called preK4) and a girl from DDs class came to me in the park and asked me to ask DD to please stop hitting, pinching and kicking her. I was mortified.

On the Monday morning I had a stern word with the teacher who, after 5mins, admitted that DD had indeed been doing this. I was furious and saw the director of the program and told her what had happened. The director was furious, more so than I and called the teacher in, and agreed on an action plan that morning. They had qualified staff in the office who acted as 1-1s during outdoor playtime.

I know the girls mother well. We never spoke to each other about it beyond me telling her I had given the school a rollicking and to let me know if it happens again.

AwaywiththePixies27 Have seen similar. Small community, smaller minds and big mouths. I too, ran screaming for the hills with the biters tucked under my arms at the earliest opportunity.

oh, and it's lunchtime here just you up at all hours

If a friend's child had done something that my child alleged had hurt them I would feel quite torn between going to the school or speaking to the parent personally.

I might text the parent to say what had happened because to me the idea of just going direct to school would seem like I was ignoring the fact we (the parents) were friends.

In terms of the timing I do think texting so late is a bit strange but I also know that sometimes kids reveal things at odd times. The fact it happened last week, do you know if the children spoke to their mum when it happened or maybe revealed it over the weekend?

Also, you say "on friendly terms with both" which makes me wonder why you seem to be feeling rather 'adversarial' to these mums.

It may well be that the kids are lying or exaggerating, or it may not.

But if you know these mums and are friendly with them, then I do feel the natural thing would be to assume their intention is just for the best for all the kids involved. This may be wrong but I would start out with this assumption.

I hate to state the obvious to some posters but there's a difference between hurting someone accidentally and hurting someone intentionally....

OP if your daughter has a tendency to play rough then you need to gently reinforce that she has to be gentle at school etc.

She's a young child, it's not the end of the world - You just need to continue to teach her right from wrong. If the other girls aren't boisterous themselves then it was likely a shock to them and they misinterpreted an unintentional situation and the parents have reacted to it.

Let's be honest though small children have a habit of telling tales, often embellishing and exaggerating the story; I highly doubt that either child had any real harm done to them but I would advise that you A) Remind your little girl to play "nicely" and B) Approach the teacher to see exactly what issues there are (if any).

As for the parents, well the fact that both contacted you more or less at the same time would indicate to me that they had been talking about it between themselves (possibly with bitchy intent) but to be truthful I would send back a direct but dry reply and leave it at that.

Bloody awful Pixie . Because things can escalate and children can be scapegoated and picked on which then can turn into bullying later; it's important to have a discourse with the school from day one.

OP if you choose to go in and speak with the teacher, you're effectively showing the school that your invested in making sure your child is happy and reaching her potential (socially, emotinlly and academically).

I also think it's about having a presence in school, showing the teacher that you're open and available, obviously all the while, standing in your DD's corner, being her advocate.

If you don't text back and those mums approach you, which may happen

• you could say "I didn't think it was appropriate to text me, I would never discipline DD based on a text from a parent and feel it's for the best if we enable the teachers to manage behaviour in school, I'm sure they will speak with me about DD should they need to".

Unborn I think it's just natural at that age. Establishing their own pecking order so to speak.
It still needs addressing though.

Here's what I've noticed as a parent and have been told by a school. They see scraps/knocks/arguments every day. (Seriously wait until she's older OP. My 10yo hormonal DD could start an argument in an empty phone box with no money). If it's really bad. The school will usually pull you to one side at hometime and say Mr pixie's been a little PITA today. If not. It's never that bad.

OP you mentioned that you don't do pickups, is it possible the staff are telling the childcarer or DH or whoever picks DD up and they're just not relaying that information to you?

If you leave it with the school to deal with OP. The two mums will probably be reminded about not contacting parents to sort childhood disputes out anyway. I don't think they're bitches though. If the roles were reversed what would you have done?

anklebiters

It's up to you to instil in your daughter the appropriate and inappropriate behaviours. It's not up to the school. The school is there to provide an education, not police kids' behaviour.

Though my dd is an adult now, I would have always preferred anyone who knew she was misbehaving to tell me. I don't think it is bitchy at all. In fact I can imagine these two mothers chatting about this problem and deciding that as they consider you a friend the best thing to do was to tell you directly.

I don't think though that being boisterous comes into it. You can be boisterous without pushing or bumping into other people.

GreatScot ?? at four children are learning academically but developing emotionally and socially at the same time, most of what children learn in KS1 is about relationships, working in groups, team-work etc along with learning values such as respect, kindness and tolerance, it's these skills that our LO's learn now which enable them to do well later. Managing behaviour is a massive part of teaching! How could schools simply 'provide an education'? Chalk and talk perhaps? behaviour and learning go hand in hand, it's the basis for the modern day curriculum ....isn't it?