To think you shouldn't ask parents to deal with school issues

[Wonderingwoe]

My little girl hasn't been invited to a few parties recently and whilst she was upset we just distracted her and got on with our weekends
I did wonder if it was because of her being a lot more boisterous than the other girls but maybe not quite fitting in with the boys either so not finding a group as yet ( only reception ) but I've had a few messages these evening from two mums who I've known a while as both their children went to the school pre school like my daughter, one I'm closer too than the other but on friendly terms with both although I don't do any of the school runs so tend to see them at the parties she is invited to, church and in the parks etc.
Anyhoo, messages both read that last week my daughter hurt both their children in the playground 😳
One she pushed over apparently for no reason at all ( mum I'm not that close too ) and the other she tagged hard playing tag causing her to fall over.
They've asked me to speak to her before they speak to the teacher.
Husband thinks they are a pair of bitches and whatever I say to her tomorrow morning will be forgotten by lunchtime so don't even bother and let them go to the teacher.
I'm really embarrassed, I haven't replied as yet

She's in reception, you can't "punish" her by removing screen time or something for an incident you didn't see, has passed ages ago and you don't even know happened!

That wasn't what I said-I've basically said the same as you. Make it clear that playing roughly with other children isn't acceptable. Speak to the teacher and IF it happens again reinforce at home that this absolutely must stop. I missed that the daughter was in reception so possibly as stern "I'm very disappointed" is the way to go rather than screen time.

OP. If the teacher had approached you saying that two parents had came up to them with concerns would you still think the parents were bitchy?

Also, ye gods to all these parents exchanging numbers with other parents! Why? I got through years of a primary school with 500+ enrolled and only three people ever had my number. Same at their new school. One has my number.

The parents shouldn't have contacted you without speaking to the school imo. They are going on the say so of 2 very young kids who may well not be being entirely truthful or at least leaving out some crucial facts.
I would have a chat with your dd tomorrow just saying what you have been told and asking her what happened. If she did push the child over ask her why (very unlikely that it was completely out of the blue) and help her come up with a better way of dealing with whatever the trigger was in future. If your dd says it didn't happen or that she was pushed first for eg then I would make sure the teacher has her version of events as well.
Once you have spoken to your dd you can then text the parents back and let them know what she said and that you have passed it on to the teacher so they can monitor things.
I certainly wouldn't be disciplining your child on the say so of another child for something you haven't seen!

I'm usually (or try to be) quite vanilla in my posts, but STOP!!!!

Ignore every pp except VictoriaMcdade

Stop thinking it's your DD and DEF don't take on board these comments. Be prepared to take them on board, and be prepared to have to speak to your little girl, but dont' do that yet.

Before you do ANYTHING else, talk to the school. They are the ones who might have witnessed something. These other parents (who are clearly talking to each other) can only - unless they are TAs or volunteer helpers or something - can only be going on the witness statements of their kids, who are presumably the same age.

Here's my AIBU by one of those kid's mums... "Hi, my DC is 4/5 yr old, he/she has come home talking about how a child hurt my child in the playground. School did not mention this to me, however my friend also says that her child was hurt by the same child. We have therefore texted that mum to tell her she needs to take her child in hand"

That is ridiculous.

You need to talk to the school. And MAYBE you do need to do some work with your child. But you shouldn't assume that in advance. I seem to be ranting and repeating myself now, but I'm angry by PPs assuming your child is a perpetrator based on rants by parents who are colluding!

I have a ds in reception and he has come home a hand full of time saying he has been hurt her by other children. I do think it's just one of those things with that age group, I didn't mention it to their mums or the school. But I don't think their bitches for letting you know. If a mum told me my son had hurt their child I would be reminding my ds to be gentle with others on the way to school (every day until it sticks, I don't think assuming they will forget by lunch time is a valid reason)

I would reply and say " I am surprised as I didn't know there was an issue with dc being rough at school the teacher hasn't said anything. I will of course speak to dc and reminder to play gently with others. I will also speak to the teacher to see if there is any problems at school"

YABVU. So your child is badly behaved and hurts others but you don't want to deal with it? I think the Mums contacting you before they spoke to the school ,to give you a chance to sort it out, was good of them. I would go to the school and not bother to consult you. Your DH sounds charming.

and also agree with bumsexatthebingo''s post but we cross posted.

I agree the text timing sounds 'iffy'.

Why on earth wouldn't at least one of the parents have phoned you and had a conversation over the weekend if it was such an issue? Half 11 on a Sunday night text messages probably after a few vinos and a session of hard done to us ? Insanity.

I would have a general chat with DD regarding playing nicely with others in the morning though. Remind her that not everyone is big and strong and that even if you hurt someone accidentally they're still hurt and so we all have to be a bit careful with each other-especially in a confined play area.

@imiss I didn't say anything about her child being a perpetrator, but kids aged 4 or 5 who have just started school WILL struggle with tiredness and emotions and with how to deal with brand new situations. My eldest is in reception and was shoved a couple of times in the first few weeks by another little boy. Turned out that my ds has no concept of personal space and had latched onto this other child and wouldn't leave him alone. I had a little talk with him about leaving someone alone if they've asked him to and spoke to the teacher and it was sorted. Even now (6 months in) we regularly talk about being kind and giving people space if they need it. Because he's 4 and does need to be reminded of these things and taught how to deal with things appropriately.

OMG cake you're making a lot of assumptions there. There's no innocence without being proven guilty with you, is there! You're taking the word of 2 x 4yr olds (who are friends) on board and with that "proof" being judge and jury, AND condemning a child AND judging parenting.

You might end up being totally right, but there's NOTHING in this thread that I can see which ensures that you are. The OP's child might be completely wrongly accused, but that doesn't seem to cross your radar at all. So let's all throw a 4 yr old under a bus because of a comment by 2 other 4 yr olds.

Er, I think you might be a little too involved in this ImissGranny.

Vamps I'm not saying that OP's child isn't a perpetrator, nor suggesting she shouldn't effectively parent. But I'm very upset that on the basis of her OP her child is condemned as a bully. Because I'm not seeing any evidence of this.

And, possibly, she needs to have similar conversations with her child, but SURELY she should talk to the school for their perspective before she does so. Why should she necessarily clip her child's wings if the school might turn round and say "she's great"

purple agreed

Why should she necessarily clip her child's wings if the school might turn round and say "she's great"

Most posters haven't suggested clipping any wings. The op has said there have been issues with rough play before. This isn't coming totally out of the blue. Reinforcing that you need to be considerate with other children can't seriously be a bad thing?

Fwiw I agree with you granny. Feel a bit sorry for kids who would be disciplined over some tattle tailing when it hasn't even been confirmed by the teacher that they've done anything wrong. Kids get knocked over in playgrounds all the time - it could have been completely accidental.

IMiss where have people called the OPs DD a Bully?!

I can understand why they may be upset, I can understand them discussing it together but texting you at 11pm on a Sunday evening "giving you a heads up" is senseless. I agree with pp, you can't discipline your child on another's child's say-so. In our school it is considered poor form to contact parents directly re issues between children, I think a parent should always deal directly with the school. As when they get older it just creates more problems of parents are having this kind of dialogue.

Just because you will bump into them at drop-off I would respond to their msg in the morning and say "thanks for letting me know, I'm sure teacher will sort it out but I'll have a chat with my DD when she comes home from school to find out what happened".

When DD comes in from school just ask her, don't accuse her of anything just find out how she's feeling about the friendship groups, if she feels left out/happy at school. If she is being too rough, try and find out why, are the others taunting her, leaving her out, does she feel isolated etc.

Then I would make an appointment with the teacher and tell them about the texts and how your daughter's feeing. Id ask whether they feel your DD is happy, making friends etc and what steps you can make to move forward so that your daughter is getting the best out of her time at school and how you can prevent her getting into trouble/playing more gently.

I do think they shouldn't have texted you but at least you know and you can look out for your DD and her needs, as they are doing no doubt

You know what, purple I think I might identify with that boisterous child!!!!

There was a thread earlier today about MN cliques, which I didn't buy into at all.

But I do have a little bit of an issue when there's a thread where the OP says "this is a little bit of a thing" and then posters come along with their stories (which is one of the beauties of MN, btw) where their stories are a big example of the 'thing' and then all the posters are reacting off the 'big' stories (which are people's experiences) but they're NOT the thread. And I feel this might be happening a bit with this thread. OP says "my DD is boisterous" and then loads of people weigh in with their stories, which might be (for example) "my child got hit on the head with a brick" and then posters after that are responding to 'got hit on the head with a brick' and it goes onto that level. Does that make sense? It's not like I'm overly invested with the OP, but more like I want the thread to be judged on the OP.

Truth of the matter is that the children will be friends and playing nicely long before the parents get over themselves are in 90% of these cases.

Facts;
You weren't there. They weren't there. Four & five year old children are inherently unreliable after the event (pretty bias at the time too in my experience). The school did not approach you on Friday either personally or by note. Your DD is, by your own admission 'boisterous'.

Solution;
Have a gentle chat over the weetabix and leave at that.

I see what you're saying but I'm not sure why you've decided everyone who thinks it's possible the op's dd likely was rough with the girls (since the op has said this has been an issue previously) is out of order for saying so.

Nobody's suggested anything draconian, mainly telling her that rough playing can't carry on and speaking to the teacher to make sure she's being appropriate with the other children.

Wonderingwoe I hope this will all be sorted out. In your shoes I would not assume that the text was bitchy.

"I was always worried she wouldn't fit in and I've been proven right"

i think you are assuming too much, you've talked about her personality and about her behaviour and it seems you see these two things together. i would avoid this. You are not asking her to change her personality. You may, if you feel these other parents have got the right side of what happened, feel you need to encourage her to change some of her bahaviour.

It's totally your call but now you do know what will be spoken about. I would talk to dd and her get side of things, tomorrow before school, if the meeting will be during school day. However, if there is a chance to speak to her after school and then see the teacher, that may be more helpful. I agree springing this on her would be quite difficult at the start of a school day and yes, it is a shame they did not text earlier.

I'd just really encourage her to tell you the truth with no hint of a punishment if the answer is one way or the other, just to get the idea of what happened. I'd be tempted to ask very vague questions so she offers you what happened in her own words.

I may be reading this wrongly but you seem very angry about this and I don't think it is going to help you, or more importantly your dd. She is not going to need to change her personality. She may or may not need to change some of her behaviour.

I really hope it all goes well when it is all sorted and that things will work out well for all the children involved - they are the important ones, not the parents (in this situation), IMHO.

Pixies I'll own the word 'bully' has only been used by me, however, these are posts on this thread:

So you know your daughter is loud and boisterous and has now been physically hurting other children, but you expect the school to sort it out? you're the parent, the one who teaches her right and wrong. you should be teaching her not to hit, shove, to play gently, and to tone down how boisterous she is, you want her to be included not excluded, if she gets a reputation as being nasty, it will stick and parents will tell their children to avoid her.

You're her parents. Of course you should deal with it. I really don't understand this business of expecting the school to do everything (yes, even if it happened at school).

But you can sit her down and talk to her about her behaviour. Why would you not?

Yes, you weren't there but you're not disputing that your daughter hurt these girls. Writing it off as "she's a bit boisterous" is pretty lame.

You need to make it clear that this is totally unacceptable. There need to be consequences such as losing screen time if it happens again

Can I suggest that if you're "always talking to her about playing roughly" that this strategy isn't working?

So yes, you're right... the only person using the "b" word is me, but these are posts about a 4 year old, and I don't think they're very nice.

Just because you will bump into them at drop-off I would respond to their msg in the morning and say "thanks for letting me know, I'm sure teacher will sort it out but I'll have a chat with my DD when she comes home from school to find out what happened".

I wouldn't respond to the message at all. Most schools have a blanket policy of not approaching other parents when there's an issue between the parents. Their last school got so bad for parent arguments and the police being called they started having big fat notices on the windows for parents to behave themselves. I'm sure most of those fights materiliased out of a 'heads up' text too. My DD was severely bullied in the last year she was there. I never went through the ringleaders mum once. Every single account was done through the Teachers. Not saying your DD IS a bully OP. I'm just trying to point out that there isn't necessarily a reason to contact you when you can go through the school. We never did even though ours escalated beyond belief. Dont respond. Leave them to inform teachers, and if there is some truth to it. Talk to your DD about how some may not find her boisterousness as endearing as some others do.

Those last two are mine. The screen time comment I've already said I made when I didn't realise she was in reception. I stand by the fact that if the op is "always talking about playing too roughly" that whatever they're doing to try and stop it isn't working. It wasn't a criticism of the op or her daughter-just that they need to try something else if she's going to learn to play in a way that means she won't hurt people and lose friends.

Whatever the outcome, don't be guilt-tripped into telling your DD that she shouldn't ever be boisterous. Just teach her to channel it in the right direction.

You never know, she could be captain of the England Women's Rugby team in 2032...