AIBU to expect my 13yo not to steal from me?

[Icantthinkofanothername]

(Have name changed obv)
He takes EVERYTHING. As in, there's some cash on the side in the kitchen - change from fish and chips yesterday - and he took a pound coin (brought it to me after his sister told him I had noticed it was gone). DH & I have a drawer in the kitchen with 'our' snacks in - nuts, dried fruit, chocolates - and a couple of weeks ago he took the chocolate bar that was in there - 150g dairy milk that was for me for a week, and he scoffed the whole thing. He took an unopened pack of (10) caramel rocky bars last weekend, ate the lot - wrappers all under his pillow. I got two tubs of roses (am I showing my age if I say I preferred the tins) because they were on a good offer at tesco, put them away in the cupboard for christmas time (it takes 2 tubs to fill up the 3 kids advent calendars). Spotted only one was there the next day, asked DH if he'd put it somewhere else, but no. Got 13yo son into kitchen, asked if he'd taken it, and he admitted it. Brought leftovers downstairs, and there was literally ten chocolates left. He'd eaten the rest (in less than a day).
We've always been really clear that we need them to tell the truth, as otherwise there is a consequence for what they did (eg taking chocs) and another for lying about it.
I know 13yo's have massive hormonal surges and impulse control issues and struggling to work themselves out, but this is just getting ridiculous. His weight and teeth are fine, he walks to and from school five days a week which is just over 2.5 miles each day, eats maybe 3 or 4 slices of toast for breakfast, then a bacon roll when he gets to school, school hot dinner, 2 apples when he gets home, and tea might be pasta, or soup with bread, or veg stew or something like that, along with another piece of fruit. I get that he's growing like a weed but can always have fruit or toast for a snack if he's hungry, so I can't see it's just hunger, but have pretty much run out of patience! It's not even like it's only food he takes - long story but we had a lot of cash in the house a few weeks ago and know that he took at least £100.
Are all teens like this and I need to get my head round it? I hate having to think twice about what I should do with a handful of change because I worry that if I leave it somewhere he might see it then he'll take it! Do your teens do this? What should I do???

I wonder if family therapy might help? I suspect this is simply a symptom and you need some help to get to the bottom of what is driving this behaviour.
I know some children steal from parents because they feel unloved. But here it might have more to do with his eating habits. Either way I don't think you can solve this issue until you understand why it is happening.

Hadn't considered the demand avoidance side Kleinzeit, will have to keep it in mind - might reduce the stress/anxiety all round!
I'm glad were not the only family that still plays games with the kids - they love games where we (the adults) have to draw things for them to guess or act things out - everyone ends up looking like a prat, but that's part of the fun.
Playing Uno with his dad was an example of something he might choose to do - it's not about playing the game, it's about the opportunity for a relaxed chat without eye contact if he wants to talk about something difficult, when he has some undivided attention.
We also watch TV (their choices) and films with them, go swimming together, take the dogs out and go out for the day. Also picnics in the garden, days at the seaside and trips to local attractions.
Both he and his younger sibling attended a once a month 'Sibs' club, which was all kids with a disabled sibling. They went bowling, cinema, making pizza etc, opportunities to chat informally with others in similar situations, but funding was cut and it no longer runs. They're both identified as 'sibling carers' at school, but as far as I can see this is purely a stats thing, with no extra support or opportunities to talk to anyone. He's been on a waiting list for a supportive group thing via siblings social worker, but he's been on that list for just over two years.
BTW, 'identified' at school simply means it's on their school record, so confidential - not that they have to wear a special badge or anything!

InSpace time limits on tablet vary - in the week it's an hour or two dependant on what else is going on - for example if it's the day he has an after school club then scouts it's an hour, as there's so much else that needs to be done. On the weekend it's as long as they want, as long as the other necessary stuff - homework, putting away washing etc - gets done.

Brasty Family therapy might help, but I just don't know how we could access it. We live in an area where CAMHS has a ridiculously long waiting list, and as nothing is happening which would make us a priority - for example he's not running away or in trouble with police or self harming - I'm not even sure they'd put us on a waiting list. We all know preventative stuff - stepping in before those behaviours start - is better than trying to 'fix' thing after they've broken, but funding for services doesn't always operate like that.

I would count Minecraft, yes! And the Xbox etc all sound good too.It's partly a matter of finding out from your DS what he thinks the must-haves are and/or starting to give him the freedom to get them himself. It sounds as if you're well on the way.

As a teen I stole money from wherever I could It is honestly a part of my life I feel nothing but shame about looking back. I don't even really know WHY I did it really. I have pieced some stuff together that kin d of makes sense to me but I have no idea if its true or not.

When I was very young..maybe 10 or so, my best friend stole 20 quid from her uncles wallet at a family BBQ that I was attending with her. he obviously found out and she freaked out and convinced me to hide the money (in my knickers ). There was utter hell on, resulting in her parent strip searching the children (including me). The money was never found as luckily this search did not involve removing knickers. I know now looking back that this was very wrong of her parents..

Anyway. As young kids we then panicked that someone would notice we had 'loads of' money. I was going out that day with my parents to a place that had amusements. My friend advised me to purposely lose the money in the slots. I have absolutely no idea looking back why on earth we didn't just stick it in a charity box or something if she didn't want to admit to her parents, but I guess..child logic? So, I tried for ages to lose this twenty quid. I ended up winning over a hundred. The first lie I ever told my mother was that day and I remember it so well. She asked how the hell I had so much money from the 1 pounds worth of ten pences she had given me. I just said I had been very lucky with it. Which was kind of true, but she never knew I had the extra 20. So...it turned out my mother changed all of the pounds I had won for me and stuck it into a savings account for me, letting me keep a fiver. At this stage I didn't dare tell my friend that I hadn't managed to dispose of the evidence so I lied to her too and said everything had gone as planned. It was never spoken of again.

However, off the back of this I developed a gambling addiction, which still haunts me to this day though it is under control now and has been for 10 years now. I also discovered how easy it was for me to lie and be believed. I suspect this one experience shaped a lot of my teenage years and how horrible I was back then. I stole from family, I blatantly lied to their faces, I blamed my sister without any remorse at all if she got punished. And so on. I was disgusting in all honesty.

I have no idea why I just went into all of that when my post was pretty much meant to be a version of..please speak to him about it as there may be underlying problems causing him to do this. Such as there was with me. It is not 'normal' teen behavior to steal constantly. A one off I would write off probably, but not recurring. I considered what I was doing no big deal and pretty normal. I now know it was not.

What a shame the funding was cut for the sibling club. That sounds like such a great outlet for children to meet and interact with others in similar situations.

I am trying to think of a way to phrase this that will express my thoughts without offending you. To some extent we all have to play the hand we're dealt. In your son's case that means having a severely disabled sibling and the stresses that accompany that fact of his life. He has perhaps had to grow up more quickly than other boys of his age for that reason. If you factor in the bullying he has experienced, as well as the social isolation, I wonder whether he is (unconsciously) seeking out areas in his life that he can control. Rebelling against house rules (taking forbidden food) may be a safe way to try this out. So I wonder whether giving him more control, rather than cracking down with additional punishments, might be an approach to try. I like the idea of a monthly allowance that would give him more independence in terms of spending. Although not specifically connected to the household treats (though of course he may use his money to gorge on sweet treats), simply having a bit more control and independence might relieve some of the pressure he is feeling.

But above all, I think he is trying to tell you something through this behaviour, something he may well be unable to express in words. Taking £100 from you is really very worrying, much more so than scoffing some chocolates, and the fact that he used the money to buy things for other boys indicates that he is really struggling in the social sphere. All behaviour is communication, as they say. I agree with a PP that family counselling or individual counselling for your son might be well worth investigating.

WankingMonkey That sounds awful - strip searching children 😦. I guess that shows the difference between the way children/teens and adults think - your panic as a child when as an adult you can easily a way (the charity box bit I mean). I wonder if your friend knew a strip search might be coming?
Thank you for sharing, and I'm glad you have what sounds like a very firm handle on your issues with gambling.
I agree about the monthly allowance Dot, and how to shift responsibility for some of his stuff to him by using that.

Definitely not normal here, and we have a 12 & 13 year old. They know their snacks are in their tuck box, and if they want something else they know to ask.

Money never goes missing (your DS took £100??? WTAF????) and if they are given money to pick up something for me, I always get the spare change.

I wonder if your friend knew a strip search might be coming?

Indeed, I have wondered this since that day and it haunts me a little to think that this kind of thing may have been...normal for her? I knew it was wrong at the time but never told my parents as they would have gone absolutely wild and probably banned me from seeing her anymore. Nothing happened or anything, but now I have kids myself I can see even less how on earth the adults thought that was ok to do?!

Auser are you saying that teenagers ca NOT socialise well if they don't have the latest technology, a smartphone, a tablet, Xbox and whatnot?

A really serious question. We've always been very ow tech in our house. I relented to buy an Xbox last year. Dc1 doesn't have a tablet (his died of old age) but he bought himself a smartphone big enough that he can happily use it as if it was a tablet. This was bought from b'day money and his pocket money (same than the OP, £10 a month).
Having said all that, at 13yo, he doesn't have any issue with friendship.

I'm just finding that idea quite scary TBH. Smartphone yes I can understand. But a PC, a tablet and an Xbox and ... Really ? :(:(

I would put stealing money on a different level from "stealing" food in his home. Teenagers need A LOT of food, and if he isn't overweight then it seems that he needs the food. If he was eating too much, he'd be fat. Stealing money must lead to a consequence though.

Icant dc1 tends to display that sort of behaviour too. Not that much the 'stealing' as such but the eating etc...
This was an answer to him not feeling well in himself and not settling well into Y7 (not linked with friendship!). Also spending so much time at home on his own when both myself and DH were at work and not back until 6.00pm.
Things have improved a lot since I've rearranged my hours to be more present (I appreciate it's not always possible! I'm particularly lucky there). And I've organised stuff for him to do just after school so he isn't at home too much on his own.

Fwiw, I find it very hard because when that sort of things happen again and again, it destroys confidence.

OP this is s symptom of something else. I could have wrote this about my niece. It escalated to her stealing notes out of her dads wallet, food from my house and then over £100 worth of make up out of my dd1 room, stealing crappy shite out of shop eg bottle of water..

She once ate six people's Easter eggs while they had been hidden and let her dsis take the blame. It was excessive.

While is certainly is classed as your bog standard stealing and it needs to be punished somewhat - the reason behind it needs addressing sadly her parents didn't deal with it effectively by looking at the root cause and she went off the tracks for a bit.

Dniece was 13 at the time too but her stealing had actually been going on around a year maybe longer before it was noticed.

Hope all goes well.

NinaSimone May I ask what your niece's parents did that didn't work? Or what eventually did have an impact?
Yes Mammouth - it's the feeling that I can't trust that is grinding me down I think. He apologises, says he won't do it again etc etc, then does - obviously what I'm doing isn't working and there's been some really useful suggestions/ideas about things to change (inc his diet, I have taken that on board), but it's that I have to think twice about leaving a couple of quid on the kitchen side in our home...😔

I stole some money when a teenager. Friends at school had more money, more fashionable clothes, expensive shoes and make up bought for them. I prob stole because I was sorry for myself, not getting as much as friends did (we were v hard up) though most of the class were like me financewise.
Several posters have posted saying they stole money but don't know why. I think I would concentrate on trying to find out from him what the prob is? He prob doesn't know but it would if he took the time to work it out.

Unbelievable that a PP thought it is odd and old-fashioned to play card games.

DS is 13 and we play all sorts of card games and board games as well. Really great family time. I guess there are some parents who would just prefer their child to be staring at a screen all the time. Glad to see that there are lots of others who still actually interact with their kids.

MammouthTask - I'm with you. DS has a laptop and an ipad. No X-box, no console. But he is a happy, active boy with a busy life and - shocking, I know - it appears all his friends still like him despite his freakishly deprived upbringing.

Re the tech.

The point at which I mentioned those things I had asked repeatedly if the op Ds had tech and she was refusing to answer. I said, repeatedly, that I was assuming he only had the tablet. Which the op said he was allowed an hour a night and was frequently removed as a punishment.

Re the games. Again, it appeared from what the op wrote that all he did was read. No tech. No online chat. I had asked, and was not answered.

AUser I hadn't intentionally 'refused' to answer - I was (for the most part) skipping your responses as it's clear the ways that you and I are bringing up our children differ wildly, and I wasn't finding your comments, including your sorrow on behalf of my deprived son, to be very constructive.
MissMargie We've sat with him and tried to talk it through, but he just seems to get stuck. He's doing whatever, spots the cash, and takes it. We talked about what he would do with it, whether he was worried he'd get caught, whether he'd take it if it was one of his sibs, or a friend, or a teacher - he just can't (or won't?) think about what was going through his head when he reached out his hand and took it.