He shouldn't take the job and be a father instead?

[user1466488499]

We had our first child DS1 7 weeks ago. We're both adjusting to parenthood and the challenges it brings! We both have good London city jobs and are comfortable.
DH has just been offered a new job which is significantly higher in pay than his current one - he didn't apply, he was approached by the firm directly. Problem is the new job will involve lots of international travel and longer working hours in the week and weekends. DH is excited about the job but I would rather he is around to parent our child and be there for him. I will do most of the child raising and DH will only see DS at weekends. This isn't what I intended when we got married and when I got pregnant. I want two parents raising our son not just me. We are comfortable as we are, not loaded, but we are doing fine.
AIBU for being annoyed he is putting his own personal agenda and career ahead of being a dad? How much money is enough? Is it wrong of me to expect my husband to actively participate in being a father and not just do it at weekends? As said above, we both have good steady jobs making good money. I am tearing my hair out and massively annoyed that he now wants to get ahead and go for this job rather than be around for our son...

My DH would be massively resentful if I took this attitude. The world of work being as it is you have to move forward or get dumped. I know this from DH's experience. I'm not a 'handmaiden'

I've always supported DP. He works away during the week and yes, it does cause issues, but we work together to address anything that crops up. It's not what I 'signed up for' either, but life has a funny way of throwing things at you unexpectedly.

I can't imagine ever telling him that he can't take a promotion, whatever the impact to me. Making him stay in a job he's no longer satisfied isn't wise, in my opinion. And Op's DH may be even more dissatisfied if he turns this job down. It's a rock and a hard place but I know what I'd do.

This is not a gender issue.The OP has a vision of life she wants to dictate to her OH.

Of course it's a gender issue! It's overwhelmingly women who defer their career. How many threads have you read where a woman tells how she never really got back on track after mat leave, how she is struggling to find a school hours job. How many women say they can't go back to work because while she was on mat leave, his career took off and "her" earrings wouldn't cover childcare, and on and on.

And again, if this were reversed, and they had both thought they were going into equal parenting, I would say that she wasn't being fair to take the job. I get the impression the "vision of life" was a shared one, until something better came along (for him).

The reality is, that for most people, their careers would move forward fabulously is they had someone at home doing the domestic stuff. My friend, a very briliant senior solicitor (finally) has complained many times that it would be so much easier doing her job, and getting promoted, if she had a wife at home.

Not a gender issue my arse.

And again, she's not "making him"do anything. He has chosen to stay stagnant for 18 years fgs. He does have free will!

I'm with you op.
Dh had a year of working 6 or 7 days a week with 2 jobs while he trained in the one he wanted to switch to. It was awful, really took its toll on me feeling like a lone parent with 3 kids but we both agreed and the second job was his dream one.
I'd rather have him around though than more money, I went through it because I knew the new job would make him happy not because it pays more. Money can't buy time and as iv said to dh a few times when he kept taking on extra work at the new place
"What's the point of money if you're always alone"
He gets 2 days off a week now and is home by 6 most nights, it's bliss compared to the 12 hour shifts he was pulling before

Whether it's a DH or a DW making this suggestion, if either party are unhappy or uneasy or simply don't want that extra responsibility then it will not work.

I'm pregnant with my first and DH and I have built lives and jobs that allow us to earn decent enough money but without the stress of late nights, endless travelling etc....it was only because of this set up that I felt comfortable and confident about having a baby. We are both behind the idea of equal parenting, we're sharing parental leave and both compressing our hours to ensure we have equal time at home with our child. If DH came home and proposed a totally different scenario, damn right I'd be furious.

Yes, of course you can be a good parent and be away every night and most weekends, but if that's not the childhood or the situation you agreed on, then neither of you are being the parent you signed up to be - be that the default one or the mostly absent one.

I think neither you nor your DH are being unreasonable.

This isn't what I intended when we got married and when I got pregnant. I want two parents raising our son not just me

I think this is the problem- you are looking at things entirely from your point of view- what you want, what you planned and how you think things should be. He is doing the same. There doesn't seem to be much partnership or conversation going on.

Obviously, I don't know whether you discussed things like job changes/childcare etc before you had your DC or not, but things do not remain static forever and sometimes both partners need to be open to change.

You can be a good parent and have a job with long working hours. I am a Dr and I know that this means I haven't always been there as much as I would like, but I am still a good parent. I'd be pretty pissed off if someone told me I couldn't work long hours and be a good parent. I think starting any conversation relating to the job with "if you take this job you'll be a terrible father" would be a massive mistake.

You need to sit down and calmly work this through. You need to explain your concerns, e.g. being worried about how you willl manage if left to do the vast majority of the childcare, and that you don't really want to live like that; the impact on you and on your relationship with DH if he is away a lot/working long hours; and also the impact on your career of having to pick up so much of the slack. Then you need to think about your DH. What will this new job mean for him personally and professionally- and what would it mean for him and his career if he turned it down? See if you can come up with strategies that would mitigate the impact on you that are acceptable to you both. Your concerns are completely valid, but there may be options open to you that are an acceptable compromise.

Ultimately, I think if either tries to impose their will on the other (i.e. him taking the job when you aren't on board or you attempting to force him to turn down the job) it will lead to resentment, which is highly likely to cause problems in your marriage.

Of course it's a gender issue! It's overwhelmingly women who defer their career

YY to this. I am mystified how anyone can think, after reading thread after thread on here of women's careers plummeting after children while men's careers soar, that this is not a gender issue.

Yanbu OP. This would definitely impact negatively on your career.

Many people on this thread seem to be assuming that the husband will be home weekends. OP has said this isn't the case.

She said he will only see DS at weekends rather than some weekends but you never can read much from one/two posts

She does mention him working weekends. In any case international travel often means travelling weekends to arrive for work on Monday. It can't always be avoided as there aren't daily flights available to some areas

Just another perspective for you to consider OP. Coming out the other side of the child rearing years, or at least having them in sight, I would say that investing in building a career while DC are very small can pay dividends when they reach school age.

I spent time climbing the career ladder when mine were relatively small. By the time they reach school-age I was in a position where, although I was still working long hours, I was able to be much more flexible. I've worked from home at least one day a week since they started school, I've never missed a sports day or school play or parents evening and was at the school gates often enough to know their friends and their parents.

On top of that, I have frequently been able to work from home during some of the school holidays. Obviously, I did still have to work, but I was able to manage my time around their needs and got spend much more time with them than I would've done if I've been in the office.

Do you think there is a chance that your DH might be able to get himself into a similar position if he invests in his career now? And will you get a similar opportunity?

I want two parents raising our son not just me

Jacks11: I think this is the problem- you are looking at things entirely from your point of view- what you want, what you planned and how you think things should be.

Jesus Jacks11 You are making the Op feel unreasonable and selfish in wanting her to have two parents raising their child and have a supportive father around.
If anything, the OP having given up a year of her career should be the one forging ahead and getting back on an equal footing, not the DP.

I despair of some of the attitudes on mumsnet. No wonder we experience so much inequality, we fucking well perpetrate it ourselves.

bummy

I think you have been more than a little selective in your quote. For instance did you miss the sentence directly following the one you have quoted? The part where I said And he is doing the same? I.e. both OP and her DH are looking at this from their own point of view, neither particularly considering the others perspective and certainly don't seem to have had any constructive discussions about considering ways where both of their wants and needs may be accommodated (which I acknowledge may not be possible- there may be no workable compromise which is mutually acceptable and then they will have to decide where to go from there).

I certainly did not say, or think, that OP should automatically cow-tow to her husband and agree to let him do whatever her wants, regardless of her feelings or that she should sacrifice her career to allow his to flourish.

I do think that either one of them attempting to force their will on the other- either by OPs DH taking the job without OPs agreement or OP trying to force her DH to turn the job down when her would really like to take it- would lead to resentment on one (or both) side(s) and that would not lead to a happy marriage. Therefore, it would be better to try to find a mutually acceptable compromise if at all possible. Perhaps my post was not as clear as I thought.

My exh and I split up and I think a major factor was that he took a job that meant he'd be away for long hours / overnights during the week when we had a young baby. I hadn't wanted him to take it and we didn't need that money. It didn't make him a bad dad - bit it did make him a bad husband in my opinion as I had pnd and needed support at home. I personally think there will always be other opportunities and if money isn't tight having a partner around when children are very young and difficult is more important.

The impression I get from reading your post is that it is what 'I' want, not a joint decision.
Personally, I think he would be foolish to ignore the promotion; forcing him to before you have even had the baby and experienced childcare is a risk.

Try it and see; you may love being with the baby and cope splendidly; he may hate being away and want to be fully involved,, but you should give it a chance.

Have you talked calmly about it with him? Or are you both just having outbursts?
We had a similar issue when I was pregnant where DP was put on a job (his company just transfer people wherever they fancy) a 4 hour drive from us meaning he'd be away M-F and I was terrified of doing it alone. It was a great chance for promotion and I was bitter and shouty. But it turned out he was heartbroken to be going but really worried about how much the baby would cost (even though we're financially stable), and was afraid of saying no and rocking the boat at work... He was away for the first 3 months of DD's life during the week but we Skyped every night and he was the model dad at weekends. As soon as he had the promotion he asked to move nearer home and I actually find it a bit annoying having him in the way of mine and DD's routine now!
Just because it wasn't what you planned doesn't mean he'll be a crap dad.

Reading this thread, I feel like there’s a really big difference at quite a basic level between people who think that the default is that both parents share equal responsibility for looking after their children and equal respect from each other for their careers and people who think that the default is women doing all/most of the childcare and the man’s career coming first. That’s why some people on here seemingly think that the OP wanting 50:50 is somehow her wanting it “her way” and some who see it as an opportunity for her to be a SAHM/go part-time when there is no indication from the OP that she would even want that.

Like the OP, my DH and I have agreed that we are sharing the parental leave for our baby (due in a month!) and then sharing childcare responsibilities after that. I would be furious if he suddenly decided that he didn’t want to do that and, actually, I was going to have to do all of the pickups, drop-offs and he would only be around some weekends. We both agree that that sort of decisions would have to be made jointly and I would say no at this point. If it were a genuinely temporary opportunity, I would consider it. But this isn’t temporary – if it happens, chances are that the DH’s career will take off at the OP’s expense, it is really unlikely that she’ll ever be able to reset the balance at home to 50:50. Lots of women on here are clearly totally happy to take on more of the childcare, have the lesser career, etc, but that’s not for everyone – it’s not for me and it doesn’t sound like it’s for the OP either.

Given that the DH is the one who wants someone else to take on part of his parenting role and go back on what was agreed on, I think it’s frankly bizarre that the OP is being accused of not “supporting” her DH or “dictating” to him.

I think some people are on here think that way but others are just looking at it as one of the pair has an opportunity and would support that and it would work if it were the other way around too. That's the case for me at least.

Thing is - how many women would even think it was an option for their DH to do all of the childcare while they became an occasional weekend mum? Honestly, very few would even raise the question because women don't see family life as optional in that way.

I wouldn't say I'm an occasional or weekend mum, but I'm the main earner in our house and my current role often requires a few days international travel. I also had a different role when dd was 1 which required me to work away 4 days a week quite often.

However before I even considered applying for or accepting these roles I had a serious discussion with DH about how he felt about it. In most cases it's not possible for both parents to have a job like that unless you have massive family support or can afford a nanny so one person taking the international travel job inherently limits the other- they have to be responsible for the child which means either full time care or at min doing all the drops offs, pickups, illnessess, appointments, etc. And that alone can be career limiting and is a big ask.

For us it was ok as dh was part time initially then moved in to childcare as a job so it was compatible but at one stage he fancied doing teacher training and was also approached about an interesting job. Both would have been 50 miles away and so neither was feasible. My career limits his. That is a big ask and it's not fair of op's DH to just drop it on her when it was never in their plan.

Exactly. The DH is from the sound of things proposing a job which limits the OP's career opportunities. She needs to be 100% on board with that or it's not on.

My DH was recently offered a job with a huge pay hike. Great. But the amount of travel involved would have meant I'd have had to go very part time which would be career suicide (and knocks out the financial benefit anyway). He turned it down. We both have career goals: his don't take priority over mine unless we both agree.

Maybe the extra cash could pay for childcare, relief days on mat leave and ft care when she returns to work but then I'm guessing for op that might not what she wants as DC wouldn't have much time with either of them? Not sure

BIL was a stay at home dad, just going back to work now DD is starting school.