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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to ask for this sum of money from DS and his partner?

204 replies

MightyJoeAverage · 27/10/2016 14:18

I'll try to keep this short.

I've agreed that DS and his partner and my DGS can come and live in my house for a while; they're trying to save for a deposit and mortgage and we live in a pricey part of the UK, so it's not easy. They stayed for a month earlier this year and it worked well really given I'm used to living alone and they needed to find a way to establish the routine which works for my DGS who is not two yet. I didn't charge them anything that time, but I've told DS that this time I can't let them stay for free because of the impact on my utility bills etc.

They both work F/T, the other DGP's do a lot of childcare to enable my Dil to go work without sky high childcare costs. I work F/T too and live alone. How much would it be reasonable to ask for as a contribution for their stay in my home? I have a figure in mind but no idea if it's reasonable or not and before I speak to DS I'd like some help please. They would have a double bedroom and DGS will have his own room, all use of everything they need but would be buying and cooking their own food. I still pay a mortgage which is almost £600 pm.

The figure I have thought of is cheaper than rental where we are, so I'd thought of £500 pm for them all. I know that if they stay for longer than 6 weeks I have to notify the LA that I'm no longer eligible for single person discount on my council tax so I'm sort of taking this into account as well as the increased bills due to more use of water, electric, gas and so forth.

I'll shut up now, having failed to keep it short, but I'm happy to answer questions.

TIA.

OP posts:
Original poster
MightyJoeAverage · 27/10/2016 17:07

Thank you for the suggestions.

Actually when DS lived at home (which he did until 2012 and well into his 20s) I was really struggling to pay a HUGE monthly mortgage and bills on the family home which the then DH had left me with for pastures new.

It was a real struggle to get DS to pay any contribution at all at that time. He was pretty unreasonable himself tbh. It wasn't a good time. I guess, depending on which viewpoint you take, I'd either made a rod for my own back by allowing him to live rent/contribution free all that time, OR I'd been helping a family member out. But in the event I had to sell, he had to make a choice and he did a lot of growing up. So neither of them is expecting to live with me for nothing - they could have asked well before now to move back in with me if they were that way inclined because as I've already said they are paying the other set of parents for childcare and for living at their house and are happy to do so.

The other thing is that I love my DC's, all of them. And my DGS. But as a couple of posters have alluded to, it is a massive change when they are here and actually I am the one who is like a lodger. That's because I want to help them out and I recognise their future as a family depends in part on the couple relationship surviving this sort of situation; and to me being able to spread your wings a bit in your own home is important so they do get to live here as they see fit and I don't intrude on that at all unless it seems wanted/needed.

OP posts:
Thisjustinno · 27/10/2016 17:12

£500 a month for a family of 3 seems fair to me.

sykadelic · 27/10/2016 17:21

I agree with the poster that said to ask for the £500 because it's a bargain. If you like, once you know the actual costs you can take their share of that amount out (2/3 of the utilities) and put the rest aside until they move out (for unexpected costs like your tax bill going up) and give it back to them as additional savings.

Then you're being fair and also protecting yourself in the event it turns out it costs you a lot more than you expected.

Inthenick · 27/10/2016 17:21

I would just charge them the amount the bills go up. So what would that be? Certainly a hell of a lot less than £500. Just gas, electricity, oil? Broadband, council tax etc. are fixed costs you would be paying anyway. It sounds like you are going to try and make your costs go down while they stay which is fine if that's what you want but you indicate you wish to help them get on the propertly ladder asap and you making money out of them staying makes that take longer than it otherwise would.

And its offensive to your DIL (and all us mums out here) to say that her parents looking after their DGS enables her to work. It enables your son too.

Original poster
MightyJoeAverage · 27/10/2016 17:26

RTFT inthenick

OP posts:
Selfimproved · 27/10/2016 17:30

£500 à month seems a lot. If you need it, then I guess it's what you have to do.

You've made me very aware of how amazing and giving my own, very poor parents are.

People do what they have to, to get by I guess.

OldBooks · 27/10/2016 17:39

DH and I had a similar arrangement with my parents and we paid them £500 pcm (living in London commuter belt so saving around £1000 pcm on rent). We thought we were covering half of the mortgage and bills but it later came out that we were covering ALL the mortgage AND bills which was a source of some resentment as the whole point was for us to save as much as possible.

ZippyNeedsFeeding · 27/10/2016 17:41

part of the reason they want to come is because I get out of their way so they can have time together as a family.
honestly, this bit concerns me. I've seen this situation before and the parents ended up signing over the house and (very small) mortgage to the child, because they were made to feel so unwelcome in their own home and it became very clear that there was no way short of legal action to make them move out. Also, if someone is doing you this kind of favour, and you want time alone, you go out of the house or to your own room or whatever, you don't expect the owner of the house to make themselves scarce.
I think you are doing a very nice thing but i think you may regret it.

Bertieboo1 · 27/10/2016 17:48

Might it be worth trying to discuss the time frame for their stay so they don't end up staying indefinitely?

itsmine · 27/10/2016 17:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

scaredofthecity · 27/10/2016 17:57

We just did this with my parents, very similar circumstances. We paid 200pm plus paid for the vast majority of our own food.
My dad's view was the more that charged the longer we'd be there saving! We just wanted to make sure they weren't out of pocket.
Definitely have a time frame though, we saved for 6 months, then it was another 2.5 months for the house sale to go through.

Original poster
MightyJoeAverage · 27/10/2016 17:58

It was, the conversation about contribution has been had. The amount has not. My mistake. I will be having that conversation at the weekend when we are all able to meet and plan.

OP posts:
ImperialBlether · 27/10/2016 17:59

OK well I was going to say why don't you charge them for all the fuel and the council tax (plus water if you pay on a meter) so that you get free bills for those months and they don't pay rent.

Then I realised that your son is actually really mean. I've never heard of a son charging his mum for labour when he's doing a job for her. Fair enough to ask her to pay any costs, but unless it's a huge job, charging for labour is tight, in my opinion.

And then of course he didn't contribute when he was younger, even though you were really struggling. That is very, very unfair.

So then you need to consider what he'd charge you in a similar position and it seems like he'd charge a lot! There's no point in being generous to someone's who's tight - they just take advantage.

I'd ask the ILs what they charge. You clearly have to have enough from them to make it worth your while as it's a pain sharing with others when you're used to being on your own.

So I wouldn't just get them to cover bills - there has to be at least £100 per week to make it worthwhile for you, so I'd say £100 per week on top of anything extra they're using in terms of fuel and of course council tax.

YelloDraw · 27/10/2016 18:04

Fair enough to ask her to pay any costs, but unless it's a huge job, charging for labour is tight, in my opinion.

It is isn't! appears the tone has been set.

expatinscotland · 27/10/2016 18:16

'part of the reason they want to come is because I get out of their way so they can have time together as a family.'

Eh? I think you're in for a recipe for disaster here. Your son has form for being dickish, too. You'll end up feeling like an unwanted lodger in your own home. And seriously, how long is this going to take? Homes in expensive areas of the country often involve deposits well into the double digits. Is this the only way? Do you know if they've done a budget to ensure they are already saving all they can. They are already living with her parents, what's the reason they want to leave?

InTheDessert · 27/10/2016 18:17

Well, if your CT is 1200 with a 25% discount, it's going to go up by £400. That's per year, presumably. (1600 full CT, reduced by 25% to 1200 for single occupancy). So maybe £35/ month.

Average gas/electric bill, according to google was 1344 in 2014. So call it 1500. Make it higher for 3 adults in the house. Max another 125/ month in total.

Water is 394 (Google, 2014). So another 35/month total.

500 is starting to sound like it will cover all your bills, and leave you much better off.

InTheDessert · 27/10/2016 18:18

Why are they leaving the in laws house??

expatinscotland · 27/10/2016 18:19

Sounds like they want it all - to be subsidised so they can 'save' and yet have a home of their own. Your son is already in his 30s. What's he been doing to save so far seeing as he's a skilled professional?

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 27/10/2016 18:19

I agree with expat.

That line worries me too.

You shouldn't feel like an extra in your own house.

expatinscotland · 27/10/2016 18:22

They should never expect the homeowner to 'get out of their way' so they can have 'time together as a family'. They want that they rent their own place. Sounds like you have other children, too. Do they own their own homes? Did they need Mum to subsidise them to buy it even in their 30s?

Original poster
MightyJoeAverage · 27/10/2016 18:25

In part because I leave them to it, I don't tell them how to raise their child, in short, I don't interfere unless I'm asked. Mine is a slightly roomier house in that it's not bigger but is of a different age so feels more spacious. And to be frank I'm a fucking cool person to be around. I play my guitar for my DGS and he dances what more can I say.

I am reluctant to say more than that because it could be outing but 4 adults and a toddler in a small space...two adult males who are used to being head of the household......

OP posts:
expatinscotland · 27/10/2016 18:31

'I am reluctant to say more than that because it could be outing but 4 adults and a toddler in a small space...two adult males who are used to being head of the household......'

Yes except your son is not, he's living in someone else's house. Sorry but your son sounds a bit of dick and I've got a bad feeling he'll soon be back to taking the piss out of you.

SantasLittleMonkeyButler · 27/10/2016 18:35

Ah, your latest posts do seem to change the position a bit for me.

Your DS has a history of being a bit of a financial piss-taker when it comes to you & living in your home.

Presumably they'll still be paying DIL's parents for childcare, so it would be interesting to know how the money they currently pay will be split. I'd probably start the conversation by asking how much they were thinking of contributing & then taking it from there.

I still think the actual cost to you of having them there is the fairest price. Also, the more they save, the quicker you get your home back Wink. You're a kinder woman than me though OP. Whilst I would be more than happy to put any of my DCs and their families up in the same circumstances, I would not be making myself scarce for them. It would still be my home first and foremost.

toptoe · 27/10/2016 18:36
  1. Find out how much they need to save
  2. Think realistically how long you want them to live with you
  3. Work out how much they'd have to save each month. Work out what their income is per month. This will give you an idea on how much spare they have to give you.

What you don't want is them feeling you are profiting from them being there. But you don't want to feel they are profiting from being there and overstaying their welcome.

So it will probably end up being a compromise. He'll say '200pm' you'll say '500pm' and probably end up somewhere near 350pm. Or something like that.

Original poster
MightyJoeAverage · 27/10/2016 18:38

They have been saving, but she has had mat leave and then struggled to find work. They have saved a fair bit actually, but not enough yet and so far the banks aren't lending well to the SE (yet AFAIK). I anticipate that they will back and forth between the two sets of parents until they have enough to put down on a place of their own. I'm fine with that. But I believe they should contribute to living in my home whether we call it rent, bill money, whatever.

Yes other DC's have their own rented places. I didn't subsidise the other two, they didn't need it (beyond me doing the odd thing to help them out).

Yep, he was a selfish arse. Felt entitled to an easy time until I gave him the "move out and find out what you can get for less than what I'm asking you for" and in the end he had to move out. That was a much better education than any lecture about the cost of living that I could have given him. So now he knows and he works really hard.

And for those who insist on telling me that I would be making money out of this - I have already said I will be finding out what they pay the other parents and take it from there. DS and partner can make their choice then to stay where they are or come to me, can't they?

OP posts: